--- author: The Diary Of A CEO date: '2026-10-05' guest: '' layout: post.njk source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q-DFC0AnbY4 speaker: The Diary Of A CEO tags: - entrepreneurship - leadership - competition - risk-management - personal-growth title: 白大拿访谈：UFC的商业哲学、拳击界竞争与个人成长 summary: 本文记录了史蒂文·巴特利特与UFC总裁白大拿的深度对话。白大拿阐述了UFC的成功法则、对拳击推广人的评价，并分享了自己关于'杀手本能'、风险承担及早期成长经历对性格塑造的见解。 insight: '' draft: true series: '' category: business-entrepreneurship area: finance-wealth project: [] people: - Dana White - Steven Bartlett - Conor McGregor - Khabib Nurmagomedov - Ronda Rousey - Eddie Hearn - Frank Warren - Barry Hearn - Tom Brady - Mike Tyson - Islam Makhachev companies_orgs: - UFC - Matchroom products_models: [] media_books: [] status: evergreen --- ### 终极格斗帝国与狂热驱动力 **白大拿（Dana White）**：我已经打造出了有史以来规模最庞大的格斗品牌。当年收购UFC只花了200万美元。如果湖人队能卖出125亿美元，那么UFC至少价值500亿美元。我每天来到这里，目的只有一个，那就是赢。等我离开人世的那一天，我所建立的一切将是无人能够超越的。我对混乱上瘾；如果没有混乱，我就会亲手去制造混乱。
Original English **Dana White**: I've already built the biggest fight brand to ever exist. The UFC was purchased for $2 million. And if the Lakers sold for 12.5 billion, then the UFC is worth 50 billion. And every day that I show up here, I'm here to win. When I'm dead, it's going to be impossible to beat what I built. And I am addicted to chaos. And if there isn't any, I create it.
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：从UFC格斗选手，到市值数万亿巨头企业的CEO们，再到全球各国的领导人，在所有人当中，我看到你是一个真正陷入极度狂热与痴迷的人。
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: From UFC fighters to CEOs of multi-gazillion pound companies to world leaders, I see in you a man that is truly obsessed.
**白大拿（Dana White）**：我很早就清楚地知道自己究竟是谁，也明确地知道自己想要投身于格斗运动。那就是我余生全部想做的事情。
Original English **Dana White**: Early on, I knew exactly who I was and I knew that I wanted to be involved in fighting. That's what I wanted to do for the rest of my life.
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：有没有哪位运动员是你认为完全独树一帜、无人可比的？
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: Was there any athlete that you sort of put in a class of their own?
**白大拿（Dana White）**：康纳·麦格雷戈（Conor McGregor）、哈比卜·努尔马戈梅多夫（Khabib Nurmagomedov），还有隆达·罗西（Ronda Rousey）。但当初我原本根本不希望UFC接纳女子选手。然而隆达·罗西一把抓住我，对我说：“能不能给我15分钟时间聊聊？”接着她就带着一身该死的气势与魄力走了进来，我当时心里直呼：“卧槽，我想我真的要干这件事了。”而她就是那个最合适一起开启这项事业的人。
Original English **Dana White**: Conor McGregor, Habib Mamedov, and Ronda Rousey, but I didn't want women in the UFC. But Ronda Rousey grabbed me said, "Can I get 15 minutes with you?" And she came in with the whole [ __ ] bravado and I'm like, "Holy [ __ ] I think I'm going to do this." And she's the one to do it with.
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：如果要把UFC的巨大成功归功于某些核心法则，那会是什么？
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: If there were principles that you would most attribute to the success of the UFC, what would it be?
**白大拿（Dana White）**：当你下定决心认清自己是谁、明确自己想做什么、笃定自己将要达成什么目标，并全身心为之付出努力时，你绝无可能失败。千万不要害怕去承担风险。但是现在有些自以为想创业的年轻人，他们根本不知道这背后真正需要付出什么代价。这其中是有一套公式的，猜猜谁掌握了它？我们呆会儿完全可以好好聊聊这个。
Original English **Dana White**: When you decide who you are, what you want to do, what you're going to accomplish, and you work toward it. It is impossible for you to fail. Do not be afraid to take the risk. But some of these kids that think they want to be entrepreneurs, they don't know what it really takes. And there is a formula. And guess who has it? And we can talk about this.
### 母亲的自传与反面榜样 **史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：还有这本书，是你母亲出版的一本关于你的未经授权的传记。她在书里的某些地方对你提出了严厉批评。
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: And then this is a book your mother published about you unauthorized as a biography. She's critical of you at certain points.
**白大拿（Dana White）**：我从不上节目公开说我母亲的坏话，但我的意思是，那简直是最令人作呕、最恶心透顶的事情之一。在它真正发生在你身上之前，你甚至都无法想象这种事居然可能发生。有时候，所谓的家人反而是伤你最深的。那成了我和她关系彻底走向终结的开端。
Original English **Dana White**: I I don't go on shows to speak negatively about my mother, but I mean that's one of the grossest, most disgusting things. You couldn't even imagine possible until it happens to you. And sometimes family is the worst. And that was the beginning of the end with me and her.
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：你原谅她了吗？
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: Have you forgiven her?
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：这里有一个非常奇特的数据。目前正在观看这个节目的观众中，大约有58%的人还没有订阅本频道。从统计学上看，这很可能也包括你。所以，我能请大家帮个小忙吗？如果这个频道曾经为你带来过哪怕一点点价值，能否帮我点一下订阅按钮？这不需要任何花费，却能给我们带来超乎想象的巨大帮助。正如大家所见，频道规模越大，我们就能在嘉宾阵容和节目制作上投入越多的心血。非常感谢大家，希望你们喜欢本期节目。 大拿，你比任何人都更清楚，要成为一名顶尖的格斗家，往往需要拥有非同寻常的成长经历。在我面前摆着许多选手的资料，比如小鹰哈比卜、伊斯兰姆（Islam），还有迈克·泰森（Mike Tyson）。当你审视他们的背景与出身时，他们都拥有极其特殊的起点。而当我看着你时，我认为在某种意义上你同样是一位极其伟大的斗士。因此我的问题是，究竟是早期怎样的成长环境，造就了今天这样一个敢打敢拼的你？
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: Um, here is a strange fact. Most of the people watching this right now, about 58% of you aren't yet subscribed to this channel. Statistically, that is probably you. So, could I ask you a small favor? If this channel has ever given you any value at all, please could you do me a favor and hit the subscribe button? It costs nothing. It helps us more than you could know. And the bigger the channel gets, as you've seen, the more we can invest in the guests and the production. So, thank you so much, and I hope you enjoy this episode. Dana, you know more than anybody that to become a great fighter, often times you have an anomalous upbringing. And I have some of these fighters in front of me like Khabib and Islam and Mike Tyson. And when you look at their backgrounds and where they came from, they have atypical origins. And when I look at you, I consider you to be a great fighter in your own regard. So that's my question is what is that early context that's made you the fighter that you are?
**白大拿（Dana White）**：我不知道。每次一聊到我自己、我的成长过程以及对我的心理剖析，我都觉得很难去回答。我真的不知道该如何确切地回应这些问题。我成长的方式倒不完全像那些选手那样残酷，但是……很早以前我就清楚知道自己到底是谁，也知道自己想要投身于格斗运动，那就是我后半生认定要去做的事。
Original English **Dana White**: I don't know. Uh, you know, I I I always have trouble when we start talking about me and my upbringing and psychoanalyzing me. I I I don't know how to really answer those questions. Um, I don't know. It's not like I grew up like these guys grew up, but early on I knew exactly who I was and I knew that I wanted to be involved in fighting. That's what I wanted to do for the rest of my life.
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：谈到你的父母，我听你以前提起过你父亲的缺席以及他对酒精的严重成瘾。八岁时父母离异，留下来跟着你的母亲生活，而随着你逐渐长大，那同样也是一段动荡起伏的关系。回过头来看，早期环境中有没有什么经历……我知道你不喜欢被人进行心理分析，我听过你对皮尔斯·摩根（Piers Morgan）等探讨你童年的人做出的回应，但是在早期的生活背景中，是否有任何东西你认为确实塑造了你如今的性格？
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: In terms of your mom and dad, I I I listened to you talk about your dad and his absence and his difficulty with alcohol. Divorced at 8 years old, left with your mother and that was also a turbulent relationship as you as you grew up. Is there anything from that early context that you look back on? I know you don't like being psychoanalyzed. I've heard you try I've heard you respond to like Pierce Morgan and others who who have talked about your childhood before, but is there anything from that early context that you think did shape you into this sort of like%.
**白大拿（Dana White）**：你知道，我总是说，很多人喜欢扮演受害者角色，满脑子都是受害者心态。他们常常抱怨：“噢，我从小到大身边没有任何榜样。”其实你是有榜样的，只是你没有用正确的视角去看待他们。当你长大的过程中，每一个出现在你生活里的人都是榜样，既有正面的示范，也有反面的教材，对吧？我过去经常看着我的一些叔叔们、看着我父亲以及其他人，我心里会想：“嗯，那种人生方向绝不是我想走的，我要走完全相反的方向。”在美国，法定的合法饮酒年龄是21岁。
Original English **Dana White**: You know, I I always say that, you know, you see these people that play the victim, you know, the victim mentality. It's like, oh, I didn't have any role models when I was growing up. Yes, you did. You just didn't look at it the right way. when you grow up, everybody who's involved in your life, they're all role models in good and bad ways, right? I I used to look at, you know, some of my uncles and and and and my dad and some I was like, "Yeah, we don't we don't want to go in that direction. Let's let's go in this direction." And in America, you you can start drinking when you're 21.
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：嗯。
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: Mhm.
**白大拿（Dana White）**：而我刚好在21岁那年彻底戒了酒。我坚信，如果我继续酗酒，我就绝不可能达成所有我渴望实现的目标。我看过太多亲戚和身边其他人，酒精彻底摧毁了他们的生活。我觉得我们家族里有一些相当有才华的人，如果当初他们没有沉溺于酒精，本来完全可以过上完全不同的人生。
Original English **Dana White**: I quit drinking when I was 21. I believe that that I wouldn't be able to accomplish all the things that I wanted to accomplish if I was drinking. And I saw a lot of, you know, family members and other people where drinking had had been detrimental to their life. And and uh, you know, I I think I had some pretty talented, you know, family members that could have lived a different life had they not drank.
### 童年记忆、父亲的失职与亲子责任 **史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：当时就只有你和你妹妹吗？
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: You and your sister?
**白大拿（Dana White）**：是的，就我和我妹妹两个人。
Original English **Dana White**: Yeah, it's me and my sister.
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：如果当时有一只苍蝇停在你家墙上旁观那一阶段的生活，它会看到怎样的景象？
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: If I was a fly on the wall during that period of your life, what would I have seen?
**白大拿（Dana White）**：我不知道，我其实不太记得了。随着年龄渐长，我和我妹妹现在经常聊起过去的事。我和我妹妹的关系极其亲近。如今我们的父母都已经去世了，家里就剩下我们俩。我母亲当年简直像一头拼命的野兽，她拼死拼活地工作；如果不加班顶班，身为护士的她还要去学校念书深造。
Original English **Dana White**: I don't know. I I don't really remember. Me and my sister, you know, now that we're getting older, we talk about this stuff a lot. Me and my sister are super close. You know, both our parents are dead and it was just us. So, yeah, my mom was an animal. My mom worked her ass off and, you know, if she wasn't working, you know, and picking up extra shifts. She was a nurse. She was going to school.
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：所以实际上是她一个人把你抚养大。
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: And she effectively raised you on her own.
**白大拿（Dana White）**：绝对是这样。
Original English **Dana White**: Definitely.
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：因为你的父亲完全缺位。我记得你讲过一个故事，关于他喝醉了带你们去电影院的经历。
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: Because your dad was he he was absent. I I remember he reciting a story of you him taking you to the cinema drunk.
**白大拿（Dana White）**：是的，确实如此。
Original English **Dana White**: Yeah. Yeah.
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：我的意思是，我从那个故事里感受到的基本上就是一种心不在焉与漫不经心——他带你们去电影院，问你要不要买东西，往你手里扔了20块钱，打发你去给你妹妹买点零食，场面非常尴尬。
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: And just I mean what I got from that was I guess carelessness. The story of him taking you to the cinema, telling you asking you if you wanted something, throwing $20 your way, telling you to go get it for your sister. Yeah. The him embarrassing.
**白大拿（Dana White）**：那是你年轻岁月里始终铭记的标志性时刻之一。关于我父亲，我脑海里有几个这样的记忆碎片。当时上映的电影是《比佛利山超级警探》（Beverly Hills Cop），刚上映就轰动一时，可以说是当时全球最火爆的电影。而我们去晚了。他醉醺醺地跑来接我们去看电影，光是赶去电影院的过程就已经是一出闹剧。等我们赶到现场，放映厅里人山人海，根本没有空座。他大摇大摆走进去大喊大叫：“我们得叫几个人挪开让座！”然后把钱扔给我，叫我去买爆米花和饮料之类。在我看来，我父亲是一个极其自私自利的人。他只过他自己想过的生活，其他任何人的感受在他眼里都无关紧要。
Original English **Dana White**: It's one of those moments and you know you have these these things that you remember from your young life. And I have I have a few with my dad, but you know the the movie was Beverly Hills Cop. It had just come out and it was like the biggest movie in the world. And we got there late. He showed up drunk to pick us up and take us to the movies, you know. So getting there was was a whole, you know, scene on its own. And then we get there, the place is packed. There's no seats. He walks in and screams, "We're going to have to start moving some people, you know, and throws money at me to go get to go get food and popcorn or whatever." In my opinion, my dad was a very selfish guy. And uh, you know, he lived the life that he wanted to live and everybody else didn't matter.
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：随着年龄增长，你有没有逐渐理解他？人们总说长大成人后会更理解父母。
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: Did you ever understand him as you People always say that when they get older they understand their parents better.
**白大拿（Dana White）**：嗯，我真正理解的是，一旦我自己成为了父亲，我的反应是：“我的天啊，对待自己的孩子原本应该付出这样的感情、原本应该这样去呵护。”所以从这个角度来说，正是我的父母反向让我变成了一位更好的父亲。
Original English **Dana White**: Well, what I understood was once I became a parent. I was like, "Holy [ __ ] this is the way you're supposed to feel about your kids and this is the way you're supposed to, you know." So, yeah, I I think that my parents made me a better parent.
### 好胜心与少年时期的职业觉醒 **史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：你内心有一种非常不寻常的驱动力，那是某种我所见过的极其无情的坚韧。我的意思是，我见识过各色人物，而每当我想到白大拿时，最鲜明的特质之一就是这种近乎残酷、永不满足的野心。所以我这一连串提问并不是为了对你进行心理分析，而纯粹是为了搞清楚这种特质究竟是如何形成的。人们往往会猜测，你心中在某种程度上一直憋着一口气，或者有着想要证明什么的偏执。
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: You've got a very atypical drive in you. There's a certain relentlessness that I've seen. I mean, I've seen it all. And one of the sort of defining traits when I think of Dana White is this sort of relentless insatiable ambition. So my line of questioning isn't really to psycho analyze. It's really just to understand like how that comes to be the case. One would guess that there's some kind of chip on your shoulder in to some degree.
**白大拿（Dana White）**：是的，确实有这方面的原因。但我尽量把重心放在“我喜欢赢”上。在生活中，赢的感觉无比痛快。但与此同时，我也确保自己肩负的各项责任与义务能够妥善履行，我对那些也格外看重。听着，没有人是十全十美的，但我始终倾尽全力去做到最好——在工作中做到最好，在家庭里对待孩子也做到最好。
Original English **Dana White**: Yeah, it's true. But I try to I try to focus on I like to win. Winning is fun and everything in life. But uh you know I also make sure that the obligations that I have you know I I I pay attention to those too. Like listen nobody's perfect but I've tried to do the best I could to be the best at everything I could at work at home with the kids you know.
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：如果回到你小时候，就像这些老照片里那个年幼的小男孩一样，如果那时我问你长大后想成为什么样的人，你当时会有确定的答案吗？
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: And if id asked you when you were a young boy like some of these photos what you going to be when you grow up would you would you have had an answer for me?
**白大拿（Dana White）**：我直到十几岁快成年时才真正明白这一点。要知道，当时我直接辞掉了一份在那个时期和那个地方几乎人人争破头皮都想得到的工作，并且它已经满足了所有……
Original English **Dana White**: I didn't really know that until I was in my late teens. you know, literally walked out of a job that at the time and in the place a lot of people would kill for. Um, and had checked all the
### 离开酒店业：无法忍受为他人打工与服从管束 **Dana White**: 当时我每天都能拿到现金，每周领薪水，有401(k)退休计划，还有全额牙科和医疗保险，涵盖了大家梦寐以求的所有福利。但我就是不喜欢给别人打工。我始终觉得在酒店行业工作极其缺乏尊重，无论是他们对待你的方式，还是对你说话的语气，我都无法忍受，那从来都不是属于我的生活。所以有一天我直接辞职走人了，我说：“我要进军格斗行业。”在那时，我其实并不清楚那具体意味着什么，也不知道自己能做到什么层次，但那成了我的目标。
Original English **Dana White**: ...boxes and made cash every day, got a paycheck every week, 401k, full dental and medical and, you know, all the things that people are looking for. But I didn't like working for other people. I always felt like working in the hotel industry was incredibly disrespectful, the way that they would treat you and talk to you. And I never liked it. It was never for me. So, I walked out one day and I said, "I'm going to get into the fight business." At the time, I didn't know exactly what that meant or, you know, at what level, but that was my goal.
**主持人**: 你是不是一直都对——怎么说呢，对服从权威有些抵触情绪？
Original English **Interviewer**: Have you always had a problem with, well, an issue with, dare I say, authority?
**Dana White**: 你说真的吗？
Original English **Dana White**: You have?
**主持人**: 真的吗？
Original English **Interviewer**: Yes. Very, very much so. Yeah.
**Dana White**: 确实，从来就不是。
Original English **Dana White**: It was never for me.
**主持人**: 这种特质源于哪里？你知道原因吗？
Original English **Interviewer**: Where does that come from? Do you know?
**Dana White**: 我不知道，老实说我真的答不上来。但我确实从小就不喜欢，我从来不喜欢替别人做事，也极度讨厌被别人呼来喝去、指手画脚。正因为这样，我现在也绝不会那样去对待我的员工。
Original English **Dana White**: I don't know. I honestly don't know the answer to that. But I never liked it. I never liked working for other people. I never liked being told what to do, and I don't treat my employees like that.
**主持人**: 在你大概14岁左右的时候，你觉得自己长大后会功成名就吗？
Original English **Interviewer**: Did you think you were going to be successful in your life when you were, I don't know, 14?
**Dana White**: 我年轻时确实这么认为。我相信自己一定会成功，是的。
Original English **Dana White**: I did when I was younger. I believe that I would be. Yeah.
**主持人**: 基于什么依据？
Original English **Interviewer**: Based on...
### 童年的家务苦差与吃苦教育 **Dana White**: 脑子里当时总会冒出各种想法。当然在那个年纪，你根本不知道那些想法具体代表着什么，或者未来能发展到何种地步。但让我告诉你一件事：我和我妈住在一起的时候，前几天我和我妹妹还聊起了这件事。那时我妈整天都在工作或者在学校进修，家里大部分时间就只有我和妹妹两个人。不过，我们俩必须完成家里分配的各种杂务活儿。我们得去修剪草坪、清理游泳池、修剪灌木丛等等。我当时就对自己说：“你等着看吧，哪天只要我自己能赚到一美元，我就再也不干这些操蛋的破烂杂活了！”
Original English **Dana White**: I sort of had these, you know, these ideas in my head which at the, you know, at that time you don't know exactly what it means or at what extent. But let me tell you what. So when we worked, when I lived with my mom, me and my sister were just talking about this the other day. So my mom worked all the time or was at school, and me and my sister were home alone all the time, but we had chores that we had to do. I mean, we were mow the lawn, you know, cleaning the pool and trimming the bushes and all that. And I was like, let me tell you what, the day I make a dollar, I'm never doing this shit ever again.
