Mark Rober 对谈 TED：CrunchLabs STEM 科学课程的缘起与动手教育理念

Hello, TED members. I am Whitney Pennington Rogers. I'm a curator here at TED and I am so excited to be here with you today for this live member event.

All right. Now, I want to think for a moment about your favorite teacher. Maybe some of you are students right now and you don't have to pull back into the far reaches of your memory like I do, but I want you to think about this person and the things that made them so special. how excited they might have made you feel, how they made the subject they were teaching you come alive and made you want to lean in during their lessons and not zone out. I think for a lot of us, teachers like this maybe feel like the exception instead of the rule.

And when it comes to science, maybe even more so. But what if that didn't have to be the case? What if science could be the class that kids cannot wait to get to because it makes them laugh and beg to try everything out there for themselves? Our guest today has spent a lot of time trying to make science lessons just like that. He's a former NASA engineer, a YouTube phenom with tens of millions of subscribers and is undoubtedly one of the most beloved science communicators of our time. There is no question about this.

Earlier this year, he took the TED stage at our flagship conference to share his boldest project yet, a $60 million bet on the next generation of problem solvers and a new STEM curriculum designed to make science the class kids actually want to be in. That talk has since become one of our most viewed talks of 2026 so far. and he's here today to share more with us about that project, the philosophy behind what he does, and break down how he sparks excitement about science again and again for kids of all ages all over the world. Please give a warm welcome to Mark Robber.

Hello. How's everyone doing?

Hey Mark, how's it going?

Good.

Good. Thanks so much for being here with us today. The big reveal in your talk was the public announcement of your free STEM science curriculum for for kids ages I guess grades three through eight class crunch labs. Um and you talk a lot about that in the talk and that's a big a big thing that you you put forward. What what led you to create it?

I mean and to be fair like I don't talk about the talk's maybe like 14 minutes. I talk about it for like two minutes, but the whole point of the talk is to lead up to that in the sense that like peeling back the curtain on how we hide the vegetables and make learning science fun because if there's any subject in school that should be fun, heaven forbid it should be science. It's like [snorts] so it's like we kind of peel back the car on how we do it and it's like okay now that you understand how the sausage is made this is the this is the kind of sausage we will be making for the next five years.

Um, and so, and so like the the impetus for this came actually when my one of my buddies, his his kid came into the room and she was she she was like in probably 8th grade at the time. Like, what are you learning in science? I'm just curious, right? Because I do this on my channel. And she's like, "Oh, we just watched a Bill Nye video today." She showed me a worksheet that been copied probably 10,000 times. You know, each time you copy, there's like an artifact that comes along.

Yeah.

And I was like, and I love Bill, like he's a personal friend, but it's also those videos were made in the 90s, and this is a generation that has grown up on TikTok and YouTube, and there's like different tricks to, you know, reach their brains in engaging ways. And I'm just like, man, we we should we should do something like that for this generation because I know, you know, I've had to earn 18 billion views because on in YouTube, you could click on anything else, right? So, it's like you kind of get trained by the algorithm on how to make things engaging. And that was the start of it.

And I one of my superpowers, I think, is naive optimism where it's like it seems really easy when I have an idea. I'm like, "Oh, yeah, we could do that. Sure." [laughter] That's that shouldn't be a problem. It's been so much harder, but like I'm always continuously naively optimistic that's like, "Ah, that'll be fine." So, it's been a complete journey. It's it's evolved to be way more than I was initially planning on doing, but it's so clear that this is the right way to do it. This is the right approach. It needs to be done, and we're the right people to do it. So, we're just going full steam ahead.

I love that. And and you you said that it's uh you think it's the most important thing you'll ever do. And I remember watching you give the talk and you got a little emotional as you were sharing this. And if you can remember back to being on the stage, what what were you thinking about in that moment when you got really choked up?