**主持人**: 所以这大概是她给你上的极其重要的一课。
Original English **Interviewer**: So that's probably an important lesson she taught you.
**Dana White**: 毫无疑问确实如此。我也一直努力把这个理念传递给我的孩子们。我的孩子们一直表现得很棒，每一步都踏踏实实。我之前也讲过这个故事：我最小的儿子艾登（Aiden），有一个周末专门从大学飞回家跟我说：“我不想继续在学校待了。我有了一个创业点子，想自己做生意。”接着他就把全套方案都跟我讲了一遍。我听完后说：“这是个挺不错的点子，我能理解，我也很认同。但你绝不能因此辍学然后就一门心思单搞这个。这个项目每天根本占不满你8到10个小时的时间。”
Original English **Dana White**: No doubt about it. And I, you know, I try to do this with my kids, too. My kids have been great and done everything the right way. And I've told this story before, but my son Aiden, my youngest son, flies home from college one weekend and says, "I don't want to stay in school. I have an idea for this business that I want to do." And whatever. He lays it all out for me. And I'm like, "This is a pretty good idea. I get it. I like it. But you're not going to quit school and just try to do this. This won't chew up 8 to 10 hours of your day."
**Dana White**: “你必须走出去找一份正经工作，去四处投简历找活干。因为如果我明天哪天突然死了，那些才是你真正有能力去胜任做的事。”后来他确实照做了，去了 U-Haul 公司打工。你必须亲身经历过那种底层工作的磨炼。我现在的大儿子正在波士顿读硕士研究生。而当年我在波士顿生活的时候，曾在 EJ 铺路公司（EJ Paving Company）打过工，就是在大马路上铺沥青路面的。我其实很希望我大儿子也能去那家铺路公司实打实地干上几天体验体验。
Original English **Dana White**: "...you're going to go out and you're going to get a job and you're going to go put in applications and you're going to try to get a job because if I die tomorrow, that's what you're qualified to do." And he did it, and he went and he worked at U-Haul. And you know, you got to have those kind of jobs. My son right now, my oldest is getting his master's degree in Boston right now. And when I lived in Boston, I used to work for EJ Paving Company. They pave roads. I actually want my son to go do some days at this paving company.
**主持人**: 你想通过这个让他领悟到什么？
Original English **Interviewer**: What is it you're trying to teach him?
### 何为真正的“艰苦奋斗”与创业真相 **Dana White**: 让他明白什么才叫真正辛苦的工作。现在的很多人看到我整天到处奔波、睡眠很少，大家就感慨说：“噢，你工作太拼命了，你太辛勤了。”根本不是！不，不，不。我来告诉你什么才是真正的艰辛工作。真正的艰苦是搞建筑工地施工，是在工地上拌水泥铺路！就在这条街前面，今年夏天有多少天的气温高达115华氏度（约46摄氏度）？整整115度的高温啊！那些建筑工人就在这115度的灼热高温下挥汗如雨地工作，那才是最硬核、最纯粹的辛苦重活。到了冬天，很多人可能并不清楚拉斯维加斯的冬天有多冷，气温甚至会降到30多华氏度（约零下摄氏度）。而在30华氏度的凛冽寒冬里，这些工人们依然要在室外干活。每天都是繁重无比的重体力劳动，下班回家吃口饭就直接倒头大睡，第二天爬起来继续周而复始。在人生中，要想弄清楚自己真正想做什么，你首先必须搞清楚自己绝对不想做什么。
Original English **Dana White**: Well, what hard work really is. So, people like I run around, I don't sleep much, and everybody's like, "Oh, you work so hard. You work so hard." No, no, no. I'll show you what hard work is. Hard work is construction. Hard work is concrete. Right up the street here, I don't know how many days this summer were 115 degrees out. 115 degrees out. These construction guys are out there working in 115 degree week. Like hard work, real work. And then in the winter, people don't realize this in Vegas, but it gets down into the 30s. These guys will be outside working when it's 30° out. So, and hard physical labor every day, and then you go home, you eat and you go to bed, you get up the next day, and you go do it again. In your life, to figure out what you want to do, you have to figure out what it is you don't want to do.
**主持人**: 这里摘录了一些你曾经说过的名言，想让你看看第一条。
Original English **Interviewer**: I have a bunch of quotes here that you've said if you just wanted to look at the first one.
**Dana White**: “当你自己经营一家企业时，根本就不存在所谓的休息日。”没错，当你经营自己的生意时，哪有什么休假可言。没有生日，没有圣诞节，也没有感恩节。每天都会冒出各种糟糕透顶的破事等着你去解决。但只要你由衷热爱你所做的事，这一切就会变得充满乐趣。
Original English **Dana White**: "There's no such thing as a day off when—there's no such thing as a day off when you run your own business." You know, there's no birthdays, there's no Christmas, there's no Thanksgivings. Bad shit will happen every single day that you need to deal with. But when you like what you do, it's fun.
**主持人**: 现在很多人，尤其是年轻一代，都梦想成为创业者。他们常说：“我真的很想为自己打工，拥有自己的公司，因为我希望能够自由掌控自己的日程安排。”
Original English **Interviewer**: A lot of people, especially young people these days, want to be entrepreneurs. You know, "I'd really like to work for myself and own my own business because I'd love to plan my schedule." How much...
**Dana White**: 哎，那你完全是南辕北辙走错方向了！如果你是这种心态，你真正应该做的是找一份朝九晚五的工作，周末和节假日都能安安稳稳放假，那才是属于你的正轨。如果你想自己创业的初衷仅仅是因为想要拥有更多的个人自由时间，那我向你保证，你选了一条彻底错误的路，我敢打包票。做好一个优秀企业家的关键在于，你必须每一天都去迎难而上解决问题。
Original English **Dana White**: Oh, you're going the wrong way. What you need to do is find a 9-to-five job where you have weekends and holidays off and you know that's your move. If you're looking to start your own business because you want more time to yourself, you are picking the wrong thing to do. I promise you that. The key to becoming a good entrepreneur is you have to find solutions to problems every day.
### 日常的连环意外与必须坐班的创业法则 **Dana White**: 前几天命运还故意跟我找茬添堵。我刚从床上爬起来，按计划早上9点要准时参加一场董事会会议，对吧？我走进浴室准备刮胡子，结果我的两把剃须刀全部没电坏掉了。我平时用的是电动剃须刀，两把居然同时充不上电！好不容易弄完，我坐进车里正开着车，仪表盘传感器突然报警：“右后轮胎压过低，请立即停车。”我心里直骂：“去你的，我们绝不可能停下来，必须继续开。”这就是生活的常态，明白吗？当你清晨起床，现实生活就立在那里随时准备迎面给你一记重拳，你必须硬着头皮熬过这一连串的破事。然后你风尘仆仆赶到办公室，迎面而来的又是一长串等待你去解决的棘手问题清单。
Original English **Dana White**: The universe was trying to fuck with me the other day. I got out of bed. I had to be at a board meeting at 9:00, right? I go in, I got a shave. Both my razors died. I use electric razors. They both died. Get through that. I get in the car and I'm driving and the sensor says, "Your back right tire is low. Stop the vehicle immediately." I said, 'Yeah, no, we're not fucking stopping. We're going.' That's just life, right? When you get up and it's life standing there to kick you in the face and you got to get through all this shit. Then you get to work and there's a laundry list of problems and things you got to deal with.
**Dana White**: 现在的年轻一代居然觉得可以在家里远程办公（WFH），同时还能把一家企业做成功——这根本是痴人说梦，绝对不可能做到！我每天早上8点半就雷打不动坐进办公室，直到晚上7点、8点、9点，有时甚至10点才离开工位，时至今日依然如此。有时候我来到公司，当天的日程安排本来已经规划得满满当当，但同事们会临时推门走进我的办公室，大家坐下来围绕业务展开讨论。要知道，当你拥有一支像我在 UFC 那样优秀的团队时，大伙儿同聚一室热烈讨论，往往就会激发出各种完全意料之外的惊喜火花，许多绝妙的灵感正是因为所有人都现场到岗办公才得以诞生的。
Original English **Dana White**: And this younger generation that think you can work from home and build a successful business. It's impossible. You can't do it. I'm in the office from 8:30 in the morning and I don't leave the office till 7, 8, 9, 10 sometimes. Still to this day. There are times when I go to work and my schedule's planned out for the day. But people will pop in my office and we start talking about things and you know when when you have people a good group of people like I have at the UFC and we get in a room and you start talking things pop up that you would never expect and things happen and a lot of good ideas come from everybody being at work.
### 年岁增长的心态转变与高强度管理 **主持人**: 在过去的几十年里，商海中的种种当头棒喝与现实毒打是否改变了你？
Original English **Interviewer**: Has being kicked in the face by business over the last couple of decades changed you?
**Dana White**: 绝对改变了。我不再像年轻时那样动不动就暴跳如雷了。所有风浪我都亲身淌过一遍，如今心态平静得多了。在很多人身上我都能看到这种演变。你变得——我不想用“软弱”这个词，但随着年纪渐长，人确实会少一些锐气。相比当初创业打江山的那段峥嵘岁月，现在的你会展现出更多柔和温情的一面。但我内心其实极度抗拒成为那种人，你明白我的意思吗？我时刻提醒自己别变成那种人。不过，你确实会逐渐放松下来、变得更加冷静超脱。年轻时动辄让你情绪失控抓狂的那些鸡毛蒜皮，上了年纪后你便不再放在心上了。我曾经经历过一个极端阶段，在短短两年内前后换掉了大概10任秘书。因为我身边必须围绕着能够跟上我节奏的人，你身边必须聚集那些跟得上步伐、能够抗住超强工作负荷的强人。
Original English **Dana White**: Definitely. I don't freak out the way that I used to. I've been through it all and I'm way more calm now. I see this with a lot of guys. You become, I don't want to say you get weaker, but you do get weaker as you get older. There's a softer side to you than you had when you were in the early days of building your business. And I don't ever want to be that guy. You know what I mean? I try not to be that guy. But you do relax and chill out. And you don't—the things that you used to flip out about when you were younger, you don't when you're older. I mean, I went through a phase where I ripped through like 10 secretaries in two years. Like I need people around me that can keep up. You got to have people that can keep up and can handle the load of work.
**Dana White**: 今年对我来说大概是平生最忙碌的一年，因为我手头上同时管理着三家公司：Zuffa 拳击（Zuffa Boxing）、强力拍击联盟（Power Slap）以及 UFC。除此以外，我还有海量其他的兼顾事务要处理。所以我们经常在外面到处出差奔波。过去这两个月里，我们满打满算在家里待的时间大概也就4天左右。一旦回到家，我的脚步也根本停不下来，我必须继续外出张罗各种事务。跟随在我身边的这群弟兄们，他们时刻与我并肩作战，这确实是一份极其严苛不易的苦差事。
Original English **Dana White**: You know, it's probably the busiest year for me this year because I have Zuffa Boxing, Power Slap, and the UFC that I'm running these three companies. And then there's a ton of other things that I do, too. So, we'll be on the road, you know, I think we just got off the last two months. We were home for like 4 days in the last two months. Then I get home and I don't stop. I just I go out and I do things and you know, these guys that are with me, they have to they're with me and it's tough.
### 没有任何人欠你一分一毫 **Dana White**: 没有任何人欠你任何东西。刚才我们不是稍微聊到了我的父母以及过去经历嘛。我小时候有一个一起长大的玩伴，当时我们大概都在十二、十三、十四岁年纪。我记得他父亲生意做得非常成功，家境极度优渥：住着奢华的大豪宅，车库里停满豪车，你成长过程中所渴望拥有的所有好东西他都应有尽有。我记得有一次他跟我倾诉，说他父亲后来遭遇了生意困境。原本他父亲曾在一个银行独立账户里专门为他存下了一百万美元，但后来家里生意陷入危机，他父亲便把那笔钱拿去应急了。那个朋友就愤愤不平地跟我抱怨说：“我父亲偷走了本属于我的一百万美元！”我清楚地记得当时自己心里的第一反应是：“你脑子没毛病吧？难道……”
Original English **Dana White**: Nobody owes you anything. So, you know, we talked a little bit about my parents and whatever. I had this kid that I grew up with and you know this we we were 12, 13, 14 years old. And I remember his dad had done really well and you know, they had a beautiful house, they had cars, you know, he had all the shit that you would want growing up. And I remember him telling me one time his dad ran into hard times and his dad had put a million dollars away for him in an account. And then his father ran into hard times and his father took the money. He's like, "My father stole a million dollars from me." And I remember thinking, "Are...
### 摆脱特权思想：创业者的真正门槛与沉重责任 **Dana White**：你是脑子进水了吗？你父亲哪怕只是动过那样的念头、想着为你把钱存起来留给你，这本身就已经令人难以置信了。但这笔钱从来就不是你的。你没有赚过那笔钱，它本来就不属于你。我记得自己在十二、十三、十四岁的时候就这么想过，对吧？我当时就觉得，这种心态绝对是错误的——这种特权思想、理所当然的心态，简直是致命的。那个人后来的成长轨迹，完全就像你预料的那样。他就是那种觉得别人都欠他什么的人。可事实上，没有人欠你任何东西，绝对没有。
Original English **Dana White**: Are you out of your fucking mind? The fact that your dad even thought of you that way, that he would put that money away for you is incredible. But that was never your money. You didn't earn that money. That wasn't yours. I remember thinking that way when I was 12, 13, 14, right? I'm like, that is definitely the wrong type of mentality. Entitlement. Brutal. And that guy grew up exactly the way you would expect that guy to grow up. He's just, you know, nobody owes you anything. Nobody.
**Interviewer**：能够处于一个有人能为你打通几个电话、为你安排一些事情的位置固然是种优势，但一旦他们为你铺好路，你必须亲自上场把事情做成并交出成果。现在肯定有很多听众一心想成为创业者，你觉得大多数人真的适合创业吗？
Original English **Interviewer**: To be set up in a position where somebody can make some phone calls for you and do some things, but then once they do that, you have to go in and deliver. There's going to be a ton of people listening that want to be entrepreneurs. Do you think most people are cut out for it?
**Dana White**：不，根本不适合。成为一名创业者是非常、非常特殊的一件事。我的意思是，对很多人来说，每天早晨起床能依靠自己、照顾好自己就已经够难的了。
Original English **Dana White**: No. No. To be an entrepreneur is a very unique thing. I mean, it's hard enough for a lot of people to get up every day and depend on themselves...
**Interviewer**：能把自己照顾好就已经不容易了。
Original English **Interviewer**: To take care of themselves.
**Dana White**：而当你成为一名创业者时，有无数人依靠着你。很多人要靠你来养家糊口，我对这个角色看得极其严肃。回想我刚踏入这个行业时，根本没有多少人相信它。这就是为什么我们当时只花了200万美元就买下了UFC，对吧？我们说实话吧，UFC当年是以200万美元收购的。如果现在的湖人队能卖到125亿美元，那么UFC至少值500亿美元，明白吗？ 所以那些当时真正相信这个事业并加入的人……你知道，当我试图招揽转播制作人才时，制作人员根本不想住在内华达州的拉斯维加斯，尤其是在25年前。他们只想留在纽约或洛杉矶，对吧？我试图招募赞助业务人才，他们也是非纽约或洛杉矶不去，根本不想搬来这里。但后来我聚拢了一批人，比如克雷格·博萨里（Craig Borsari），他是我的制作主管，绝对是业内最顶尖的王牌巨星。他原本是福克斯（Fox）冉冉升起的新星，但他毅然离开福克斯来到这里，因为他深信这一愿景，相信我们正在这里开拓的事业。
Original English **Dana White**: When you're an entrepreneur, lots of people depend on you. Lots of people feed their families and I take that role very serious. I mean, when I got into this business, not a lot of people believed in it. That's why we bought the UFC for $2 million, right? Let's be honest here. The UFC was purchased for $2 million. And if the Lakers sold for $12.5 billion, then the UFC is worth $50 billion, okay? So the people who did believe in this—when I was trying to hire production people, production people don't want to live in Las Vegas, Nevada, especially 25 years ago. They want New York or LA, right? I was trying to hire sponsorship people, New York and LA, they don't want to live here. And then I had a group of people: Craig Borsari, who is my head of production, who is an absolute rock star, the best in the business. He was a rising star at Fox. He left Fox and came here because he believed in the vision and what was happening here.
### UFC成功的核心支柱：赛事对阵与终极现场体验 **Interviewer**：回顾从以200万美元收购，到现在如果按湖人队的估值甚至能值500亿美元的历程——在当时根本没人愿意承办格斗赛事、所有人都觉得这太野蛮残暴的背景下，如果挑选几个你认为对UFC成功贡献最大的核心原则，那会是什么？
Original English **Interviewer**: When you think back on that journey of buying it for $2 million and then let's say it's worth $50 billion now if it was valued relevant to the Lakers—if there were a couple of principles that you would most attribute to the success of the UFC, when at the time nobody wanted to put on the fights anywhere, everybody thought it was like too barbaric?
**Dana White**：赛事对阵匹配（Matchmaking）。
Original English **Dana White**: Matchmaking.
**Interviewer**：对阵匹配。是的。
Original English **Interviewer**: Matchmaking. Yeah.
**Dana White**：这是第一位的。其次是现场赛事的制作。
Original English **Dana White**: Is number one, the live event production.
**Interviewer**：明白。
Original English **Interviewer**: Okay.
**Dana White**：还有电视转播制作。
Original English **Dana White**: And the television production.
**Interviewer**：那么在商业层面上呢？有没有哪一点是你觉得如果当年做错了，我们今天绝对不可能站在这里的？
Original English **Interviewer**: And then on the business side that you think, you know, if we'd gotten that wrong, we definitely wouldn't be here?
**Dana White**：最大的问题在于，如果你看25年前我们买下它的时候，大家都说：你永远不可能跟职业拳击竞争。拳击太根深蒂固了，历史太悠久了，有各种各样的理由。但拳击后来变成了一场清仓大甩卖。每次那些推广人办一场比赛，他们都只想尽可能捞一笔钱然后卷铺盖跑路。我现在也涉足了拳击领域，我在派拉蒙（Paramount）拥有唯一的全球电视转播交易，而其他所有家伙都只能挤在所谓的流媒体服务上，几乎每一个推广人都是如此。他们做的事情其实是把所有人都赶出了这个行业——电视转播网不再想跟它打交道，赞助商也不想再参与其中。而我们在过去25年里所做的一切，是建立了一个不仅消费者信任，连赞助商、电视转播网络也同样信任的品牌，这份信任名单还可以一直列下去。 所以我必须确保，当人们来到我的现场赛事时——这一点极其重要——那些花钱买票来看现场的人，花销远比电视机前的观众大得多。他们得买机票、订酒店、支付晚餐费用。每次我们举办现场赛事，我都希望人们离场时心里感叹：“太他妈精彩了，今晚来得太值了，我下次一定还要来。”
Original English **Dana White**: The big problem, if you look at how 25 years ago when we bought this, you're never going to compete with boxing. Boxing is too established. It's been around too long. It's this and that. Boxing became a going out of business sale. Every time these guys would put on a fight, they try to grab as much money as they can and run. I am now involved in boxing. I have the only global television deal right on Paramount. All these other guys are on a streaming service called—literally every promoter. What they've done is they've chased everybody out of the business. Television networks don't want to deal with it anymore. Sponsors don't want to be a part of it anymore. What we have done over the last 25 years is built a brand that not only the consumer trusts, but sponsors, television networks, the list goes on and on. So, I make sure that when people show up to my live event, which is super important. The people who pay to come to the live event spend way more money than the people on TV. And they got to buy flights and rooms and pay for their dinners. Every time we put on a live event, I want the people walking out of there going, "God damn, that was a good time. I'm glad we did this tonight and I would love to do this again."
### 成功的真正秘诀：团队组建与同频文化 **Interviewer**：那你具体是如何确保做到这一点的呢？我曾听有人说过，白大拿好像掌握了一套做这件事的固定公式。如果回顾过去，虽然我不知道确切数字，但有一长串名单、很多资金雄厚、极其聪明且在其他领域成就卓著的人，试图跨界进入这个行业，结果都失败了，根本玩不转。这说明确实存在一套公式。
Original English **Interviewer**: And how do you make sure that's the case? I heard somebody saying one time, Dana acts like there's a formula to this. If you look if you went back, I don't know the actual number, but it's a long list and a big number of guys with a lot of money who are really smart and have done good things in life that have tried to get into this business and couldn't do it. Couldn't make it work. There is a formula.
**Dana White**：猜猜谁掌握着这个公式？
Original English **Dana White**: And guess who has it?
**Interviewer**：在我的商业生涯中，随着不断前行，我学到了一件在起步阶段并不了解的事，那就是商业上的成功在多大程度上取决于你能把怎样的人才凝聚在一起。我认为在职业生涯刚开始时，人总会觉得：只要我周末加班、拼命苦干，自己想出好点子，我就能成功。但在这一路上的某个时刻，我意识到这其实关乎组建团队，并用正确的哲学或文化将他们凝聚起来，不管人们怎么称呼它。我想问你的是：你是否也注意到了同样的事情？你是否也发现，在构建商业帝国的过程中，最显而易见却又往往最容易被忽视的一件事，就是你所聘用人才的素质？
Original English **Interviewer**: One of the things I've learned as I've gone through my business career that I didn't know at the start of my business career was how much of success is actually determined by the people you're able to assemble. I think at the start of my career, you think if I work weekends and I work really hard and have good ideas myself, then I'll be successful. And somewhere along the way, I realized that it's really about like assembling people and binding them with the right like philosophy or culture, whatever they call it. And the question I have for you is, have you noticed the same? Have you noticed that one of the like obvious but seemingly unobvious things about business building is the quality of people you hire?
**Dana White**：毫无疑问。没有任何一个人能包揽所有事情。当年我们刚买下这家公司时，我是那个包揽一切的人，全公司大概就两个员工——我和另一个人。刚开始的时候，你必须身兼数职，扮演所有角色。接着你开始向外拓展，开始组建团队。团队中有人契合，有人能出成果，但也有人不行。你必须极其敏锐地分辨出谁真正契合、谁能胜任、谁不能胜任。在过去的25年里，如果说我拥有一项超能力的话，那就是懂得挑选对的人放在自己身边。当有人不合适时我也能立刻察觉。当年我们卖掉公司引入新团队时做过一个重大决定，我一眼就能看出哪些人不合适，并立刻将他们解雇了。
Original English **Dana White**: There's no doubt about it. No one guy does everything. When we first bought the company, I was the everything guy. There was like two employees, me and somebody else. And you know, you wear all the hats when you start. Then you start going out and you start building a team. And there are people who fit and people who work and people who don't. And you have to be really good at figuring out who fits and who works and who doesn't. And over the last 25 years, if there's a superpower that I have, it has been picking the right people to surround myself with. And I knew when there wasn't. We made a big decision when we sold on people that we brought in and I knew right away the people that didn't fit and I fired them.
**Interviewer**：在选拔优秀人才时，你看重的是什么？
Original English **Interviewer**: What are you looking for in great people?
**Dana White**：首先，你必须拥有真正有才华的人。他们不仅要极其精通自己的业务，还必须勤奋肯干，拥有强大的自驱力。但最重要的是，每个人都必须对公司的愿景保持认同，必须处于完全相同的认知步调上。我现在和我的制作团队之间已经达到了这样一种默契：当我们制作宣传广告片、制作精彩花絮短片时，他们拿来给我看，几乎不需要做任何修改。
Original English **Dana White**: First of all, you have to have talented people. You have to have talented people that are not only really good at what they do, but are hard workers, too, and have the drive. But everybody has to be on board with the vision and has to be on the same page. I am at a place right now with my production team when we do spots and we do vignettes and they'll bring them into me and there are very few changes.
### 终极拳迷的直觉掌控：热线直通转播车与顶级信任 **Interviewer**：那你在这方面的才能究竟是什么呢？如果我去问和你合作最紧密的人——我知道这是一个回答起来有点奇特的问题——相比其他人而言，白大拿最罕见的哪三项核心技能是什么？
Original English **Interviewer**: What is your talent there? Like if if I ask the people that work closest with you, and I know this is a little bit of a weird question to answer, what is Dana's three skills that are rare relative to other people?
**Dana White**：我骨子里就是一个彻彻底底的格斗迷。在这个行业干了25年之后，我依然是一个硬核格斗迷。每当我们策划出某个方案并完美呈现时，我瞬间就能知道我们抓准了感觉。现在我的职责就是鞭策我的团队——不管是现场制作、赛事对阵匹配，还是赞助商务团队，无论哪一方面，我每天都在全力推动这帮人，去达到我知道我想去的目标位置。
Original English **Dana White**: I am a fight fan to the core. 25 years later of doing this, I am still a hardcore fight fan. And when we put something together and we nail it, I know we got it. And now what I do is I push my team whether it's production, matchmaking, sponsorship side, whatever it is. I push all these guys every day to get us to where I know I want to be.
**Interviewer**：因为你本身就是那个最终客户。
Original English **Interviewer**: You are the customer.
**Dana White**：没错，我就是那个最终客户。
Original English **Dana White**: Yeah, I am the customer.
**Interviewer**：是的，而且你一直都是。我记得早在你二十多岁出头、二十五六岁的时候，你就已经对拳击深深着迷了。
Original English **Interviewer**: Yeah. And you have been since I saw in your your sort of early, sort of mid-20s, you were captivated with boxing at the time, I believe.
**Dana White**：没错。每次我们出席现场赛事时，我坐的桌子上都有一部红色专线电话，它直接连通外面的转播车。我们现场总制作人的名字叫扎克（Zach）。
Original English **Dana White**: Yep. Every time when we go to an event, there's a red phone on the on the table where I sit and it goes directly to the to the truck and our producer's name is Zack.
**Interviewer**：就是总制作人所在的那辆转播车。
Original English **Interviewer**: The truck where the producers are.
**Dana White**：对。扎克负责掌控整场赛事的现场直播。他拥有做任何尝试的充分自由，他也乐于尝试。如果有什么不对劲，我就会拿起那部电话说：“刚才那是怎么回事？”他会说：“我想着试一下那个效果。”我就会说：“好，那以后他妈的再也别搞那套了。”“行，挂了。”彼此不会有任何怨恨，没有任何芥蒂。而一旦我们做出了什么惊艳的尝试，我就会说：“刚才那个太棒了！祝贺，简直不可思议。” 你知道，一旦你和团队达到这种默契境界……坐在外面的那位女士叫莱恩（Len），她是我们的公关负责人。我现在做任何决定几乎都少不了和她商量。我完全信任她，她极其聪明、极具才华，已经深度参与到我生活的方方面面。还有我刚才提到的制作主管克雷格·博萨里，以及我的赞助主管。一旦你组建起这样一支全明星般的摇滚天团，整个团队就会像一台运转精密的机器，所有事情都会自然而然地以正确的方式飞速运转。就像……
Original English **Dana White**: Yeah. Zach runs all the shows. He has the freedom to do what he wants and he tries. So I'll pick up the phone and go, "What was that?" And he's like, "I thought we tried that." I say, "Yeah, let's never fucking do that again." Okay, bye. And there's no hurt feelings, there's no whatever. Or we'll do something and I'm like, "That was incredible. Yeah, congrats. That's incredible." And you know, once you get to that level with your team, there's a woman sitting out here. Her name is Len. She's the head of PR. I don't really make a move without talking to her anymore. I trust her so much and she's so smart and she's so talented that she's involved in a lot of different aspects of my life. Craig Borsari who I talked about who is the head of production, my head of sponsorship. Once you build this like rockstar team, it's all just like it becomes a well-oiled machine where everything just starts to work the right way. Like
### 疫情危机下的承诺：绝不裁员与战壕情谊 **Dana**: 在经历疫情期间，我谈到的这些人——你知道，当你经历那样的事情时，天知道这会持续多久？尽管那段时间全世界都陷入了疯狂，但有一件事是绝对不可能发生的：我才不管那些借口，我们绝不会裁掉我们的员工。这些一直陪伴着我、我和他们极其亲近的人，之前看到过某个我不知道是谁的首席执行官说过一句话：“任何试图向你兜售‘我们是一家人’的人，全都是在胡说八道。这纯粹是交易关系……”我不知道有谁愿意为那种人去拼命撞墙。但他纯粹是在扯淡。这就是我对我的团队的真实感受，我是真的在乎他们。我永远、绝对不会把金钱置于员工之上。我们这一生中最可怕的时刻就是疫情。你看着财务数据，然后说：“哦糟糕，我们得裁掉一些人了。我们得干嘛？”在人类历史上最可怕的时期裁员？绝不。作为首席执行官，你的职责是想办法让企业继续运转下去，并且照顾好你所有的员工，对吧？有一件事是你绝对不能做的，那就是：哦，我们面临困难时期了，那我们就开始向那些曾经为了帮公司打拼而错过孩子第一次迈步、错过孩子球赛、错过这错过那的员工开枪裁员。作为首席执行官，你的职责就是照顾好这些人，并找出赚钱的办法。这就是我的看法，也是我们实际做到的。
Original English **Dana**: when we were going through co these people that I'm talking about, you know, when you go through something like this, who the hell knows how long this is going to last? And as crazy as the world was during that time, here here's one thing that wasn't going to happen. I don't give a [ __ ] We were not going to lay off our employees. These people that have been here with me and and that I'm super close to saw this quote from I I don't know who the CEO was, but says, "Anybody that's trying to sell you that we're a family and is is full of [ __ ] This is transactional and it's the I don't know who wants to run through a [ __ ] wall for that guy." But he's full of [ __ ] Okay, my team. That is the way I feel about my team. And I do care. And I will never pick money over people ever. Scariest time in our lifetime was co. You're looking at the numbers and going, "Oh [ __ ] you know, we uh we got to let go of some people. We got to what?" During the scariest time in in human history. No. Your job as the CEO is to figure out how to keep your business running and to take care of all your people, right? Here's what you don't do. Oh, we're looking at hard times. Let's just start [ __ ] putting bullets in people who have missed their kids' first step, didn't go to a [ __ ] game, missed this and missed that to help build this company. It is your job as the CEO to take care of these people and figure out how to make money. That's the way that I look at it and that's what we did.
**Interviewer**: 人们之所以对“我的团队就是我的家人”这种说法感到反感，是因为他们总会说：“好吧，但你不会开除你的家人。”而据我所听到的，你的意思实际上是：那些始终对你忠诚的人，才是你视如家人去对待的人。
Original English **Interviewer**: The reason why people have a problem with this whole like uh you know my team are my family thing is because they always say well you don't fire your family and and what you're saying is actually those that have been loyal to you are the ones that you treat like family I'm hearing.
**Dana**: 是的。如果你连忠诚都没有，
Original English **Dana**: Yeah. If you don't have loyalty
**Interviewer**: 那你还剩下什么？
Original English **Interviewer**: what do you have?
**Dana**: 没错。如果你在一个让你觉得随时都可能被无故撤掉地毯、仅仅因为财务数据不好看就被扫地出门的地方工作，你还怎么干？很多人以为自己想成为创业者，以为自己想当一家公司的首席执行官。但每天当你早上下床、脚踩到地板的那一刻起，你就是在奔赴战场。有人想要抢走你拥有的东西，有人想要坑害你。你知道，每天都有人冲着你来。而你越成功，冲着你来的人就越多。我把 UFC 以及我运营的其他业务看作是一艘战列舰。我和我的团队正在奔赴战场。我们要么同生共死一起沉没，要么就谁也别想击沉我们。
Original English **Dana**: Right. If if you work in a place where you feel like the rug could be pulled out from under you at any minute for no reason other than the numbers don't look good. You think you want to be an entrepreneur and you think you want to be the CEO of a company. Every day when your foot hits the floor out of bed, you're going to war. There's people trying to take what you have. There's people trying to screw you over. You know, people are coming after you every day. And the more successful you become, the more people that are coming after you. And I look at the UFC and other businesses that I run as a battleship. And me and my team are going to war. And we either all go down together or we don't go down at all.
**Interviewer**: 我想在那种背景下，如果你身处战争，那你需要的就是与你并肩作战的兄弟。你需要——
Original English **Interviewer**: I guess in that context, if you are at war, then you need, you know, your brothers in arms. You need
**Dana**: 你需要士兵。
Original English **Dana**: you need soldiers.
**Interviewer**: 是的，你需要士兵。
Original English **Interviewer**: Yeah. You need soldiers.
**Dana**: 没错。我再告诉你一件事，我知道很多关于疫情初期的各种传闻，但在一切开始全面停摆封锁的那一天，我把所有员工都召集到底楼的餐厅里，我对他们说：“听着，我也不理解这个病毒，我不知道到底发生了什么，但如果你们中有人觉得不安全，或者觉得家里有亲人可能会因为这整个局面而陷入危险，你们随时可以回家。”结果没有一个人离开。没有一个人走出去。我说：“我们会想出办法的，我们会一起熬过这一关。”在那之后，我每周都会和所有员工打 FaceTime 视频电话。现在听起来可能觉得很不可思议，但我当时说：“如果你们需要任何东西，需要食品杂货、卫生纸，或者你们有家人生病了，第一时间给我打电话。我们会一起挺过去的。”接着只过了短短几周，我就说：“我们要开工了，我们要回去干活了。”所有人，不论男女，全都齐声说：“我们跟你干，出发吧！”
Original English **Dana**: Yep. And I'll tell you this, so I know lots of different stories coming out of CO the day that everything started to shut down. I literally got all my employees in a room together downstairs at our dining room and I said, "Listen, I don't understand this. I don't know what's going on, but if any of you feel unsafe or feel that, you know, you have loved ones at home that could be unsafe from this whole thing, you can go home." Nobody walked out. Nobody walked out. I said, "We're going to figure this out. We're going to get through this together." And uh you know, every week I had weekly FaceTime calls with all my employees. And it sounds weird now, but I was like, "If you need anything, if you need groceries, toilet paper, uh you loved one of yours gets sick, make me the first call. We'll get through this together." And and then, you know, it was only a couple weeks and I said, "We're going. we're going to work. And everybody, men, women, they all said, "We're with you. Let's roll."
**Interviewer**: 你知道很有趣的一点是什么吗？上次我听到有公司的创始人或首席执行官对我说这番话时，他们碰巧也有过非常动荡的童年，从小没有一个完整的家庭。他最终向我坦白说：“你知道吗，我想在某种程度上，成年之后我终于建立起了自己过去从未真正拥有过的社区大家庭。”所以刚才听你讲话时，我心里就在想，这之间是否也存在着某种联系——
Original English **Interviewer**: Do you know what's interesting is the last time I heard a founder or CEO of a company say this to me, um, they also had a very turbulent childhood where they didn't have a family. And and he ended up admitting to me, he goes, "You know, I guess to some degree, as an adult, I've been able to build my own my own community family that I really never had." And so I I was just wondering as you were speaking there if there's if there's a link there at all
**Interviewer**: 也就是在你如何对待员工之间……
Original English **Interviewer**: well between how you treat
**Dana**: 不，对我来说真正的联系在于这里。如果一定要再次对我进行心理分析的话，那就是我曾经在很多家公司工作过。你满怀热情地去上班，付出自己的时间和精力，而他们却把你当成根本微不足道、可有可无的存在，对吧？他们的态度就像是：“好吧，你要是不喜欢，后面排着队想抢这份工作的还有另外十个人呢。”哇，原来你们就是这么衡量我的价值、看待我在这里所做的一切的。
Original English **Dana**: No, here's the link for me. If if I had again psychoanalyzing me, I've worked for companies that you go in and you give your time and your energy to and they treat you like you don't even [ __ ] matter, right? It's like, well, if you don't like it, there's 10 other people right behind you that would love to have this job. Wow, that's how much you value me and what I do here.
### 57岁仍在最前线：登顶易，守顶难 **Interviewer**: 是的，尊重是双向的，对吧？我以前也处在过那种境地，经历过那种感受。这让我想起了我读到过的关于你的另一句名言，说你“永远深陷在第一线细节之中（always in the weeds）”。有人可能会想：达纳，你已经57岁了——
Original English **Interviewer**: Yeah, it goes both ways, right? I I I've been in those positions before and I've red phone um reminds me of another quote that I read from you which is that you are always in the weeds and one would think you know Dana you're 57
**Dana**: 是的，57岁了。
Original English **Dana**: yeah 57
**Interviewer**: 57岁高龄，非常非常成功，这辈子赚了巨额财富，正处于个人权力和影响力的巅峰期。人们理所当然会设想，到了这个时候，你理应从繁杂的基层一线细节中稍微抽身退步一些，甚至我敢说，哪怕多做些权力下放、多享受一下生活呢？当然，“享受生活”这个词可能带点主观臆测，但按理说到现在应该不至于还整天泡在最前线细节里吧？
Original English **Interviewer**: 57 years old very very successful made a lot of money in your life peak of your powers one would assume that by this time you'd be a little bit out of the weeds and dare I say even I don't know delegating and enjoying yourself a little bit more I mean that's presumptive the word enjoying yourself but would be out of the weeds by No.
**Dana**: 你听过那句老话吗？“登上顶峰容易，守住顶峰才难。”再没有比这更真实的话了。当你身处顶峰时，所有人都在瞄准你、想把你拉下马。所有竞争对手都在研究你的蓝图，心里琢磨着：“我该怎么利用他做过的事情、利用他搭建这套体系的方法来击败他？”
Original English **Dana**: You ever hear the saying, "It's easier to get to the top than it is to stay on top." True words were never spoken. When you're when you're at the top, everybody's gunning for you. And everybody's looking at your blueprint and saying, "How do I how do I use what he's done and how he's built this to beat him?
**Interviewer**: “我该怎么挖走他的人才？”
Original English **Interviewer**: How do I steal his people?"
**Dana**: 这就像成为世界冠军一样。一旦你成了世界冠军，所有人都会开始研究你，研究你怎么打拳、怎么比赛、动作习惯是什么，千方百计找出击败你的招数。而我恰恰深爱这种竞争挑战。
Original English **Dana**: It's like being a world champion. So, you become a world champion and then everybody starts studying you and how you fight or how you play or how you do, trying to figure out how to beat you. And uh I love that [ __ ]
**Interviewer**: 你如何应对这种局面？因为——
Original English **Interviewer**: How do you respond to that? Because it
**Interviewer**: 因为当有那么多人都在瞄准同一个人时，人很容易分散精力、被外界带偏。
Original English **Interviewer**: because it's easy to get distracted when there's that many people gunning for one guy
### 每天专注的三件事与比肩四大体育联盟 **Dana**: 那就绝不要分心。你知道人会因为什么而分心吗？当你进入这样一个行业时，对吧，大量稀奇古怪的花哨诱惑就会朝你扑面而来，比如：“嘿，我们想拍一部关于这个的电影。嘿，我们想做一部关于你人生的片子。嘿，我们想……”但我每天只专注于三件事，我不会说出来是哪三件。
Original English **Dana**: and don't get distracted. You know what get distracted on? You get into a business like this, right? And and lots of goofy [ __ ] starts coming at you like, "Hey, we want to do a movie about this. Hey, we want to do a thing on your life. Hey, we want to There's three things that I focus on every day, and I'm not going to say it." But
**Interviewer**: 你坚决不肯说出来。
Original English **Interviewer**: you're not going to say it.
**Dana**: 不说。
Original English **Dana**: No.
**Interviewer**: 为什么？
Original English **Interviewer**: Why?
**Dana**: 我每天只专注于三件事。只要我不把这三件事搞砸——
Original English **Dana**: There's three things that I focus on every day. And if I don't [ __ ] this up,
**Interviewer**: 你就绝对搞不砸。
Original English **Interviewer**: you can't you can't mess it up.
**Interviewer**: 为什么不肯告诉我呢？
Original English **Interviewer**: Why wouldn't you tell me?