Um I don't know. Like I I really do have such a soft spot in my heart for teachers. Like if I just teach him about teachers even like right now a little bit like I get a little emotional. It's like like teach it's so tough especially today to be a teacher

just because of a lot of factors and it's kind of the most important job in on the planet and so and they're not compensated as well as they like we should be ashamed I think I said that like we should be ashamed of like the support teachers actually get um for the importance of what they do and um yeah I don't know I just I've always had a soft spot in my heart for the underdog and for the especially an underdog who really really really really deserves it.

And so if I'm in a position to help them out then it just feels like you know what is life but working hard at work worth doing and like this feels like the most worthwhile work and like you know the most impact that I can you know have and affect change in like the most positive way cuz it's just no one's done anything like this. And then when we're ready to release it too, you know, a lot of times with edte and things, adoption is so hard, but like we're already teachers already show my videos in 40% of classrooms, but it's jello pools and squirrel obstacle courses and glitter bombs. It's not necessarily totally aligned with the curriculum.

So, all right, let's take all those tricks, make something that is totally aligned, exceeds all the state science standards. Um, and and and and then put it out there. And then I'll just tell, you know, I could tap a mic and get 50 million people to listen. So I'll just say, hey, if you know, tell your teacher, you want to watch this and you want you want to do this for your class curriculum and I'll sell that directly to the teachers and we'll have a map of the whole United States in every single school district and we're going to have three teacher and three parent volunteers in every single district. So like we we're going to roll this out in a way that like no one's ever been able to or done. And then we'll also go, you know, properly through the states for bottoms down, top up.

Um, we're just gonna get this out there and and not because it's like I have skin in the game, but like we're making sure it's five times better than anything else. Like we're independent folks are like running actual like curriculum studies and versus control in a classroom. So I don't want to waste my time or my money or anyone else's money and time if this isn't way better. like that's the hypothesis. So, we're just going to tweak it until it is way better and just get this goodness out in the world for free.

I know a lot of folks, especially some of our younger members who are watching, are really interested to hear more about you and your journey. And so, I'd love to talk a little bit about that. Um, I think most people who follow you know that you have this background as an engineer at NASA and Apple and and that before you started doing the work that you do, when would you say that your love of science began?

I mean like from a from an early age I think I just had a you know I think if anyone here has more than one child I know kids come pre-programmed and I just had an inclination towards kind of math and science and the physical

you

know

taking

apart

the

remote

control

um

also

just

like

coming

up

with

cool

ideas

like

the

first

job

I

ever

wanted

to

do

was

be

a

an

architect

but

specifically

designing

McDonald's

play

places.

So,

I

remember

I

my

like

white

sheet

of

paper

and

my

pencil

and

my

rule

and

I'm

like,

"Okay,

you're

going

to

start

here

and

the

ball

pit's

going

to

be

here.

There's

going

to

be

these

tubes."

Like,

I

got

all

these

cool

designs,

which

is

kind

of

full

circle

moment

because

now

we

have

Crunch

Labs,

which

is

like

our

headquarters,

which

is

like

a

Willy

Wonka

factory

for

engineering

that

has

secret

passageways

and

foam

pits

and,

you

know,

pistons

and

pianos

that

play

themselves

and

and

staircases.

It's

an

infinite

slinky

staircase

in

a

robot

you

can

play

rock

paper

scissors

against

that

you

can

never

beat.

So

it's

like

that

actually

my

first

job

I

wanted

I

eventually

got

just

in

the

very

secure

securest

route.

so

yeah,

and

then

and

then

I

think

specifically

when

I

took

high

school

physics,

I

was

just

like,

"Oh,

this

feels

very

good

that

like

I

can

predict

the

world

around

me

with

math

and

equations

and

there's

one

right

answer

and

it

doesn't

matter

where

I

grew

up

or

what

language

I

speak,

you

know,

if

I

drop

this

rock

off

the

building,

like

we

will

all

come

up

with

the

same

answer."

And

then

not

just

that,

you

can

literally

predict

the

future.

You

can

build

something

that

you

can

send

to

Mars

that

having

never

gone

there,

it's

like,

well,

we

have

the

equations.

It

should

actually

hit

the

planet

if

we

launch

at

this

point

when

it's,

you

know,

90

m

million

miles

away.