**Dana**: 这是核心秘诀的一部分。这是成功公式的一部分。
Original English **Dana**: It's part of the formula. It's part of the formula.
**Interviewer**: 你每天专注的三件事。
Original English **Interviewer**: Three things you focus on every day.
**Dana**: 围绕着 UFC 这个品牌，每天都会涌现出许许多多附带的旁枝末节，对吧？如果你开始一头扎进所有那些花哨事务中，任由你的虚荣心和自负占据主导，让自大介入所有那些烂事里，你就会输。你绝对不能搞砸，因为我亲眼见过其他许多曾经庞大无比、拥有上百年历史的企业，仅仅犯了几个错误，别人就会趁虚而入抢夺你的市场份额，紧紧咬住你的脚后跟不放。
Original English **Dana**: There's lots of ancillary things that come around the brand of the UFC, right? That if you start diving into all the, you know, and let your ego take over. you let your ego get into, you know, all this [ __ ] that you can't mess it up because I've seen other companies that are so big and massive and have been around for a hundred years and you make a couple of mistakes and then somebody else is is coming trying to eat your lunch, man. And and and uh nipping at your heels.
**Dana**: 现在根本没有人能咬住我的脚后跟。外面其他所有那些搞格斗赛事的家伙，我们根本不在同一个量级上。好吗？如今我们这项事业已经达到了完全不同的高度。我真正的竞争对手是 NFL（美国国家橄榄球联盟）、MLB（美国职业棒球大联盟）、NHL（国家冰球联盟）以及 NBA（美国职业篮球联赛）。我们刚和派拉蒙（Paramount）达成了一笔80亿美元的协议。此时此刻，我虽然没有确凿证据，但我敢断定事实就是如此：NFL 那帮人全是野兽，对吧？一旦那笔交易宣布，NFL 的所有高层决策者绝对立刻聚在一间屋子里讨论：“外面有80亿美元是我们没拿到的！我们也可以在周二、周三、周四、周五排满比赛！”你明白我的意思吗？
Original English **Dana**: Nobody's nipping at my heels. All these other guys that are out there, we are not the same. Okay, this thing has gotten to a level now. My competitors are the NFL, Major League Baseball, the NHL, and the NBA. We did an 8 billion deal with Paramount. Right now, I don't know this for a fact, but I know this for a fact. The NFL are a bunch of animals, right? Soon as that deal was announced, all the powers that be at the NFL got in a room and said there was $8 billion out there that we didn't get. We'll do games on Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday. You know what I mean?
**Dana**: 如果你现在看看我，我们正坐在属于我的竞技场馆里。隔壁就是我的 UFC 运动表现中心（Performance Institute）以及我们的全球总部。NFL 和 MLB 那些联盟拥有的一切设施，我们全都有。我们如今已经是全美四大顶尖主流体育联盟行列中的一员。
Original English **Dana**: And if you look at me now, we're sitting in my arena. Next door, I have the performance institute and our headquarters. We have everything that the NFL and the Major League Base, all these guys have. We are part of the the four major sport uh organizations in the United States.
**Interviewer**: 达纳，你能向我透露这三件事中的哪怕一件吗？
Original English **Interviewer**: Dana, can you give me one of these three things?
**Dana**: 嗯……不能，绝对不行。这是核心秘诀的一部分。但你知道，我们现在已经跻身前四大主流体育联盟之列。至于其他那些拳赛推广人、其他所有搞格斗比赛的那些家伙，他们所做的一切根本无关紧要。
Original English **Dana**: Um, no, no, no, no, no. It's it's it's part of the formula, but you know, we have gotten to a level now where we are one of the top four major. All these other promoters and all these other guys putting on fights and all this [ __ ] they don't matter.
### 深入业务一线与追求持续价值 **主持人**: 不过说到深入一线、关注细节这一点……对于很多正在创业或打拼的人来说，这真的很重要吗？
Original English **Host**: But on this point of being in the weeds, is that important for, you know, people out there that are...
**白大拿（Dana White）**: 现实情况往往是这样的，大家总是跑来跟我说类似的话。比如我们跟派拉蒙（Paramount）签了那笔77亿美元的转播合作大单，所有人都在说：“哇，太不可思议了，你成功了。”可你根本他妈的没算成功，人永远不会有彻底“大功告成”的时候。你知道派拉蒙为什么愿意掏77亿吗？因为他们相信我们能切实拉动并影响他们的业务增长。而我接下去五年的任务，就是确保我们真正帮他们做到这一点。因为你想想我想要什么？等这份合约期满之后，我想要的是下一笔100亿美元的交易，对吧？
Original English **Dana White**: So here's what can happen, you know, and people say this to me all the time. We did the $7.7 billion deal with Paramount and they're like, "Wow, that's incredible." You know, you didn't fucking make it. You never make it. You don't make... Do you know why Paramount did a 7.7? Because they believe that we can impact their business. Now, my job over the next five years is to make sure we do that because guess what I want? I want 10 billion after we get out of this deal, right?
**主持人**: 你能做到这一步的前提，就是持续为他们的公司创造实际价值……
Original English **Host**: And the way that you do that is you added value to their company and and you know...
**主持人**: 但长达25年一直亲力亲为、扎在最繁杂的业务细节里，难道不会感到疲惫吗？尤其是你现在已经功成名就，赚了这么多钱。难道真的不累吗？
Original English **Host**: Is it not tiring though constantly having to be in the weeds for 25 years and now you're rich and you've you made all this money? Like, is it not?
**白大拿（Dana White）**: 我能理解对某些人来说可能会觉得累，但我完全不会。我今年57岁了，我知道对很多年轻人来说57岁好像挺老了，但其实57岁根本不算老。再说了，如果不干这个，我他妈还能干什么去？我对混乱和挑战有一种成瘾感。如果没有混乱，我自己都会去制造点动静出来。这听起来可能有点不可思议，但我确实是个无可救药的工作狂和混乱上瘾者。
Original English **Dana White**: I could understand for some people maybe, but not me. I mean, I'm I'm I'm 57, and I'm sure to a lot of young people that seems old, but 57 isn't that old. And and and what the hell would I be doing? I am addicted to chaos and and you know, and if there isn't any, I create it. It's it's a weird thing, but I'm definitely an addict. Yeah.
### 黑粉的价值与屏蔽媒体杂音 **主持人**: 在这堆语录里有一句特别应景的话……
Original English **Host**: There's a particular quote in this pile of quotes which I think is really relevant.
**白大拿（Dana White）**: 没错，我特别喜欢那些黑粉（haters）。伙计，黑粉简直是最好的存在，没有什么比黑粉更宝贵的了。黑粉会清清楚楚、毫不留情地指出你业务里所有他们认为存在的问题，挑剔你哪里没做好、哪里做得不对。在过去，这些人可能被叫做“批评家”之类的，现在这个时代他们被称为黑粉。我真的非常喜欢黑粉。
Original English **Dana White**: Yeah. I love the haters. The haters are the best, man. There's nothing better than haters. Haters will lay out what they think is wrong with your business and how you're not, you know, doing this or doing that. And you know what this used to be called was, you know, the critics or the whatever. Now these days they're called the haters. And and I I love the haters.
**主持人**: 那你会认真倾听黑粉的声音吗？
Original English **Host**: Do you listen to the haters?
**白大拿（Dana White）**: 会啊，当然会。并不是说把耳朵堵上完全不听。你心里得清楚什么是实情、什么纯粹是胡扯。他们只是在发泄，但你身边必须有这些人存在，他们能在某种程度上时刻提醒你保持警惕、维持在最佳竞技状态。
Original English **Dana White**: Yeah. Yeah. It's not like you don't listen to the haters, you know. It's not like you don't you know you know what you know what is real and you know what's just bullshit. They're just, you know, but you have to have these guys. They they they they sort of keep you on your game.
**白大拿（Dana White）**: 大多数人常说要屏蔽噪音，我真正彻底屏蔽掉的，是报道我们这项格斗运动的媒体。我甚至都不把他们当黑粉看，我认为他们说的每一句该死的话全都是错的。每当我看到他们的言论，我都觉得不可思议——一个人怎么可能在这个行业里混了25年，却对这门生意一无所知？但我想这大概也是为什么我们从来没有过真正的竞争对手。因为想想我们所做的一切，历史上从来没有人做成过。我脑子里在谋划什么、行业接下来的走向是什么，这帮人根本不可能知道。所以，几乎所有报道我们这项运动的记者和媒体，我都把他们从我的信息流里拉黑屏蔽了。我根本不想听，他们全都是外行瞎讲，听他们废话纯粹是浪费我的时间。但硬核铁杆粉丝的反馈，包括那些挑刺的、夸我们的，所有这些真实的声音我都喜欢去了解，我很在乎真正受众的想法。
Original English **Dana White**: Now, most people would say I drown that. What I drown out is like the media that covers our sport. I don't look at them as haters. I look at the every fucking thing they say is wrong. And when I look at what they say, it's like it's amazing that you could be involved in this business for 25 years and know nothing about it, you know? But I guess that's why, you know, we've never had any real competitors cuz when you think about what we're doing, it's never been done before. So what I'm thinking and what's coming next, these guys could never know. So all literally all the guys that cover our sport, I block them out of my feed. I don't want to hear. They're all wrong and everything they say is wrong and it's a it's a waste of my time to even listen to anything they say. But the hardcore fans, you know, uh, and the people who hate and the people who say we're great and all this, I like that information. I like hearing what they have to say.
### 顶级管理者的专注力：区分信号与噪音 **主持人**: 你刚才提到的这两点，让我立刻联想到了“专注力”这个话题。你提到了屏蔽噪音。当你身处行业顶峰时，周围有无数人和事都在疯狂争夺你的精力和注意力。
Original English **Host**: The two points you just made, this one and the point before um, brought to mind this point of focus. You talked about these three things. You talked about blocking out the haters. When you're at the top, there are so many things screaming for your energy.
**白大拿（Dana White）**: 确实是这样。
Original English **Dana White**: Sounds right.
**主持人**: 所有人都在喊：“看这边，白大拿，给我分出五分钟的精力和想法吧。”这边有记者在纠缠，那边又有选手跳出来发表言论。所以我很想了解你与“专注”之间的关系，这种专注能力对你的商业成功究竟有多关键？
Original English **Host**: There's a Everybody's going, "Look over here, Dana. Give me five minutes of your thoughts and energy." Then you've got a journalist over here. Then you've got this fighter saint coming out making a comment over here. And so I wanted to understand what your relationship with like focus and how important this idea of focus has been to your success.
**白大拿（Dana White）**: 没错，这就是为什么就像我刚才说的，你必须极其清醒地辨别什么是值得你投入注意力的，什么是你必须彻底置之不理的。
Original English **Dana White**: Yeah. That's why you have to uh like I was saying you have to figure out what you pay attention to and what you don't pay attention to.
**主持人**: 凯文·奥利里（Kevin O'Leary）把这称为“信号与噪音”。
Original English **Host**: Kevin O'Leary called this signal and noise.
**白大拿（Dana White）**: 是的。
Original English **Dana White**: Yeah.
**主持人**: 你之前还跟我推荐过一部很棒的电影。
Original English **Host**: You told me about great film.
**白大拿（Dana White）**: 对。
Original English **Dana White**: Yeah.
**白大拿（Dana White）**: 就是噪音。你必须屏蔽掉大量的噪音。现在的麻烦在于，任何人只要手里有一部他妈的智能手机，就自以为是行业专家了。我并不是全盘否定他们的权利，但这帮人说的往往错得离谱，听他们说话纯粹是浪费生命。我想听的是真实车迷、真实拳迷的声音。我根本不想听那些试图以此起步做播客、做网站、或者在Instagram上开个账号对我们评头品足的人是怎么想的。我想听真正粉丝的心声。而且只要你在这个行业里深耕得足够久，你一眼就能分辨出真伪，看清谁懂行、谁在装懂。所以每当我觉得有人对赛事或比赛给出了切中要害的真知灼见时，我都会认真听。这就像我们排出一套对阵名单（fight card）时一样，我从第一天起就一直在强调：很多人一开始跳出来说“这次的对阵名单太烂了”，但一场比赛打完之前，你根本不能断言它烂不烂，对吧？因为能登上名单的显然全都是才华横溢的顶尖选手，可能有些人年纪轻还没完全证明自己，但在比赛正式打完前你无法草率评判。相信我，如果打完真的很难看，我绝对会是第一个站出来承认它烂的人。所以，现实中很多事情是合乎逻辑的，很多则是无谓的噪音。
Original English **Dana White**: The noise. You got to block out a lot of the noise. The problem is these days anybody with a fucking phone, all right, can can consider themselves an expert and and I'm criticizing what they do, but it's it's just it's always wrong and it's always just such a waste of time. I want to hear what the fans think. I don't want to hear what these guys who are trying to start a podcast or a website or a fucking Instagram account, you know, on the business think. I want to hear what the real fans think. And when when you have been doing this long enough, you can sort of go through and tell what's what and who's who, right? So when when I feel like somebody has made a really good point or an opinion on the show or the match, it's like when we put together a fight, and I've been saying this since day one, they're like, "This card sucks." You can't say the card sucks until it's over, right? Cuz these are obviously all really talented people that are on the card. Maybe some of them are, you know, are younger and haven't proven themselves yet, but you can't judge a card until the card's over. And believe me, if the card sucks, I'll be the first one to say that the card sucked. So, there's just lots of things that are that make sense and things that don't.
### 健康基准与加里·布雷卡（Gary Brecka）带来的蜕变 **主持人**: 在保持精力、维护身体健康以及确保每天都能以极佳状态示人方面，对你产生最大改变的究竟是什么？因为我是通过你才第一次听说加里·布雷卡（Gary Brecka）的，随后我邀请他上了我的节目，那一期播客效果非常好。也是在那之后，我看到了你讲述他是如何改变你的生活的。他是一位彻底重塑了你生命的健康专家。
Original English **Host**: What has made the the biggest difference to you in terms of your energy, your health, and making sure that you can show up really well every day? because I'm I you're the reason I heard about Gary Brecka and then I brought him on the show and he did really really well on the show and then it was that watching you talk about some of the impact he had on your life. He's a health expert that transformed your life.
**主持人**: 我之所以问这个，是因为在我的日常生活中，我也明显感受到了好状态和坏状态之间的巨大波动——无论是精力水平，还是清晰表达自己的思维敏锐度。所以我特别渴望能让自己稳定维持在一个高水准的基线状态。
Original English **Host**: But I I say all this to say that in my life I noticed this variance between my good days and my bad days in terms of energy level, my ability to articulate myself. And so I'm longing to like get to a high baseline.
**主持人**: 所以我很想知道，对你而言，那个彻底改变一切的转折点是什么？
Original English **Host**: So I'm wondering for you like what has that been for you?
**白大拿（Dana White）**: 他完全改变了我的人生。在我年满50岁时，加里·布雷卡改变了我的一切。我本来有两个私人医生，一个在拉斯维加斯，一个在洛杉矶，两个都是极其优秀的顶尖医生。所以当我刚开始接触加里·布雷卡那一套方案时，他们俩甚至合伙打电话质问我：“白大拿，你到底在搞什么鬼？你掺和这玩意儿干什么？”我对他们说：“听着伙计们，加里跟我说‘给我12周时间，我会彻底改变你的人生’。等到第6周的时候再看效果吧。”结果到了第6周，我整个人感觉好极了。我原先有许多医生根本无法治好的慢性顽疾，他们只知道不停地给我换药、开各种各样乱七八糟的药片。其中最严重的一项就是睡眠呼吸暂停综合征（sleep apnea），我过去几乎每晚都会憋醒，甚至严重到因窒息而呕吐，明白吗？
Original English **Dana White**: Yeah, he completely changed my life. When I hit 50, Gary Brecka changed everything. So, I have two doctors, one in Vegas, one in LA. They're both great doctors. So, when I started the whole Gary Brecka thing, they they called me up together. They're like, "Dana, what are you doing? What are you doing with this shit?" And I said, "Listen, man." The guy said, "Give me 12 weeks and I'll change your life. We'll see what happens in in in six weeks." I was like, "Wow, I feel incredible." and all these things that they couldn't fix. They just kept switching up the pills and all this shit. And one of them that was real bad was sleep apnea. I was waking up almost every night and throwing up from from from sleep apnea, right?
**主持人**: 那你当初是怎么跟他结识的？是有人向你引荐的他吗？
Original English **Host**: And how how did you meet him? Someone referred him to you and...
**白大拿（Dana White）**: 凯丽·卡塞姆（Kerri Kasem）。凯丽当时一直跟我说：“我一定要让你见见这个人，我向你保证，他能帮你搞定各种身体毛病。”但我当时根本不想见他。后来最不可思议的巧合发生了，我儿子刚好过21岁生日，我为他在迈阿密举办了21岁庆生派对。
Original English **Dana White**: Kerri Kasem. Kerri Kasem was like, "I want you to meet this guy. I'm telling you, he'll do this and that." I didn't want to meet him. And then the the weirdest thing ever is that my son turned 21 and I had his 21st birthday down in Miami...
**白大拿（Dana White）**: 加里·布雷卡刚好就住在迈阿密。他说：“我们提供静脉注射输液服务，去迈阿密期间我可以全程给你们提供静脉营养输液调理。”我说：“行啊，挺好。”于是我们在迈阿密出去喝酒狂欢，然后回来接受静脉输液。有一天输液的时候，他对我说：“让我抽你一管血吧，我来帮你做一次全面的血液指标检测分析。”
Original English **Dana White**: And Gary Brecka lives in Miami and he says, "Well, we do IVs so we could do all the IVs for you guys down there and whatever." And I said, "All right, cool." So, we would go out and drink and, you know, then do the IVs. And then one day we're doing the IV. And he says, "Let me let me take your blood and let me uh let me do your blood work for you."
**主持人**: 当时加里说拒绝了吗？
Original English **Host**: Gary said, "No."
**白大拿（Dana White）**: 是的。加里有一套模型，号称能根据血液指标预测一个人的剩余寿命。从那一刻起我彻底被这件事抓住了心神，我追问他预测结果……
Original English **Dana White**: Yeah. And Gary had this thing that he could predict, you know, when you would die. And then I became obsessed with that. I said...
**主持人**: 他预测你只剩12年寿命？
Original English **Host**: He gave you 12 years.
**白大拿（Dana White）**: 10年。
Original English **Dana White**: 10.
**主持人**: 他当时断定你只剩10年好活。
Original English **Host**: He gave you 10 years.
**白大拿（Dana White）**: 接下去他说：“给我12周时间，我能彻底扭转你的生命状态。但过程会很艰难苛刻。”我当时就回他：“对我来说不会有任何困难。只要我下定决心，你让我做什么我就不折不扣执行什么。”结果只用了6周。仅仅6周之后，我整个人体会到了前所未有的绝佳状态。头脑思路无比清晰，腿部浮肿和以前身上的各种顽疾全都消失了，严重的睡眠呼吸暂停也彻底根除。我和我妻子后来真心地认为，他当时的预测其实算乐观了——我当时真实的剩余寿命甚至可能连10年都不到，鉴于我原先那种糟糕至极的睡眠窒息以及全身乱七八糟的健康崩溃问题。这个人真的是我生命的再造者。要是没有他，我根本不可能同时兼顾并处理眼前这所有庞杂的事业。我可能勉强还能主持UFC的大局，但绝不可能有体力和精力去拓展所有这些其他的宏大商业版图。没有他，我绝不可能以当下这样高强度的巅峰竞技状态持续运转。
Original English **Dana White**: So then, so then he he he said, "Uh, give me 12 weeks. I'll change your life. It's going to be hard." And I said, "It won't be hard." Once I set my mind to it, I'll I'll do exactly what you tell me to do. It took 6 weeks. 6 weeks in, I was like, I I never felt better. and clarity legs and all these other problems I have and then sleep apnea gone. Me and my wife truly believe that he's wrong. I didn't have 10 years. We thought I had less because of the way that I would sleep and all the shit that was going on with me. And uh you know this guy is a is a life changer. I wouldn't be doing all the things. I mean I'd probably still be doing UFC, but I wouldn't be doing all this other stuff that I'm doing. I wouldn't be able to run at the level I run at right now without him.
**主持人**: 这又让我想到了你的一句名言。
Original English **Host**: I hear another one of your quotes here.
**白大拿（Dana White）**: 是的。
Original English **Dana White**: Yeah.
### 杀手本能与伊恩·加里错失的夺冠时刻 **主持人**：正如那句话所说的：“杀手本能这种东西，要么你天生就有，要么你根本就没有。”这句话实在太正确了。在伊恩·加里（Ian Garry）身上就发生了这样的情况。
Original English **Host**: It says, "You either have the killer instinct or you don't." And it's so true. So, this happened with Ian Garry.
**嘉宾**：你知道……
Original English **Guest**: You know,
**主持人**：我看过你的那次采访。
Original English **Host**: I saw your interview.
**嘉宾**：我当时就觉得，伊恩·加里在那个第五回合里，明明迎来了千载难逢的机会。你面对的可能是综合格斗有史以来最伟大的选手，而且在前面的整整四个回合里，你表现得简直太出色了。你看，对方已经被打得浑身是伤，整个右半边身体都被打烂了，脸上也挂满了彩，但如果按回合比分来看，他依然是领先你的。现在轮到你了，你更年轻，体型更大，臂展和攻击范围也更长，刚刚又打出了如此不可思议的四个回合。这时候你本该冲出去全力以赴、把一切都压上。结果你倒好，一走出去居然开始跟他握手、拥抱。那种事等裁判把冠军金腰带系在你腰上的时候再去做好吗！等比赛彻底结束了，你想给伊斯兰（Islam）表达多少爱意和敬意都可以。可那是第五回合啊！你只有最后五分钟的时间去震撼全世界，你这辈子所有梦寐以求、付出一切汗水去追逐的目标，全都有可能在这接下来的五分钟里实现，而你却没有放手一搏。
Original English **Guest**: I felt like Ian Garry in that fifth round, you have this opportunity. You're fighting possibly the greatest fighter of all time. And you did a damn good [ __ ] job for four rounds. And you know, he was battered. His whole right side was busted up. His face was busted up, but he was beating you as far as rounds go. Now you're the younger, bigger, rangier fighter. You just fought four incredible rounds. Get out there and put it on. You go out and start shaking his hands and hugging him and do that when they're strapping the belt on you. Show Islam all the love you want when the fight's over. This is the fifth round. You have five minutes to shock the world and and you know everything you ever [ __ ] dreamed of and worked for can happen in this next five minutes and you didn't do it.
**主持人**：这是否意味着他身上缺乏这种杀手本能？
Original English **Host**: Does that mean he doesn't have the killer instinct?
**嘉宾**：我说不好。你看，他是一个很有教养、非常有绅士风度的好人，但赛场上绝不是展现绅士风度的合适时间和场合。你必须冲出去，你只剩下最后的五分钟去争取胜利，但他没有展现出来。如果说他体内确实有这种本能，那至少在那个时刻他完全没有拿出来。
Original English **Guest**: I don't know. You know, he's a classy, really nice guy, but that's not the time or place to be it. You have to go out and you have five minutes left to you know, he didn't show it. If he does have it, he didn't show it.
### 商业运营中的野蛮法则与互利共赢 **嘉宾**：对于任何想要成为我们赞助商的企业、公司或者个人，我都绝不是那种随便贴个商标应付了事的人。不是说你拿来一个品牌标志往上一贴，然后我们就干坐着祈祷这能有效果。绝不是这样，我希望看到你赚到、看到你赢。当你选择与我合作，当你的名字印在我们八角笼的帆布地面上时，我希望这能成为一笔对我们双方都切实互利的合作。我真心希望你能大获全胜，我希望你在事后能感慨：“老天，谢天谢地我把这笔钱投在了UFC身上！”
Original English **Guest**: Any company or person that wants to be a sponsor of ours. I'm not a logo slap guy. You just take your logo and slap it in and let's hope this works out. No, I want you to win. When you're with me and and your name is on our canvas, I want this to be a mutually beneficial deal for both of us. I want you to win. And I want you to go, "Damn, thank God I spent my money on the UFC."
**嘉宾**：而且作为掌舵人，你每天早上都必须爬起来，每天都必须去狠狠拼杀、把对手踢得落花流水。这不仅仅是为了你自己，也不仅仅是为了手底下的员工，更是为了你的赞助商，为了合作的转播电视网。我想，这个问题的真正答案就是：你永远都无法脱离困境和险境。在商业世界里，你必须成为一个不折不扣的野蛮人。我的意思是，这正好印证了我刚才说的道理。
Original English **Guest**: And you have to get up and you have to kick ass every single day. Not just for you, not just for your employees, but for your sponsors, the network, and you know, you're never out of the weeds, I guess, is the answer. You have to be an absolute savage in business. I mean, that goes right along with what I was just saying.
**主持人**：你自己是一个野蛮人吗？
Original English **Host**: Are you a savage?
**嘉宾**：我不太喜欢自吹自擂……你懂我的意思吧？我说不好，我宁愿让其他人来评价我到底算不算野蛮人。但我可以毫不犹豫地告诉你这一点：我绝对百分之百具备那种杀手本能。而且只要我来到这里的每一天，我站在这里的唯一目的，就是为了他妈的赢。
Original English **Guest**: I don't like to You know what I mean? I don't know. I would let other people judge whether I am a savage or not. But yes, I will tell you this. I absolutely positively have killer instinct. And every day that I show up here, I'm here to [ __ ] win.
### 创始人的沉重负荷与健康洞察 **主持人**：你可能会觉得，奈斯派索（Nespresso）的前任总裁大概是最难被说服去尝试一家新咖啡公司的人了。然而，仅仅品尝了一口 Cometeer 咖啡，他就决定直接注资入股。不过，让我来告诉你为什么我也成为了这家公司的投资人。当时有一大盒这种咖啡送到了我伦敦办公室的桌子上。我敢说，大概在一到一个半小时之内，我们的团队 Slack 频道就彻底炸开锅了，大家都在疯狂打听：“留在厨房里的那个东西到底是什么神仙玩意儿？”口感真的令人难以置信。他们不会让你在家里手忙脚乱地自己冲泡或调节风味比例，而是在咖啡风味最完美的瞬间将其瞬间速冻锁鲜。因此，你所要做的就是从包装里挤出一颗放进杯子，倒上热水，喝起来的味道绝对超乎你以往品尝过的任何咖啡。你还可以用它调制极为可口的冰咖啡饮料，直接倒进去就行。不需要复杂的咖啡机，也不会有塑料胶囊冲泡时带来的那些让人担心的有害物质。今天访问 cometier.com/stephven，首单即可立减30美元。网址是 cometier.com/stephven。
Original English **Host**: You'd think the former president of Nespresso would be a pretty hard person to convert to a new coffee company. But just one sip of Cometeer coffee made him invest. But let me tell you the reason why I became an investor. So, I had a big box of this arrive on my desk in the London office. And then I'd say within about an hour and a half, the Slack channel that we have starts blowing up with people asking, "What the hell is that thing that's been left in the kitchen?" It is unbelievable. So, instead of trying to make it yourself at home and balance the flavors, they flash freeze it at the perfect moment. So, all you have to do is pop it out of here into a cup, pour hot water on it, and it tastes like nothing you've tasted before. You can also make delicious iced coffee drinks as well. Just pour it in. No machine, no brewing with plastic and all that nasty stuff. And you can get $30 off your first order at cometier.com/stephven today. That's cometier.com/stephven.
**主持人**：接下来我想对正在收听和收看节目的企业创始人们说几句心里话。我非常清楚必须为每一个决策承担个人责任是什么感受。我在21岁时创立了自己的第一家公司，说实话，那种压力有时沉重得令人窒息。那是一种在水面之下悄然侵蚀你健康的巨大精神负荷。我最近通过节目赞助商 Function 做了一系列全面的身体机能检测，这也促使我开始反思这种看不见的隐形影响。检测后我发现，自己体内的欧米伽-3（Omega-3）水平偏低，维生素D严重缺乏——这大概是因为我整天都把自己关在这个昏暗的录音室里工作。这一发现彻底改变了我此后规划日常生活的方式。现在每天早晨醒来，我做的第一件事就是出门在阳光下散步。这一方面是为了帮助提升体内的维生素D水平，另一方面也是为了帮我重置昼夜生物节律。通过 Function，你可以全面检测自己的大脑健康状况、衰老速度、压力负荷等各项指标。他们提供超过160项专业实验室化验，费用折算下来每天只需约一美元，同时会员还可以享受高端影像学检查的专属折扣价。前往 functionhealth.com/doac 注册加入，输入专属优惠码 DOAC25 即可立享25美元抵扣额度。
Original English **Host**: I want to speak to the business owners listening and watching right now. I know what it's like to be personally responsible for every decision. I founded my first company at 21 years old and honestly, the pressure can be immense. It's the kind of mental load that takes its toll below the surface. I recently did some tests through sponsor Function which got me thinking about that invisible impact. I found that I had low levels of omega-3s. I had deficient levels of vitamin D probably because I sit inside this dark room all day. And that has totally changed how I construct my day going forward. I get up in the morning and the first thing I now do is I go for a walk outside in the sunshine. in part to help my vitamin D levels increase, but also because it helps to reset my circadian rhythm. With Function, you can check your brain health, your aging, your stress, and so much more. They provide over 160 lab tests for what is equal to a dollar a day and member pricing on advanced imaging. Head to functionhealth.com/doac to join and use code DOAC25 for a $25 credit.
### 杀手本能的本质：危机感与面对全世界的围剿 **主持人**：在收听这期节目的观众中，肯定有一些刚刚开启职业生涯的年轻人，他们会被你的经历深深激励。他们渴望像你一样取得胜利，希望在自己所追求的任何领域中登上最顶峰。我心中一直在琢磨的问题是：这种凶狠的野性，或者说杀手本能，是可以通过后天学习掌握的吗？在你的经历中，无论是在格斗选手中还是在其他人身上，你是否曾经见过有人从原本不具备这种特质，逐渐转变成拥有这种本能？
Original English **Host**: There's going to be some people listening that are at the start of their careers and that they'll be inspired by you. They'll want to win like you've won. They'll want to climb to the sort of peak of the mountain in whatever pursuit they go after. And the question I'm kind of wondering is like is there a way they can learn this savagery, this killer instinct? Have you ever seen someone go from not having it to having it, whether they were a fighter or someone else?
**嘉宾**：这是一个极好的问题。我不知道自己是否曾经亲眼见过原本没有这种特质的人后来获得了它。我觉得我大概从来没有见过。但有一点是我非常明确知道的：如果你想要自己出来创业经商，你就必须具备某种特定心态，伙计，你必须成为一个杀手。你必须做到这一点，而且你绝不能只考虑你自己。在绝大多数时候，你必须优先去为许许多多其他的人考虑，把他们放在你自己之前。
Original English **Guest**: That's a good question. I don't know if I've ever experienced somebody who didn't have it and got it. I don't think that I have. But here's what I do know. If you want to get into business for yourself, you have to have a certain mindset and you have to be a killer, man. You have to and you have to not just think about yourself. There's a lot of other people that you have to think of more times than less before you.
**主持人**：你认为一个人必须始终带着一种不服输的执念（chip on your shoulder）吗？
Original English **Host**: Do you think you have to have a chip on your shoulder?
**嘉宾**：我不知道是不是非得带着这种执念不可，但你看大多数成功的人确实都有。而之所以会这样，是因为你每天一睁开眼，面对的局势就是你一个人对抗整个世界。我的意思是，所有人都在从四面八方冲着你而来。而且你的事业越成功，情况就越是如此。如果你去调查一下就会发现，历史上任何一家取得巨大成功的企业，对吧？外面都围着一大帮心怀鬼胎的人渣律师，他们千方百计地想要挑刺找茬来起诉你，就咬定你肯定做错了什么事。或者还会发生另一种情况：那些曾经参与过你业务的人，一旦他们自己没能取得成功，那责任就永远都不可能在他们自己身上。
Original English **Guest**: Uh, I don't know if you have to have a chip on your shoulder, but most guys you see do, but it's because you get up every day and it's you versus the world. I mean, everybody's coming at you. And the more successful you get, I mean, if you look this up, I mean, every business that's ever been successful, right? There's a army of scumbag lawyers out there that will find a way to figure out how to sue you because you know you did something wrong. Or the other thing that happens is people that are involved in your business that don't become successful. It's never their fault.
**主持人**：他们没能成功，原因永远都会归咎在别人头上。
Original English **Host**: It's somebody else's fault on why they weren't successful.
**嘉宾**：而且你要知道，市场上始终存在着一批专门从事诉讼投资的律师机构或商业公司，既有规模庞大的大财团，也有小型机构，他们专门提供诉讼资金——你甚至可以跑去跟他们一起出资投资一场诉讼，在里面分一杯羹。所以你每天早上一醒来，不管是无耻小人、普通民众，还是原本的好人，所有人全都在找你的麻烦。
Original English **Guest**: And you know there's always a there are groups of lawyers like companies out there massive companies and smaller ones too that actually fund you can go in and you can invest in a lawsuit with them and be a part of it. So every day when you get up there's just you know scumbags, regular people, good people that are all coming after you.
### 商业竞争与传奇人物的魄力 **主持人**：那我想问一个问题：在你结识过的所有企业家和商界狠角色当中，就商业层面而言，你最不想和谁成为竞争对手？
Original English **Host**: Question then. Which person would you of all the entrepreneurs and killers you've met, which one would you not like to compete with as it relates to business?
**嘉宾**：就商业竞争而言？我不觉得……我想和他们所有人一较高下。
Original English **Guest**: As it relates to business? I don't think I I I want to compete with them all.
**主持人**：但是真的没有哪怕一个人让你有所忌惮吗？
Original English **Host**: But is there anyone?
**嘉宾**：听我说，我们现在所处的层级，正如我之前跟你聊过的，像美式橄榄球大联盟（NFL）以及……
Original English **Guest**: Listen, we're at a level now where I was saying to you the NFL and
**主持人**：是的。
Original English **Host**: Yeah,
**嘉宾**：还有美国职业棒球大联盟（Major League Baseball）。这些机构，首先，他们都已经存在了一百年甚至更久，不管具体是多少年吧。而我现在所处的竞争层级，我们是在和整个体育界最顶尖、最精英中的精英同台竞技。
Original English **Guest**: Major League Baseball, these guys are all, you know, first of all, they've been around for a hundred years or more or less or whatever it is. And I'm at a level now where we're competing with the elite of the elite in sports.
**主持人**：那在你遇到过的所有人当中，谁是最具硬汉魄力（badass）的企业家？
Original English **Host**: Who is the most badass entrepreneur you've ever met?
**嘉宾**：这个我说不好，这问题很难回答。不过确实有一些人是我由衷喜爱和尊敬的，比如迈克尔·乔丹（Michael Jordan），还有卡尔·伊坎（Carl Icahn）。我特别欣赏像他们这样的人物。
Original English **Guest**: Uh I don't know. That's a tough one. Like there's guys that I like and respect like the Michael Jordans, Carl Icahn. I like guys like that, you know.
### 打破偏见的独角兽：隆达·罗西与超级巨星的气场 **主持人**：那与你合作过的运动员呢？有没有哪位运动员，在特定特质上让你觉得完全独树一帜、无人能及？
Original English **Host**: What about athletes that you've worked with? Was there any that you sort of put in a class of their own in terms of
**嘉宾**：康纳·麦格雷戈（Conor McGregor）、哈比卜·努尔马戈梅多夫（Khabib Nurmagomedov），还有处于巅峰时期的查克·利德尔（Chuck Liddell）。还有隆达·罗西（Ronda Rousey）——你知道的，现在总有人喜欢在背后对隆达·罗西说三道四、恶语相向。
Original English **Guest**: Conor McGregor, Khabib Nurmagomedov, Chuck Liddell when you know it was his time. Ronda Rousey, you know, people that you know want to talk [ __ ] about Ronda Rousey.
**嘉宾**：现在让我告诉你当初隆达·罗西是怎么找上我的。我当时根本就不想在UFC引入女子格斗比赛，对吧？原因在于，当时我正在努力向各大转播电视网和赞助商推销男子选手的比赛，而他们的反应就是觉得女子格斗太过于怎样怎样，并不看好。后来隆达·罗西在一场活动中直接拦住了我，对我说：“嘿，我是隆达·罗西。我能借用你15分钟时间吗？”我们一起走进了我在比赛场馆里的休息室。我也不知道具体聊了多久，仅仅谈话开始了几分钟，我心里就忍不住惊呼：“我的天哪，我觉得我真的要干这件事了。”而且她就是那个最适合一起开启这项事业的人。她走进来时浑身带着那种霸气十足的气魄。你要是想聊什么叫带着一身傲骨和执念（chip on your shoulder）？她身上展现得淋漓尽致。你看，现在有那么多人想要黑她、诋毁她，但她绝对是一只绝无仅有的独角兽。
Original English **Guest**: Now let me tell you what Ronda Rousey came to me. I didn't want women in the UFC, right? And the reasoning is I was trying to sell men to networks and sponsors and they were like this is too whatever women. Ronda Rousey grabbed me at an event, said, "Hey, I'm Ronda Rousey. Can I get 15 minutes with you?" We went into my room at the arena and I don't know, minutes into the conversation, I'm like, "Holy [ __ ] I think I'm going to do this." And she's the one to do it with, you know, and she came in with the whole [ __ ] bravado. You want to talk about a chip on your shoulder? I mean, she had it. You know, so many people now want to hate on her. She is a [ __ ] unicorn.
**主持人**：这些人身上究竟共同具备着什么特质？康纳、哈比卜、隆达，这到底是一种什么样的……
Original English **Host**: What do these people have? The Conors, the Khabibs, the Ronda. What is
### 康纳·麦格雷戈与“愿景显化”的信念力量 **白大拿（Dana White）**：……是他吗？康纳·麦格雷戈（Conor McGregor）。我们签下他的时候，我跟他一起去吃了一顿晚饭。吃完那顿饭离开后，我立刻打电话给洛伦佐·费尔蒂塔（Lorenzo Fertitta）。我对他说：“兄弟，我不知道这家伙到底能不能打，但只要他哪怕能挥出一记像样的拳头，他也绝对会成为一个超级巨星。他太不可思议了。”
Original English **Dana White**: ...it? Conor McGregor. I went to dinner with him when we signed him. I left that dinner. I called Lorenzo Fertitta. And I said, "Dude, I don't know if this guy can fight or not, but if he can even throw a punch, he's going to be a massive superstar. He's he's incredible."
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：他身上到底有什么特质吸引了你？
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: What was it?
**白大拿（Dana White）**：在这个行业里，首要的因素当然是：你到底能不能打？你的实力到底有多强？而第二点，就是那种关于“显化”（manifesting）的心态——你就坐在那里，看着我，一五一十地告诉我你接下来要做什么、这一切将会如何发生、整个局面会如何一步步展开。在我从业这25年里，这样的人和这样的会面，我总共只遇到过寥寥数次，屈指可数。
Original English **Dana White**: Well, the number one factor in this business, can you fight? How good are you? Number two is that is this this mentality of manifesting and just sitting there and you're telling me what you're going to do and how it's going to happen and how it's all going to play out. And I've only had a handful of these meetings in 25 years. A handful.
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：从这个角度来说，你真的相信“显化法则”吗？
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: Do you believe in manifestation in that regard?
**白大拿（Dana White）**：噢，显化是真实存在的，我本人就是显化力量的坚定信奉者。当你真正下定决心认清自己是谁、明确自己想做什么、清晰知道自己要达成什么目标，并且每天早晨醒来都全力以赴朝着它去奋斗时，你是绝不可能失败的。
Original English **Dana White**: Oh, manifesting is real and I'm a I'm a big believer in in manifesting. When you decide who you are, what you want to do, what you're going to accomplish and you get up every single day and you work toward it, it is impossible for you to fail.