If

we

launch

at

this

velocity,

at

this

trajectory,

like

eventually

those

two

should

hit

and

then

we

could

get

from

the

upper

atmosphere

25,000

miles

an

hour

down

to

a

comfortable

six

miles

an

hour

to

land

in

seven

minutes.

It's

like

you

can

predict

all

of

these

things

and

that

it's

like

a

crystal

ball

that

actually

works

and

that

is

very

appealing

to

me.

a

lot

of

folks

who

have

shared

some

questions

about

your

your

story

or

your

journey

uh

are

just

curious

about

engineering

specifically

like

how

did

you

know

that

that

was

the

path

when

you

think

about

all

the

things

you

could

be

in

the

STEM

world

that

this

was

where

you

wanted

to

to

go?

Yeah,

I

think

specifically

mechanical

engineering

really

appealed

to

me

versus

like

electrical

because

I

like

to

be

able

to

see

and

create

and

build

something

physical

I

can

touch.

Um

because

there's

a

lot

of

different

engineering.

Um

and

I

don't

know,

it's

just

one

of

those

things

like

the

more

I

I

I

got

into

it,

the

more

I

was

like,

"Oh,

I

like

this."

And

then

straight

out

of

school,

I

got

a

job.

I

just

got

really

lucky

to

work

at

NASA.

you

know,

my

resume

was

just

in

a

pile

of

résumés.

Right

place

at

the

right

time.

and

I

think

that

what's

the

saying?

Something

like

fortune

is

what

happened

when

preparation

meets

luck

or

something.

And

certainly

I

got

a

little

lucky.

And

yeah,

and

then

I

was

at

NASA

for

a

decade.

Seven

of

those

were

working

on

the

Mars

Curiosity

Rover.

So

my

hardware

is

there

on

Mars.

I

think

currently

it's

120

million

miles

away.

You

can

see

it

in

the

night

sky.

the

little

red

dot

and

I

know

that

like

I

touched

and

designed

and

built

and

tested

and

integrated

something

that's

on

that

specific

dot

in

the

sky

um

is

really

cool.

Another

actually

another

really

cool

thing

about

Mars

is

really

fun

there's

not

really

a

lot

of

oxygen

so

things

don't

break

down

and

like

rust

basically.

So

long

after

us

humans

are

gone

and

all

of

our

structures

and

everything

has

crumbled

away

and

nature

has

just

taken

over

everything

in

a

million

years,

aliens

will

come

and

they'll

see

these

rovers

on

Mars

and

just

be

like,

"What

the

heck?

Where

did

these

come

from?"

Like

what?

I

don't

get

it.

You've

like

built

these

things

that

will

out

outlast

and

outlive

you

and

and

probably

all

of

us

on

this

call

in

some

way.

of

us

and

everything

we've

built

like

you

know what

I

mean?

like

in

a

million

years

they'll

still

be

there

and

every

single

structure

on

Earth

is

crumbled

away

into

dust.

it's

like

pretty

wild.

know,

you

liken

what

you

do

to

sort

of

like

hiding

the

vegetables,

right?

Like

you're

essentially

wrapping

like

important

hard

to

swallow

things

in

glitter

and

things

like

that.

Um

and

you

do

it

using

like

humor

and

spectacle

and

um

you

know,

now

you're

offering

the

blueprint

for

people

to

to

do

this

themselves.

And

I'm

I'm

sure

there

are a

lot

of

teachers

though

who

watch

and

think,

you

know,

well,

but

I'm

I'm

not

Mark

Robber

and

I

can't

do

it

the

way

that

you

do

it.

So,

like

what

would

you

say

to

people

who

feel

like

they

don't

have

the

the

personality,

I

guess,

to

pull

some

of

this

off?

I

would

say

I

mean,

and

this

is

like

the

point

in

the

TED

talk

was

like

the

trick

to

make

a

video

go

viral.

The

trick

to

sort

of

like

remembering,

this

is

kind

of

like

how

I

framed

it,

is

like

you

just

have

to

feel

something

in

your

heart.