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：有些人却只抓住了这种想法的一面。他们会说：“我就坐在这里空想好了，我要做一个属于自己的愿景板（vision board）。”但他们之后却根本不会走出去真正踩下油门。
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: Some people just take one side of that bug and they'll say, "I'll just sit here and think about it. I'll make my vision board." But then they won't get out and press the pedal.
**白大拿（Dana White）**：没错。
Original English **Dana White**: Right.
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：这就像是坐进车库里的车里，在导航仪上设定好了目的地，但你却从来不把脚踩到油门踏板上一样。
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: It's kind of like getting in a car in your garage and setting the satnav, but not, you know, putting your foot down.
### 行动、目标与重新定义“成功与失败” **白大拿（Dana White）**：完全正确，就是不去踩油门。你说得太对了。你坐进车里，设定好了你那该死的GPS导航系统，然后你却永远不去踩油门，那你他妈的就哪儿也去不了！但是，如果你制定好了周密的计划，清楚自己是谁，明确自己要做什么，你就不可能失败。而且退一步讲，失败到底意味着什么？
Original English **Dana White**: That's exactly right. Not stepping on the gas. You're right. Yeah, you go in there and you program your [ __ ] you know your GPS system and then you never step on the gas and you never [ __ ] go anywhere. But yeah, if you lay out your plan, you know who you are, you know what you want to do, it's impossible to fail. And then then what does failure mean?
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：嗯。
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: Mhm.
**白大拿（Dana White）**：究竟什么才算失败？在我看来，人生的成功标准只有一条：你过得快乐吗？你每天清晨醒来，是否由衷热爱自己正在做的事？你懂我的意思吧，我认识很多身家亿万的富豪，但他们其实是极其痛苦、极其悲惨的人。
Original English **Dana White**: What what what does failure mean? My thing about success in life is are you happy? Do you get up every day and love what you do? You know, I know a lot of billionaires that are miserable, miserable human beings.
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：为什么会这样？
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: Why?
**白大拿（Dana White）**：我不知道为什么。听着，快乐本身是一种选择。你热爱你所做的事吗？你想不想每天起床后都快快乐乐的？对我而言，这就是成功的关键所在。我可以给你讲一个关于我儿子的故事。前几天我大儿子打电话给我，说：“爸，我需要一些人生方向。我正在考虑某些事情……”而我总是对我的孩子们说：“我只希望你们能快乐。”他立刻说：“爸，别再给我来你那一套该死的‘快乐说教’了，我现在被困住了，我需要切切实实的指导，帮我理清眼前的头绪。”后来我觉得我们进行了一次非常深入有益的交流，挂掉电话时他也显得挺开心的。
Original English **Dana White**: I don't know why. It's just listen, being happy is a choice. Do you love what you do? Do you want to get up? Do you want to be happy every day? And and to me, that's the key to success. I actually I'll tell you a story of my son. My oldest son called me the other day and he's like, "Dad, I need some direction. You know, I'm thinking about this d and I always tell my kids, I want you guys to be happy." He goes, "Dad, don't give me your [ __ ] happy speech. He's beat. I need some [ __ ] direction and help me figure this out. So, I think we had a good conversation and uh he seemed happy when we got off the phone, but yeah.
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：他当时是想在什么事情上寻求方向？
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: What did he want direction on?
**白大拿（Dana White）**：就是些人生选择，那些他此刻正面迎上的重大抉择。千万不要成为那种躺在临终病床上奄奄一息时，心里却想着“要是当初我尝试过，结果会怎样”的人。我绝不想带着任何遗憾离开这个世界，我不想那样。而且坦白讲，我现在没有任何遗憾。我真的不后悔任何事。即使你硬逼着我，让我必须说出一件自己后悔的事，我也认为自己找不出一件来。我确实一件遗憾也没有。
Original English **Dana White**: Yeah, just just life choices that he's he's looking down the barrel of right now. Don't be that guy that's laying in the hospital bed dying saying, "I wonder what would happen if I tried." Yeah. I don't want any regrets. I don't want to be, you know, I I I don't want any regrets. And I don't right now. I I I don't regret anything. If you if you pushed me hard and said, "Tell me one thing that you regret." I don't believe that I have any. I don't believe that I have any.
### 告别过去：不看后视镜的人生哲学 **史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：我知道你不太喜欢我聊这个话题，但我还是想问问你在这方面是否有过遗憾——你的父母在前几年相继过世了。
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: I know you don't like it when I go here, but I wanted to wanted to ask you if you have any of that. Your parents have passed away a couple years ago.
**白大拿（Dana White）**：关键就在这里。当你聊起这个话题，或者聊到像你做这档《CEO日记》（The Diary Of A CEO）播客时，我认为生活并不是千篇一律的模版印章。每个人都有自己的经历，你的成长轨迹和我不同，大家的成长环境也各不相同。毫无疑问，年幼时的很多经历会对你产生深远的影响。但我极度讨厌过去。我不喜欢回头看过去，这不仅仅指我的童年，对任何事都是如此。去他妈的后视镜！那根本无关紧要。昨天发生过的任何事，在今天都毫无意义。对现在的年轻人来说，你永远不能让过去绑架你的未来，明白吗？所以经常有人问我：“嘿，你难道就从来没有回头看过，然后感慨‘哇，当年我们居然做成了那件事’吗？”去他的，从来没有！因为不管我们过去做过什么，它唯一的意义就是把我带到了今天这里。
Original English **Dana White**: Well, that's the thing. when you when you talk about like you know this podcast diary to CEO I I don't think that that it's all you know cookie cutter and stamp everybody has their own things you grew up different than I grew up all you grew up different than we grew up and there are things that you know obviously had big impressions on you when you were young but I hate the past I don't I don't like the past and it's not just my childhood or anything like that [ __ ] the rearview mirror, it doesn't matter. Whatever happened yesterday means nothing today. And some of these kids, you can never let the past affect your future, right? So people say to me, "Hey, do you ever look back and go, wow, we did this and no, [ __ ] that. Cuz whatever we did back then got me to here."
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：没错，我们就在此刻。
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: Right? We're here.
**白大拿（Dana White）**：几个小时之前刚发生的事情，现在就已经连屁都不是了，它已经烟消云散了。下一个目标是什么？接下来该做什么？下一步是什么？我从来不会回头深陷于过去。当然，你会从中吸取教训，无论好坏你都会有所收获。但是有些人整天坐在那里抱怨：“你根本不懂我爸爸当年对我妈妈做过什么……”去他妈的，谁在乎那些该死的事啊？大家都经历过各种烂事，闭上嘴巴吧！那已经不再重要了。别让过去影响你的未来。所以有人会问我：“你难道就从来不曾坐下来好好反思反省吗？”去他的，不，我从不反思回头。我心里想的全是明天会发生什么，未来会发生什么，接下来的几天里又会有谁跑来找我的麻烦，我们该如何继续扩张，如何变得更庞大、更优秀。我现在57岁了，但我希望明天的自己在方方面面都比今天更强，只要是有可能变得更好的地方，我都要更进一步。
Original English **Dana White**: What just happened a few hours ago doesn't mean [ __ ] anymore. It's gone. Right? What's next? what's next? What's next? I don't ever look back and let you know, you learn some things and you learn some lessons and you know, good and bad or whatever happens. But these people who sit around go, you don't understand my dad did to my mom and [ __ ] who gives a [ __ ] [ __ ] everybody went through that stuff. Shut up. That doesn't matter anymore. Don't let the past affect your future. So people will say, "Do you ever just sit around and reflect?" [ __ ] no, I don't reflect. I'm thinking about what's happening tomorrow and what's going to happen and you know who's going to come after me in the next [ __ ] few days and you know how do we build and how do we get bigger and how do we get better you know I'm 57 but I want to be better tomorrow than I was today in every way that you can possibly be better
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：你一直以来都是这种性格吗？
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: have you always been like that
**白大拿（Dana White）**：我想是的，我想我一直都是这样。昨天对我来说从来不重要，你只需要从中吸取经验教训，无论好坏，对吧？就像有些孩子长大后总抱怨自己成长过程中没有任何榜样——噢不，你当然有榜样。
Original English **Dana White**: I think so I think I've always been that way yesterday never mattered to me you know you took whatever lessons you had from that good or bad right it's like it's Like these kids that grew up and said they didn't have any role models, you know? Oh, yes, you did.
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：这意味着你身边有无数的榜样？这是否意味着你不会……你在任何事情上都不会受到伤害？
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: Does that mean you had tons of them? Does that mean that you can't You're not hurt by things?
**白大拿（Dana White）**：从来不会。
Original English **Dana White**: Never.
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：你在任何事情上都从来不会受到伤害？
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: You're never hurt by things.
**白大拿（Dana White）**：从来不会被任何事伤到。
Original English **Dana White**: Never hurt by things.
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：真的吗？
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: Really?
### 坚硬的铠甲：家庭铸就的韧性与无视外界噪音 **白大拿（Dana White）**：从来不会受伤，一点都不会。总有人问我，那些和我关系亲近的人会问：“你上一次哭是什么时候？”我他妈甚至都不知道自己上一次哭是什么时候。哭能起什么作用？哭在任何形式或层面上能解决哪怕一点该死的问题吗？或许对某些人来说哭泣挺管用的，但哭泣对我来说毫无作用。我不是一个会掉眼泪的人，想要伤害我的感情那可真他妈是难上加难。这得归功于我的父母，还有我的叔叔婶婶、舅舅阿姨们。我的意思是，我们全家当年是一群极其严苛强硬的人。当那些本该爱你、呵护你的人，嘴里都会对你说出那样尖酸刻薄的话时，你觉得站在这边的那个局外人又算老几？你真以为我会在乎这个家伙是怎么想的吗？这就像外界成天讨论的所谓“被取消（cancel culture）”。到底有谁能真正取消你？就因为《纽约时报》不喜欢我？去他妈的《纽约时报》！我根本不在乎《纽约时报》怎么说。在我的生命里，有一小群对我至关重要的人，我在乎他们，他们的看法和我们之间的关系对我来说分量极重。如果他们当中有人离去，那确实会让我感到痛苦难受。但至于其他人，我他妈的何必在乎网上三两个跳梁小丑的想法？或者某个写文章的记者？抑或是该死的《纽约时报》——在疫情期间《纽约时报》简直是像疯了一样盯我的茬。但我心里从来都是这么看待这些事情的。
Original English **Dana White**: Never hurt by things. Yeah. And people always, you know, people that are close to me would like, "When's the last time you cried?" [ __ ] I don't even know the last time I cried. What does crying do? What does How does crying [ __ ] help in any way, shape, or form? And you know, maybe for some people crying's great. Crying doesn't [ __ ] work for me. I'm not a crier. And it's pretty [ __ ] hard to hurt my feelings. And I'll give that to my mom and dad, my uncles and aunts. I mean, we had a [ __ ] tough crew. When people who were supposed to love you would say the things that these guys would say to you, you know what what is [ __ ] this guy over here. I think I give a [ __ ] what this guy thinks. It's like when we talk about getting cancelled. Who can really cancel you, right? Oh, the New York Times doesn't like that. I [ __ ] the New York Times. Give a [ __ ] about the New York Times. I have a group of people in my life that mean something to me, right? That I care about. Their opinions, you know, my relationships with them, whatever mean a lot to me. And if one of them went away, that that would bother me, right? other everybody else would I give a [ __ ] what you know three guys on the [ __ ] internet think or you know some guy who writes for something or the [ __ ] New York Times which you know through co New York Times was on my ass like crazy but this this is what I always think about.
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：你的意思是说，这种特质源于你年幼的时候，那些本该对你说温柔体贴的话、给予你无微不至关爱的人，反而对你说尽了刻薄难听的话，从而无形中塑造了你强大的心理韧性？
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: And are you saying that came from the fact that people that were supposed to say nice things and be super affectionate and cushy when you were younger they were saying horrible things so it kind of built a resilience in you?
**白大拿（Dana White）**：毫无疑问，绝对是这样。他们将我彻底打造成了适合这种人生和环境的钢铁之躯。我总是说，如果人生能够重来，我绝不会改变自己童年的任何一件事，我也不想要不同的父母、不同的家庭或是另一种成长环境。那段经历对我而言是极其珍贵的。
Original English **Dana White**: No [ __ ] doubt about it. No doubt about it. They built me for this for this life and this uh you know and I always say I wouldn't take back one thing from my childhood or want different parents or a different family or a different setup. It was incredible.
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：他们当年究竟会对你说些什么？
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: What were they saying to you?
**白大拿（Dana White）**：听着，我本身就是一个喜欢挑刺打击人、不给别人留情面的人，无论对我朋友还是身边的团队我都喜欢这么互相损。而我的家庭当年就是这么对待彼此的。我的家庭是一个极其严苛硬核的群体。比如我很爱我的外婆和祖母，两边的祖母都特别棒。你知道的，在你年纪还小的时候，世上没有什么比拥有出色的祖父母更美好的事情了。现在看这段采访的每一个人，只要一想起自己的祖父母，都会觉得“啊，没错，祖父母永远是世界上最好的”。但比如我的爱尔兰裔祖母，如果你对她说：“嗨，奶奶，我爱你。”她根本连理都不会理你，顶多来一句：“很高兴见到你，回见吧。”
Original English **Dana White**: Uh I don't listen I I I'm a ball buster. I like to bust balls and and whatever even with my friends and my crew and that's the way my family was. My family was a hard group. Like my grandmother w- which I love. Both my grandmothers on both sides were incredible. You know, there's nothing better in life when you're young than to have great grandparents. I mean, everybody watching this right now, everybody thinks of their grandparents and like, "Ah, yeah, your grandparents were the best and all that shit." Like my grandmother, my Irish grandmother on on my that you say, "Hey, I love you, Graham." [ __ ] nothing back. Good to see you. See you later.
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：真的吗？
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: Really?
**白大拿（Dana White）**：是真的。在我们长大的环境里，根本不存在任何温情脉脉的温室氛围，一点都没有。就是那样。
Original English **Dana White**: Yeah. Yeah. There was none of that type of [ __ ] growing up. Yeah. Yeah. There you go.
**史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）**：当我听说这件事的时候，我的第一反应是：“天哪。”所以，这是一本你母亲写的书……
Original English **Steven Bartlett**: I when I heard about this, I thought, "Oh, shit." So, this is a book that your mother
**白大拿（Dana White）**：其实我从来没有真正翻看过那本该死的书……
Original English **Dana White**: I've actually never seen the actual [ __ ]
### 未经授权的自传与家庭裂痕 **访谈者**：这是一本你母亲出版的书，是一部未经授权的关于你的个人传记。
Original English **Interviewer**: This is a book your mother published about you unauthorized as a biography.
**Dana White**：是的。她在里面放了一堆我小时候的照片，还有各种乱七八糟的东西。但我认为，这种事情其实屡见不鲜。我是说，她甚至把我结婚的照片也放进去了，还有各种隐私。
Original English **Dana White**: Yeah. And put a bunch of pictures in here of me when I was a kid and all this shit. But I think, you know, this happens a lot. I mean, she put my fucking wedding pictures in here and all this shit.
**访谈者**：而且她出这本书事先并没有征得你的同意。
Original English **Interviewer**: And she didn't ask you to publish this book.
**Dana White**：完全没有。把结婚照片和一堆乱七八糟的东西全印在上面。你看，我之前看到过科比·布莱恩特（Kobe Bryant）的一些事情，科比甚至不得不通过法律途径起诉他的母亲，因为她把他卧室里的各种私人物品拿出去拍卖。这种事情确实会发生，哥们儿，真会发生。这固然令人遗憾，不过坦白说，我其实从来没看过这本书，这还是我第一次亲眼见到它。
Original English **Dana White**: No. Put fucking wedding pictures in here and all this shit. I mean, you know, I saw some Kobe Bryant stuff where Kobe had to like sue his mom. She was selling his shit from his bedroom and, you know, it happens, man. It happens. It's unfortunate and I've actually never seen the book. It's the first time I've ever seen the book.
**访谈者**：我不会大声朗读其中的段落，但在书里，她在某些地方对你提出了尖锐的批评。特别是最后一页，我读过那一页，她在上面写了很多批评你的话。我很好奇，你们之间究竟是在哪个时间节点走到了这一步？
Original English **Interviewer**: I'm not going to read it out or anything, but in the book, she's critical of you at certain points. Specifically, the last page, which I read, she says critical things, and I was wondering where along the way did that happen?
**Dana White**：嗯，我从来没读过它，这也是我第一次见到这本书。我刚才只是随便翻了翻里面的插图，只觉得这简直是疯得不可理喻，彻头彻尾的疯癫。
Original English **Dana White**: Well, I've never read it. And that's the first time I've ever seen it. And I was just flipping through like the pictures like, you know, it's batshit nuts. Batshit nuts.
**访谈者**：在你们共同走过的岁月里，到底发生了什么导致你们彻底反目？
Original English **Interviewer**: Where along the way did that happen that you fell out with her?
**Dana White**：有一次我出差在外。那还是很久以前的事，当时出门在外还没有便捷的电子邮件之类。我和我的合伙人洛伦佐·费尔蒂塔（Lorenzo Fertitta）一起在伦敦待了差不多两周。等我回去之后查收邮件，发现她给我发了一堆带有威胁性质的信件。大意是：“你必须在某某期限前给我汇这么多钱。你有两个选择：要么一次性全部结清，要么在接下来的时间里分期付清。我想盘下一家酒吧”，诸如此类的话。 由于我当时人在伦敦，没有及时回复她，结果她的邮件措辞一封比一封刻薄、恶毒，到最后简直不堪入目。我当时直接就彻底爆发了。那件事便成了我和她关系走向终结的起点。是的，当你获得成功时，这种事情往往就会找上门来。不仅仅是旁人，听着，有时候家庭内部的伤害反而是最深的。
Original English **Dana White**: I was on a trip one time. This was before, you know, I didn't have emails and all that shit on the road. And I was with Lorenzo Fertitta, my partner, and we were in London for like two weeks. And when I got back, I checked my emails and I have like a bunch of emails from her like threatening me: "You're going to send me this much money by... you have two options. You can give me this all upfront or you can pay me payments over the next fucking whatever. I'm looking to buy a bar" or whatever it was. And then she wasn't getting responses because I was in London. And then the email started getting nastier and nastier and nastier by the end. And I was like, I just fucking blew up. And that was the beginning of the end with me and her. Yeah. So these things happen when you become successful. It's not just, listen, sometimes family is the worst.
### 父母失败与放下怨恨 **访谈者**：有时候家庭带来的伤害确实更为沉重，相比之下，报纸上写的那些流言蜚语简直不值一提。
Original English **Interviewer**: Sometimes family's worse than, like when we talk about things that are being said in newspapers and things like that, pale in comparison to what you can get from some family members.
**Dana White**：不过我还有另一大家子亲人，比如表亲们，我和我妹妹感情也非常深厚。我的意思是，听着，我一直都在说这句话：我们每个人在人生的某些层面都会遭遇失败。但在我看来，如果你在为人父母这件事上失败了，那就是最彻底的失败。 我母亲去世的时候，我和我妹妹都没有再跟她说过话。我妹妹有她自己的一套痛苦经历。在我身上，矛盾在于金钱；而在我妹妹身上，则是其他方面的伤害。所以，我们后来跟父母双方都断绝了往来。
Original English **Dana White**: But I have a whole another group of family like cousins and you know me and my sister super... I mean listen, I say this all the time. We all fail at certain things in life. In my opinion, if you fail as a parent, it's the ultimate failure. It's the ultimate failure. My mom passed away without me or my sister talking to her. My sister had her own set of issues. With me it was money. With my sister it was other things. So, we didn't talk to either one of my parents.
**访谈者**：你原谅她了吗？
Original English **Interviewer**: Have you forgiven her?
**Dana White**：嗯，原谅了。听着，我从不上节目去公开讲我母亲的坏话。正如我之前对你说的，我不会改变过去的任何经历。人们常常问：“你觉得你今天能取得这样的成就，是因为你的父母吗？”绝对是，百分之百如此。无论好坏、优劣，随你怎么评价。 我的双亲都已经离世了。我不想四处宣扬父母的丑事，但说实话，遭遇那种事，是你亲身经历之前根本无法想象的最恶心、最令人作呕的事情之一。可面对这种情况，你能怎么办？难道整天哭哭啼啼，到处抱怨“噢，你们根本不懂我承受了什么”吗？
Original English **Dana White**: Um, yeah. Listen, I don't go on shows to speak negatively about my mother. You know, I was telling you earlier, I wouldn't change anything. And you know, people say, "Do you think you are where you are today because of your parents?" Absolutely, 100%. Good, bad, whatever, however you want to look at it. My parents passed... I don't want to tell bad stories about my parents, but I mean that's one of the grossest, most disgusting things that you couldn't even imagine possible until it happens to you. And what are you going to do? You're going to fucking cry about it and, "Oh, you don't understand my shit"?
### 后视镜毫无意义：拒绝受害者心态 **访谈者**：你把它当成了一个契机。
Original English **Interviewer**: You got an opportunity.
**Dana White**：事情已经发生了，既成事实，事情就是这样。那件事最恶劣的地方，以及她所犯下的最大过错，在于那本书伤害了许多无辜的人。她并没有真正伤害到我，而是伤害了其他人。书里写了许多与事实不符的内容，波及了许多根本没有招惹过她的人。再次重申，我从没看过那本书，但律师向我通报过内容，诸如此类的破事。再加上她私自公开了那些极其私密的个人照片，她根本没有权利那么做。 但这种事就是这样，当你成名立业之后，这种破事就会找上门来。
Original English **Dana White**: It happened and, you know, it is what it is. The thing that's bad about that and what she did is a lot of other people I think she hurt in that book. She didn't hurt me, but other people that, you know, a lot of things that aren't true and a lot of people that didn't do anything to her in that book that, you know, and again, I've never read it, but I've had lawyers tell me about it, shit like that. And then the personal private pictures that she just threw out there that she really didn't have the right to do. It's one of those things that when you become successful, this type of shit happens to you.
**访谈者**：你有一位极好的伴侣，就像我一样。你在皮尔斯·摩根（Piers Morgan）的访谈中提到过她总喜欢对你进行心理剖析？我的未婚妻也会做一模一样的事。我觉得我的未婚妻内心深处认定我心理肯定有问题，并且一直在不断寻找能证明我“心理受创”的证据，部分原因就是她知道我童年的成长经历以及我和父母的关系。因此她先入为主地认为我肯定不正常，看到任何风吹草动都当作佐证。
Original English **Interviewer**: You have a wonderful partner like I do. On Piers Morgan you talked about her psychoanalyzing you? My fiancée does the same thing. I think my fiancée deep down thinks I must be fucked up and is in constant search of evidence that I am fucked up, in part because she knows of my childhood and my relationship with my parents. So, she assumes that I must be fucked up and everything is confirmation of it.
**Dana White**：对，她会陷入那种模式，开始对我讲大道理，试图跟我探讨我的内心感受。她会问：“你对这件事情到底是怎么想的？”这也是为什么在皮尔斯·摩根采访我时，我对他说：“你听起来就跟我妻子一模一样。你认定了‘你不可能不受创伤，这根本不符合常理’。”我说：“这完全可能，而且你彻底想错了。” 一旦你接受了那样的采访，就像在这次访谈中同样会发生的那样，人们就会开始议论：“噢，这家伙居然完全没有被逼疯，他肯定是个冷酷的变态。”或许吧，也许他们是对的，我不知道。但我真不喜欢聊这些破事，因为归根结底，这些过去的事根本无所谓，毫无意义。 就像我常说的，后视镜里的景象根本不重要，对吧？让我告诉你，在人生的道路上，你绝对不会被过往追尾，除非你在过去做过某些伤天害理的恶事，它们才会倒折回来找你清算。后视镜对我来说没有任何意义。我从过往中学到了教训，我经历了这一切，其中有些经历无比美好，有些则痛苦不堪，但正是所有这些塑造了今天的我，这才是唯一重要的事情。
Original English **Dana White**: Well, she'll get into this thing where she'll start telling me, she'll try to talk about my feelings. She's like, "How do you feel about this?" And that's why when Piers Morgan was, I said, "You sound like my wife. It's impossible for you not to be able." Yeah. I said, "It's not impossible and no, you're wrong." And then once you do an interview like that, and it'll happen in this interview, too, it's like then people start going, "Oh, this guy's got to be a psycho not to fucking..." you know, and maybe that's true. Maybe you're right. I don't know. But I don't like to talk about this kind of shit cuz it doesn't matter at the end of the day. It doesn't matter. Like I said, the rear-view mirror means nothing, right? Let me tell you what's not going to... you're not going to get rear-ended in life unless you did some horrible things in your past that are going to come back and fucking get you or whatever. The rearview mirror means nothing to me. I learned from it. I had these experiences, some incredible, some not incredible, but they all built who I am today and that's all that matters.
### 从逆境中向前：对母职艰辛的客观敬意 **访谈者**：我认为正因如此，去谈论这些才显得尤为重要。因为许多人在生活中常常陷入一种消极思维：“如果这种厄运发生在我身上，我不可能再有未来，不可能取得成功，我根本无法走出阴影。”因此，听到一个客观上经历过极其动荡、艰难困苦成长环境的人，能够彻底将自己与那段过去剥离，坚定地昂首向前，我认为这具有极其重要的现实意义，因为它向所有人证明了这是完全行得通的。
Original English **Interviewer**: I think therefore it does matter because a lot of people go through life thinking that if this happened to me I can't possibly have a future, be successful, I can't possibly move forward. And so hearing someone that went through, in my view, an objectively very tumultuous, very difficult upbringing and has been able to separate themselves from it and look forward, I think means it does matter because it shows that it's possible.
**Dana White**：话虽如此，我永远不想摆出一副受害者的姿态坐在这里大倒苦水，我与所谓的“受害者”八竿子打不着。我认为，特别是对于在上世纪七八十年代长大的人来说，大家在各个层面都经历过许多糟糕透顶的破事。那完全是一个不同的时代、不同的社会环境。 我深知我的父母以及上一辈的祖父母，他们成长在一个更加严酷的世界和时代。对他们而言，生活同样充满了艰辛，他们一路经历的风风雨雨才最终把他们塑造成了后来的模样。所以我并不怨恨他们，我心中对他们没有怨气。 我和我妹妹私下聊起母亲时，我们常常会感叹：“她当年到底是怎么扛过来的？”她是一个单亲母亲，我父亲则是那副不管不顾的样子。一个单亲妈妈拼命工作、起早贪黑，撑起整个家，她确实做到了，她拉扯大了两个孩子，不是吗？抛开后来发生的种种不愉快，抛开那本书和所有的争端，她当年确实是一个人独自带大了两个孩子。带着两个孩子、一条狗，开着一辆车横跨整个美国，从波士顿一路搬迁到拉斯维加斯。我们开着车穿州过省，我还记得途经中西部时漫天肆虐的龙卷风，以及我们所经历的各种艰难险阻，这一切全凭她一个人扛了过来。 她完全是靠一己之力做到的。所以，尽管我和我妹妹在她生命最后的岁月里多年未曾与她交谈，但我们依然认可她的付出，并由衷尊重她当年的坚韧与作为。
Original English **Dana White**: Well, I don't ever want to sit down and talk about things where I'm like some victim. I'm the furthest thing from a victim. And I think that especially if you grew up in the '70s and '80s, a lot of bad shit happened to you in a lot of different ways. It was just a different time, a different place. And I think that my parents and my grandparents before them, they grew up in a different world and different times. And things weren't easy for them either. They went through some shit that got them to where they were. And I don't blame them. I don't have any ill feelings toward... me and my sister will talk about my mom and we'll be like, "How the fuck did she do it?" She was a single mom. My dad was what he was. Single mom, worked her ass off, did all this stuff and she did it. She raised two kids, right? No matter all the bad things or whatever that happened, the book and all that, she raised two kids by herself and moved across country from Boston to Vegas, with two kids and a dog and a car. We drove cross country. I remember we were going through the Midwest and there were tornadoes coming and all the stuff that we did and we went through, she did it. She did it by herself. And my sister and I, even though we didn't talk to her for years at the end of her life, we credit her and respect what she did.
### 家庭观念的互补 **访谈者**：安（Anne）其实说得多少有点道理，不是吗？因为我的伴侣通常也说得很对，只是我从不当面承认罢了。
Original English **Interviewer**: Anne is a little bit right, isn't she? Cuz my partner is a little bit right. I don't tell her.
**Dana White**：哈哈，是的。她是意大利裔。
Original English **Dana White**: Yeah. She's Italian.
**访谈者**：你的妻子安？
Original English **Interviewer**: Your wife Anne?
**Dana White**：是的。你看，他们全家人时刻都在一起。当你看到那样一种家庭结构时——那与我的原生家庭完全是截然相反的极端——能亲眼见证这种和睦其实非常美妙。所以对我而言，我算是体会到了两种截然不同世界的全貌。她的家庭氛围棒极了，在当年我打拼创业的整个过程中……
Original English **Dana White**: Yeah. You know, they're all together all the time and, you know, but when you have that type of a family structure, which is the complete fucking opposite of what mine was, it's cool to see. So, I have sort of the best of both worlds and her family's great, you know, anytime while I was building...
### 相信直觉而非焦点小组 **嘉宾**：……做这项生意，她的家人都在帮忙照顾孩子，大家一起共事，共同完成了这一切。所以，我很幸运能够经历这两种生活。
Original English **Guest**: ... this business, her family was helping with the kids and they all worked together and they all did all this. So, you know, I I I've been lucky that I've been able to experience both.
**主持人**：屏幕下方应该有一个按钮。如果上面显示“已订阅”，说明你已经订阅了；如果显示的是“订阅”，说明你还没订阅。如果你还没订阅，能否帮我们一个忙，点击那个按钮？这对节目的支持超出你的想象。根据算法推介，你经常观看我们的节目，但还没有点击订阅按钮。非常感谢大家。好了，我们还有最后两个原则。我们继续。
Original English **Host**: There should be a button just down below here. And if it says subscribed, you're already subscribed. If it says subscriber, that means you're not yet. And if you're not subscribed, please could you do us a favor and hit that button? It helps the show more than you know. And according to the algorithm, you're someone that watches our show, but you haven't yet hit that button. Thank you so much. Okay, we got two more. Here we go.
**主持人**：相信你的直觉，而不是焦点小组。
Original English **Host**: Trust your gut, not the focus groups.
**嘉宾**：没错。我所做过的一切，全部都是基于自己的直觉以及我内心的感受。就拿“耳光联盟”（Power Slap）来说吧。如果要谈那些批评者的声音，大家都知道 UFC 如今规模极其庞大、卖了那么多钱，而我记得当时有人说：“他搞这个搞那个，会彻底毁掉自己的名誉和成就。”他们当年攻击 UFC 的所有屁话，后来又原封不动照搬到了耳光联盟身上。只要出现人们不理解、不明白的新事物，大家就会群起而攻之。
Original English **Guest**: Yeah. Everything that I've ever done has been off based off my gut and what I felt would I mean the power slap thing. I mean you want to talk about the critics I mean you know UFC huge sold all this money and and I remember seeing people he's going to he's going to destroy his legacy by by doing this and that and all the [ __ ] that they said about the UFC they then said about power slap. Anything new that people don't understand or uh or don't get they they attack and go after.
**主持人**：但有时候你的直觉也会出错。是的，有时候你确实会判断失误，以为某件事会……
Original English **Host**: But sometimes your gut is wrong. Yeah. Sometimes you you're sometimes you get things wrong. You think something will be
**嘉宾**：对，毫无疑问。不过幸运的是，在商业决策上到目前为止还没出过错。所以……
Original English **Guest**: Yeah. There's no doubt. Well, luckily, not not in business it hasn't yet. So,
**主持人**：至少在大方向上没有。
Original English **Host**: not the big things.
**嘉宾**：是的。
Original English **Guest**: Yeah.
**主持人**：但我有时候会有些顾虑，因为我们坐在这里给人们提建议，叫大家相信自己的直觉。但有些人的直觉其实并不准。
Original English **Host**: But I think that sometimes because I'm quite weary of the fact that we sit here and we give people advice to trust their gut. But like some people's gut is like not good.
**嘉宾**：是的。但如果你的直觉真错了，我向来是这么想的：最坏的情况能怎样？
Original English **Guest**: Yeah. But if your gut is wrong, here's what I always think. What's the worst case scenario?
**主持人**：最坏的情况就是你回去继续打工上班。我想同时你也能学到些教训，对吧。
Original English **Host**: The worst case scenario is you go back to work. You learn something as well, I guess. Yeah.
**嘉宾**：对。如果你的直觉错了，或者你没闯出来、不想继续了，最坏的情况无非就是回去上班打工。
Original English **Guest**: Right. If your gut is wrong or if you don't make it and you don't want to, your worst case scenario is you go back to work.
**主持人**：这其实并不是个糟糕的最坏结局。
Original English **Host**: It's not a bad worst case scenario.
**主持人**：说起打工……
Original English **Host**: And speaking of work,
### 19岁离开酒店与最坏结果 **嘉宾**：对吧？我常想起走出那家酒店的那一天，当时我只有 19 岁。我想的是：如果这一切没能成真，至少我会有一些很棒的经历；如果实在不行必须回去继续打工，至少我尝试过了，我为之拼搏过。我绝不能等到 40 岁才醒悟过来。事情就是这样。当我做酒店行李员时，我赚的钱非常多，对吧？我完全能过上优渥的生活。但我看着身边一起工作的同事，其中一个家伙已经 45 岁了，他拿的薪水和我一样，享受的福利待遇和我一样，排班时间也和我一样。所以最坏的结局是什么？就是我到了 45 岁再回来做同样的工作。这并不算多糟糕的最坏结局。真正最糟糕的情况是你从来不曾尝试，你根本不敢放手一搏，然后有一天你在 45 岁醒来，心里想着：“操，真该死，当初在没有孩子、没有任何人依靠我养活的时候，我为什么连试都没试一次？” 如果你纯粹是为了薪水而干，那你早就输了。是的，千真万确。我做过的任何事情从来都不是为了钱，因为如果我是看在钱的份上，我今天肯定还站在酒店大堂里，因为在当时那绝对是好得多的选择。在 19 岁的时候，有 401(k) 退休计划，对吧，各项保障全部齐全，牙医保险、医疗保险、现金、支票，全都有。如果钱是决定性因素，我现在依然站在酒店大堂里。后来我离开并说“我想进格斗行业”时，所有人都对我说这简直蠢透了，对吧？而当你说出那句话时，它意味着什么？它能预示我现在身处的位置以及如今发生的一切吗？你永远不可能预料到这一点。你甚至连做梦都梦不到。我所做过的事情，以及我参与其中的这一切……
Original English **Guest**: right? I used to think the day that I walked out of that hotel, I was 19. If this whole thing doesn't work out, I'll have some great experiences, but if I have to go back and go back to work, I tried. I gave it a shot. I can't wake up when I'm 40. And that was the thing. When I was a Bellman, I was making great money, right? I was able to have a good life for myself. But then I saw these guys that worked with me. One of the guys was 45 years old. He made the same money I made. He had the same benefits that I had. He had the same schedule that I had. So, what's the worst case scenario? I'm 45 and I come back and I, you know, I do the same thing. It's not a bad worst case scenario. The worst case scenario is you never try. You don't try to do it. And then you wake up and you're 45 and you're like, "Fuck, man. I wonder if what when I had no kids, no no no no no nobody depended on me for anything and I never gave it a shot. If you're only in it for the paycheck, you've already lost. Yeah, it's absolutely true. Nothing I ever did was based on money because if I did base it on money, I'm still standing in the hotel lobby because that was the much better option at the time. 401k, right? all the you check all the boxes, dental, medical, cash, checks, all these [ __ ] things at 19. If the money was the deciding factor, I'm still standing in the lobby of the hotel. Now, when I left and said, "I want to be in the fight business," everybody told me it was [ __ ] stupid. Right? And when you say that, what does it mean? Does it mean where I am right now and what's going on right now? You could never predict that. You could never you couldn't even [ __ ] dream it up. The [ __ ] that I've done and the things that I've been a part of
**主持人**：做最狂野的梦也想象不到会走到今天这一步。
Original English **Host**: in your wildest dreams this wouldn't be it.
### 时机、高中好友与相遇菲尔蒂塔兄弟 **主持人**：在这一切中，运气扮演了怎样的角色？
Original English **Host**: Where does luck fit in this equation?
**嘉宾**：很大，我认为比重很大。但我不会称之为运气，我会称之为时机。人生中的一切都关乎时机。高中时有个孩子，名字叫亚当·科根（Adam Corgan）。我和他一起读高中，他当时是个富家子弟，而我不是。我没有车，诸如此类的窘况。那家伙每天都开车接送我上下学，对吧？你想一想这件事——我一直都是这样思考的：他为了接我，必须提前 45 分钟到一个小时起床，收拾准备好，开车过来接我，然后我们俩还得准时赶到学校。正如我之前告诉你的，我有一项一揽子原则，我在 21 岁时就戒酒了。
Original English **Guest**: A lot I think a lot. And I wouldn't call it luck. I'd call it timing. Everything in life is about timing. So there was this kid, his name's Adam Corgan. I went to high school with him and he was a rich kid in high school. I was not. And I didn't have a car. all that [ __ ] This guy would pick me up and drive me to school every day, right? And think about this and and this is the way I always think. For him to come get me, he had to wake up 45 minutes to an hour earlier, get ready, drive over, get me, and then we both had to be to school on time. And I had this blanket pol, like I told you, I quit drinking when I was 21.
**嘉宾**：而且我在二十多岁时还有一条一贯的原则：我不参加任何人的婚礼。你知道，人在二十多岁奔向三十岁的时候，身边认识的所有人都在结婚，对吧？首先你得坐飞机去某个地方。我当时住在波士顿，出门必须坐飞机，参加婚礼要耗费大量的时间精力。所以我从不参加任何人的婚礼。然而，后来亚当·科根要结婚了。想想他在高中时为我付出的一切，我怎么可能不去参加亚当·科根的婚礼？于是我去了他的婚礼。结果你在婚礼上猜我碰到了谁？弗兰克·菲尔蒂塔和洛伦佐·菲尔蒂塔（Frank and Lorenzo Fertitta）。
Original English **Guest**: And I also had this blanket policy in my 20s. I didn't go to anybody's wedding. Everybody you ever knew was getting married when you were in your 20s heading toward your 30s, right? And it first of all, you have to fly somewhere. You know, I lived in Boston. You know, you had to fly somewhere. Takes a bunch of time out of you that to go to. So, I would No, I wouldn't go to anybody's wedding. So, then Adam Corgan is getting married. How am I not going to go to Adam Corgan's wedding with all the things that he did for me when we were in high school? I go to his wedding. And who do I run into at his wedding? Frank and Lorenzo Fertitta.
**主持人**：你们最终……
Original English **Host**: Who you end up
**嘉宾**：我已经有十年甚至更长时间没见过他们了。洛伦佐在婚礼上走到我面前说：“嘿，最近怎么样？我刚加入了内华达州运动委员会（Nevada Athletic Commission），听说你开了一家拳击馆在带人训练，我想过去跟你一起练拳。”他在周一就过来了，从那以后我和洛伦佐就一直合作至今。还有弗兰克……
Original English **Guest**: I hadn't seen in 10 years or more. So Lorenzo comes up to me at the wedding and says, "Hey, how you doing? I just got on the on the Nevada Athletic Commission and I heard you're you're you know, you got a boxing gym you train. I want to come in and train with you." He came in on Monday and me and Lorenzo have been together ever since. And Frank
**主持人**：后来不久，你们就一起以 200 万美元收购了 UFC。嗯。
Original English **Host**: and you bought the UFC together for $2 million sometime thereafter. Mhm.
**主持人**：所以，如果你当时没有对那位高中老友讲情义、没有去参加他的婚礼，那现在会是怎样，谁能料得到呢？
Original English **Host**: So, if you hadn't been loyal to your friend from school and gone to his wedding, then I mean, who knows?