Like

if

you

want

to

reach

someone's

brain,

you

have

to

enter

through

the

heart.

You

can't

you

can't

start

here.

is

why,

you

know,

if

you're

trying

to

convince

someone

out

of

like

a

being

a

conspiracy

theorist

or

something,

someone

who

believes

the

earth

is

flat,

you

can't

go

to

them

with

a

list

of

facts

and

like

try

and

reach

their

brain

of

why

it's

not

flat.

Like

you

can't

reason

someone

out

of

a

position

they

didn't

reason

themselves

into.

Like

the

reason

they

got

into

that

is

they

had

a

friend

and

like

it

was

a

community

and

they're

feeling

they're

getting

something

here

that

feels

really

worthwhile

and

so

you

got

to

start

here.

And

for

me

that

is

in

the

TED

talk.

Blow

up

this

trash

can

full

of

ping

pong

balls,

right?

Or

it's

someone

stole

a

package

from

my

house

and

everyone

knows

that

feeling.

So,

I,

you

know,

engineered

a

glitter

bomb

with

fart

spray

to

get

them

back

that

records

them

on

four

phones

and

uploads

it

to

the

cloud.

Like,

you

have

to

evoke

some

kind

of

visceral

reaction

for

people

to

remember

it,

for

people

to

care,

to

affect

change.

And

so,

I

think

that's

step

one.

even

in

the

talk

I

did

this

like

in

a

meta

I

don't

know

how

many

people

even

picked

up

on

this

but

at

the

end

when

I

was

like

talking

about

class

crunch

labs

and

you

know

I

said

like

so

to

all

those

teachers

out

there

in

the

trenches

like

I

want

you

to

know

reinforcements

are

on

the

way

like

when

I

got

to

that

punchline

like

I

was

very

adamant

that

Ted

let

me

like

play

music

not

just

in

the

video

but

in

the

auditorium

because

it's

like

this

is

me

demonstrating

my

point

of

how

you

hide

the

vegetables

of

how

you

get

people

to

remember

of

how

you

have

impact

is

like

you

have

to

feel

something

here

and

music

helps

with

that.

so,

you

know,

if

if

if

you're

a

teacher

out

there

and

you're

feeling

like

you're

not

like

reaching

the

kids,

like

start

here,

not

here,

you're

not

it's

not

like

if

you

just

used

a

slight

different

word

to

explain

it,

you

know,

then

it's

going

to

work.

like

they

don't

they

don't

care

what

you

know

until

they

know

that

you

care

and

that

it

it

kind

of

speaks

to

that

and

so

I

think

if

you

if

you

start

them

knowing

that

you

care

even

if

it's

just

like

in

your

level

of

effort

and

like

paying

attention

to

them

like

you

will

you

will

I

think

you'll

find

it's

easier

to

reach

them

here

and

that

this

this

is

the

beauty

of

class

crunch

labs

too

is

like

I

do

realize

that

you

know

people

have

different

skill

sets

and

abilities

right

and

for

whatever

reason

the

way

we

teach

science,

we

have

solved

a

lot

of

that

motivation

gap,

which

is

like

90%

of

the

challenge

of

teaching.

And

so

it's

like,

let's

team

up.

Like

I

can't

do

this

on

my

own.

You

can't

just

play

a

video

in

a

class

and

expect

it

to

actually

teach

them

like,

but

let's

team

up.

So

that's

the

whole

point

of

class

crunch

labs

is

I

kick

it

off

with

a

video

and

then

the

teacher

takes

it

over

and

it's

like

asking

engaging

questions

and

like

getting

them

going

and

then

I

come

back

with

the

video

and

I

throw

it

back

to

the

teacher.

So

like

that's

the

only

way

this

could

work

and

that's

kind

of

the

premise

behind

it

it

will

it

will

feel

like

sort

of

co-eing

with

you

in

a

way.

100%

it'll

You build a little a little tower and then you know those water blobs that like you see sometimes at lake where someone jumps on and then someone goes flying.

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