**嘉宾**：对。
Original English **Guest**: Yeah.
**主持人**：简直就是“滑动门”时刻（Sliding doors moment，命运的转折点）。
Original English **Host**: Sliding doors moment.
**嘉宾**：人生中的一切都关乎时机。
Original English **Guest**: Everything in life is about timing.
### 宿命因果与英国重量级拳赛预测 **主持人**：你相信因果报应（Karma）吗？
Original English **Host**: Do you believe in karma?
**嘉宾**：我相信。我其实不相信太多玄虚的东西。比如我没有宗教信仰，我不信上帝、魔鬼、幽灵或者妖怪，我不信这些玩意儿。但我相信因果报应，因为我亲眼见过善恶有报。我亲眼见证过因果。
Original English **Guest**: I do. I don't believe in much. Like, I'm, you know, I'm not religious. I don't believe in God, the devil, ghosts, goblins. I don't believe in any of this [ __ ] But I believe in karma cuz I've seen it play out good and bad. I've seen karma.
**主持人**：接下来有一场大战，一场英国的大战，将在安东尼·约书亚（Anthony Joshua, AJ）和泰森·富里（Tyson Fury）之间打响。这是拳击界的大战，至少是过去十年里最重磅的拳赛之一。
Original English **Host**: There is a there is a big fight coming up um big UK fight coming up between AJ Anthony Joshua and Tyson Fury. One of the biggest fights in boxing, you know, over the last at least the last decade for sure.
**嘉宾**：在重量级拳坛绝对是如此，确实。
Original English **Guest**: Definitely in the heavyweight division. Yes.
**主持人**：是的。你认为谁会赢？
Original English **Host**: Yeah. Who do you think is going to win?
**嘉宾**：他们俩的热身赛表现都非常不稳定、让人捉摸不透。所以，我们还得走着瞧。在这几场热身赛里，并没有谁展现出完全的压制力。所以这是一场很有意思的对决。而且显然，他们是英国有史以来名气最大、最受欢迎的两位重量级拳王。所以如果你非让我选一个……如果非要选，我是不作预测的。
Original English **Guest**: They both had tune-up fights that were very very sketchy. So, we we'll see. You know, it's not like either one of them completely dominated in in their tune-up fights. So, it's an interesting fight to see. And obviously, you know, two of the biggest, most famous, most popular heavyweights to ever come out of the UK. So, if you had to pick, if I had to pick, I don't pick.
**主持人**：你刚才明明差点就要选了。
Original English **Host**: You were about to pick.
**主持人**：你刚才没告诉我那三件事，这个你总可以告诉我吧。
Original English **Host**: You didn't tell me the three things. You can tell me this.
**嘉宾**：这次采访里，你真正想从我这里套出的东西，你一样也得不到。真是浪费时间。
Original English **Guest**: You're getting nothing from me that you actually want in this interview. What a waste of time.
**主持人**：好吧，看来是这样。这里还有一张空白卡片，我希望你再写一条。
Original English **Host**: I guess so. There is this empty one. I wanted you just to write one more
### 绝不畏惧冒险与不留遗憾 **主持人**：写一条你脑海中最先浮现的原则。再说一次，这是给我所有不同年龄段听众的原则，供那些正在思考如何在自己的人生所求中取得成功的人参考。它可以是任何内容。好的，你写了什么？
Original English **Host**: that's front of mind for you. And again, this is just a a principle for all my audience who are various ages that are thinking about how to be successful in their own whatever they're doing in their lives. Um, it can be anything. Okay. What did you write?
**嘉宾**：不要害怕承担风险。
Original English **Guest**: Do not be afraid to take risk.
**主持人**：好的。
Original English **Host**: Okay.
**嘉宾**：如果你不愿意承担风险，你永远无法完成或实现你在人生中渴望的任何目标。你知道，趁年轻、在结婚之前、在有孩子之前去冒险总是更容易一些；但即使到了那个阶段，也不要害怕去承担风险。你最坏的结果能是什么？对我来说，最坏的结果永远是躺在临终的病床上，心里悔恨着：“要是当初我做了该多好。”
Original English **Guest**: You will never accomplish or achieve anything that you want out of life if you're not willing to take the risk. You know, and it's always easier to do it when you're younger, before you get married, before you have kids, but don't be afraid to do it then either. What is your worst case scenario? To me, the worst case scenario is always laying on your deathbed and going, I wish I would have
**嘉宾**：就像我在拉斯维加斯盖房子的时候，对吧？当时我想的是，这是我打算建的最后一栋该死的房子了。你知道我最不想做的是什么吗？我不想哪天早上醒来懊恼地说：“该死，要是当初我做了该多好。”所以，我当时严重超出了预算，整套流程全都做足了。如今我每天在自己的房子里醒来，我热爱这里。我在那里住了八年，从来没有说过一句：“该死，我当初要是做了就好了。”从来没有过。你懂我的意思吗？我只是想说，在我人生中所做的每一件事上，我都不希望将来某天醒来，后悔自己当初要是……
Original English **Guest**: when I built my house here in Las Vegas, right? I was like, this is the last [ __ ] house I'm going to build. And and you know what I don't want to do? I don't want to wake up some morning go, damn, I wish I would have. So, I went way over budget, you know, the whole deal. And I wake up every day in my [ __ ] house and I love it. And I've I've been there eight years and I've never said, "Damn, I should have." Never. You know what I mean? I'm just saying in everything that I do in my life, I don't want to wake up and wish that I had, you
### 敢于冒险与直面有限的人生 **Speaker A**：你知道的，不要害怕去承担风险。如果外面有什么东西是你真正渴望追求的，那就放手去争取。最坏的结果能是什么呢？无非是重新回去上班，对吧？这就是最坏的设想了。而且从某种角度来说，这并不是什么糟糕的最坏打算。
Original English **Speaker A**: You know, do not be afraid to take risk, you know? And if there's something out there that you feel like you want and you, you know, go get it. What's the worst thing that can happen? You end up back at work, right? That's the worst case scenario. And it's not a bad worst case scenario.
**Speaker B**：在某种程度上确实如此。但仔细想来，我们活着的方式常常就像自己能长生不老一样；因为说实在的，我们谁也不知道自己还剩多少时间。
Original English **Speaker B**: In a way. We kind of do live like we're going to live forever when you think about it, cuz really, you know, neither of us know how long we have left.
### 《疯狂摔跤手》的启示：生命的倒计时 **Speaker A**：所以，在我小的时候，有一部电影对我的人生影响非常深远，叫做《疯狂摔跤手》（Vision Quest）。那是一部摔跤题材的电影。讲的是一个高中男生，觉得自己从未真正成就过什么。他很想在自己的高中生涯留下属于自己的印记。于是，他决定跨级别降重两个量级，去挑战全美最顶尖的摔跤手，那个对手的名字叫舒特（Shute）。 电影里有一幕，他在上课，他的诗歌老师或者英语老师正在给全班讲一首诗背后的故事，老师问：“这首诗对你们来说意味着什么？”那个男孩——他叫劳登·斯温（Louden Swain）——回答说：“一个小女孩在公园里漫步，树上的落叶枯萎凋零，纷纷飘落。那一刻她突然意识到，自己未来的某一天也同样会走向死亡。” 接着就是影史上最精彩绝伦的经典场景之一了。男孩上高中时在一家酒店打工，做客房送餐员。每天晚上和他一起工作的主厨总是对他冷嘲热讽，因为男孩当时一直在疯狂减重。每次只要主厨在身边，那人就满是负面情绪，不断打击他：“你折腾这个到底图什么？赶紧把这该死的东西拿起来吃了，多吃点东西，少折腾这些没用的。”他总是这样冷嘲热讽。 后来，男孩到了快要和舒特决战的关键时刻，偏偏又遇到了一个女孩，深深爱上了她。男孩甚至冲动到愿意放弃摔跤、放弃之前付出的一切。那个女孩察觉到了这一点，为了不毁掉他的梦想，女孩选择离开了他。男孩整个人彻底崩溃了。 这时候他去找谁呢？他去找了那个平时总是在打击他的厨师，因为他心想主厨肯定会劝他彻底放弃：“算了吧，你根本没必要遭这罪，何必非要跟自己过不去呢。”可当他赶去上班时，却发现主厨不在岗位上。主厨本来那天是要当班的。于是男孩跑去敲主厨公寓的门，门一开，却看到主厨穿着笔挺的正装衬衫，打着领带。男孩愣住了，问：“你这是在干什么？怎么回事？你今天没去上班啊。”主厨反问他：“你今晚难道不是要跟舒特决战吗？”男孩说：“是啊，但你翘班他们会扣你一整天工资的。” 主厨随即向他倾吐了自己的心声，他说：“有一天晚上，我独自坐在这间公寓里看电视，电视里出现了一个叫贝利（Pelé）的球员，你听说过他吗？”
Original English **Speaker A**: So, there's a movie that really impacted my life when I was a kid. It was called Vision Quest. And it's a wrestling movie. You know, this kid's in high school and he feels like he never really accomplished something. He wanted to leave his mark in high school. So, he's going to drop a couple weight classes and try to beat the greatest wrestler in like the country or something. The Shute was the guy's name. But he's in class and there's this, like his poetry teacher, his English teacher, whatever it is, is telling a story about a poem and he says, "What does this mean to you?" And the kid, Louden Swain is his name. Louden Swain says, "You know, this little girl's walking through the park and all the leaves are dying and falling off the tree. And then she realizes that she's going to die someday, too." And then there's one of the greatest scenes in a movie of all time. So he works at a hotel in high school, he's a room service waiter. The head chef that works with him every night is always like, he's cutting weight and doing all this stuff. And every time he's around this guy, this guy's negative. Like "What are you doing this for? Pick up the thing and eat it. Eat some food. Do this and that." And it's always shitting on him. So he gets to a place where he's getting ready to wrestle Shute and he meets this girl, falls in love with her and all this, and he's willing to blow it all and give it all up. And she leaves because she sees that this is happening and she leaves him, and he's all messed up. So where does he go? He goes to the chef who's always shitting on him because he knows he'll talk him into quitting. "Fuck it. You don't have to do this. You don't have to do that." He goes to work and the guy's not at work. He's supposed to be working. So he goes to his apartment, knocks on his door, and the guy's dressed up with a dress shirt and a tie. And he's like, "What are you doing? What's going on? You're not working." He's like, "Aren't you wrestling Shute tonight?" And he's like, "Yeah, but they're going to dock you a day paid work." And this guy goes into basically: "I'm sitting in this apartment alone one night and I'm watching TV and there's a guy named Pelé. Have you ever heard of him?"
**Speaker A**：主厨接着说：“我看着那个球员在场上凌空倒勾，整个人凌空翻滚倒挂，把球狠狠踢进球网，然后撕掉球衣满场狂奔，全场观众都为之疯狂沸腾。”你看，我现在讲起这段故事，浑身都还在起鸡皮疙瘩。主厨对他说：“同样作为人类，作为这同一物种的一分子，我独自坐在这间冷清的公寓里，忍不住痛哭流涕。”他说，重要的从来不是那短短的六分钟比赛时间，而是在那六分钟里你究竟创造了什么。 这部电影深深触动了我，这种震撼前所未有。那一刻我彻底领悟了。我们其实没有那么多时间，人生留给我们的时间真的非常有限。我们总觉得自己好像能永远活下去，但事实并非如此。对于现在的年轻一代来说，可能觉得30岁已经很遥远、很老了——我18岁的时候也觉得30岁简直老得不行。
Original English **Speaker A**: And he says, "I watch this guy. He flips upside down and backwards and kicks the ball into a net and rips his shirt off and runs around the place and the crowd's going crazy." Look, I get goosebumps telling you the story. So he says, "A human being, a species that I'm actually a part of, you know, I'm sitting here alone in my apartment and I start crying." You know, it's not the six minutes, it's what happens in that six minutes that matters. But basically, this movie spoke to me like nothing had ever spoke to me before. And I got it. You know, we don't have time. There's not a lot of time. And it does seem like we're going to live forever, but we're not. And to these younger people, like 30 years old seems so old to me when I was 18.
### 创业者的代价与选择 **Speaker A**：可一眨眼功夫，你就30岁了。所以千万不要虚度光阴，不要害怕承担风险。千万不要到了那个厨师的年纪，一个人孤零零坐在冰冷的公寓里懊悔：“我当年本可以做出更多成绩的，我本可以把事业做得更大，我本可以成为更优秀的人。”对任何人来说，这才是最可悲、最糟糕的结局。你绝不能让自己沦落成那样的人。 当然，并不是每个人天生都有这样的性格，也不是每个人都适合走这条路。我之前就说过，有很多人只追求一份体制内的稳定工作、401(k)退休金计划、完备的社会福利待遇；他们想要周末双休，想要法定节假日休假。这没有任何问题，这个世界本来就需要形形色色的人才能运转。但如果你坚信自己骨子里是一个创业者，坚信自己有渴望去亲手缔造的宏图伟业，那就千万不要害怕去冒险。只不过，这一定会让你付出代价。
Original English **Speaker A**: You're 30 like that. Don't waste your time. Don't be afraid to take a risk. Don't be the guy sitting home alone at whatever his age was at that point in your apartment thinking, "I could have done more than this. I could have been bigger than this. I could have been better than this." That is the worst thing that can happen to anybody. You don't want to be that guy. And listen, not everybody is built that way or for that. I told you some people listen, they want that city job, 401k, the benefits and all that. They want weekends off and they want holidays off and there's nothing wrong with that. We need all types of people in this world to live. But if you believe that you are an entrepreneur, you believe that you in something that you want to build, do not be afraid to take the risk. It's going to cost you though.
**Speaker B**：这挺有意思的。我刚才想到你提到你在拉斯维加斯的那栋豪宅，但与此同时，你在过去两个月里在那栋大房子里只待了四天。
Original English **Speaker B**: It's funny. I was thinking about you talking about your big house in Vegas, but then also the fact that you were there for 4 days in the last 2 months.
**Speaker A**：是的。
Original English **Speaker A**: Yeah.
**Speaker B**：但实际上，恰恰是这种拼搏的状态和行为方式，才让你赢得了那栋大房子。
Original English **Speaker B**: That's actually that behavior that got you the big house. And
### 永不停歇的创造力与工作激情 **Speaker A**：没错，确实如此。而且我对这其中的任何一秒钟都绝不后悔。我由衷地热爱这一切。我现在依然每天清晨醒来就充满干劲，迫不及待要冲进办公室投入工作。我特别享受这种状态——细节我可能不用展开讲太多，因为说来话长——但我眼下正在推进一个新项目，我自己简直为之深深着迷。我完全沉浸进去了。 在办公室里，有塔克（Tucker）这帮家伙，还有马拉曼（Maramman）这个年轻人，以及一大群极具才华、富有创意的伙伴。我把他们全部召集到一间会议室里，我们开始热烈探讨，我向他们描绘我的宏大构想；然后他们立刻全身心投入进来，发挥各自的专业特长开始落地构建。那种感觉简直太棒了，老兄，我真的太热爱这种感觉了。 看看我自己一手搭建起来的这支团队，只要我和这群人坐在一间屋子里头脑风暴，那种能一起创造出来的事物、能达成的壮举、拥有的无限可能，简直不可思议。还有阿里·伊曼纽尔（Ari Emanuel），阿里这号人物，可以说是影史上、乃至整个行业有史以来最顶级的超级经纪人。当年正是他牵线促成了UFC的世纪大交易，后来又拿下WWE，他这一生塑造了无数庞大的商业帝国与传奇人物。每次我有了什么颠覆性的创意点子，给他打电话说：“我需要3000万美元来做这件事”，他总是毫不犹豫地回答：“我来搞定资金。”所以到了今天，我已经拥有了这支不可思议的核心团队；每当我脑海中诞生了什么新想法，大家立刻齐聚一堂，迅速把想法变成震撼人心的现实。
Original English **Speaker A**: True. Yeah. And I wouldn't change a second of it. I love this. I still get up every day and I'm fired up to get in here and get to the office. And I love like you don't want me to get into this, it's too long or whatever, but you know, I'm working on something right now that I just became obsessed with. I became obsessed with it. And I got these guys Tucker at my office. I got this kid Maramman at my office and all these guys that are really talented, creative people. And I get them in a room with me and we start talking about it and I tell them what my vision is and then they get into it and then they start doing what they do and building the and then it's just like, I just I love it man. The team that I have built, you know, when I get in a room with these guys and we start talking, it's incredible what you can build and what you can do and what's available and what you can accomplish. And Ari Emanuel, Ari is this guy, you know, the ultimate all-time super agent. You know, he came in and did the deal for the UFC, got the WWE and many, many other things and people he's built in his lifetime. And he's the guy that when I come up with something creative and I call him and I'm like, "I need $30 million. I want to do this." He's like, "I'll get you the money." So, I've gotten to a point now where I have all these people that are part of my team. And when I come up with something, we all get together and then we make it happen.
### 没有终点的征途：做大、做大、再做大 **Speaker B**：在你的心目中，是否有一个既定的终点目标？
Original English **Speaker B**: Is there a destination in your mind?
**Speaker A**：没有。
Original English **Speaker A**: No.
**Speaker B**：根本没有终点？
Original English **Speaker B**: There's no destination.
**Speaker A**：只有不断做大、做大、做大、做大、做大、做大、再做大。
Original English **Speaker A**: Bigger, bigger, bigger, bigger, bigger, bigger, bigger.
**Speaker B**：然后再怎样呢？
Original English **Speaker B**: And then what?
**Speaker A**：对啊，你想想看，然后再怎样？然后我就死了呗。人终有一死，到那时候谁还在乎呢，对吧？我完全无法想象自己去过那种“嘿，我已经赚够了钱，我要彻底退休养老了”的生活。退休之后干嘛呢？去干什么呢？ 通常来说我一年大概会度四次高品质的假——今年除外，今年我忙得焦头烂额。如果按照我妻子的意愿，每次度假最好能休满15天。但今年我和她还在为度假的事拉扯抗争。我根本无法忍受长时间度假，每次假期快结束的时候，我都迫不及待想要重返工作岗位，重新投入工作让我无比兴奋。而且……
Original English **Speaker A**: Right. Well, think about this. Then I die. Then I die. Who gives a shit? Right? It's just I can't picture myself like, hey, I made a bunch of money. I'm going to retire and do what? And do what? You know, I probably take four, not this year. I'm busy this year, but I'd take four great vacations a year, right? And if my wife had her way, it'd be 15 days. But you know, her and I are battling over a vacation this year. But I couldn't imagine by the time I'm done with my vacation, I can't wait to get back to work. I'm so excited to get back to work. And
**Speaker B**：我们真的需要度假吗？
Original English **Speaker B**: Do we have vacations?
**Speaker A**：度假确实需要几天去适应，对吧？我的意思是，任何经营大企业、真正理解这种节奏的人都懂。刚到达度假地点时，你脑子里还在拼命摆脱日常业务的千头万绪和各种琐事；到了大概第三天，你才真正进入度假状态。你会享受这段时光，享受陪伴孩子们的亲子时光。但只要一到假期末尾，我又会立刻抓起电话大喊：“我要回去了！大家赶紧全都准备好，我马上就回公司了！”
Original English **Speaker A**: Yeah. Yeah. It takes me a couple days, right? I mean, anybody who runs a big business and understands this. You get there and you're shaking off all the stuff that's going on, and then by like day three, I'm in. You know, I enjoy myself. I enjoy hanging out with my kids. And then by the end, I'm back on the phone going, "I'm coming home. Everybody get ready. I'm coming home."
### 自我认知的力量：倾尽全力做真实的自己 **Speaker B**：跟你交谈时，有一点显而易见：自我认知（self-awareness）其实就是你今天给出的核心建议。因为…… 我能想象很多人其实并不会喜欢你这样的生活状态，他们甚至会觉得这种日夜无休的生活极其痛苦煎熬。然而你却觉得这令人无比兴奋、充满激情。我认为这非常真实。这也是我们在探讨这类话题时一个至关重要的微妙差异——据我所听到的，你并不是在要求每个人都去过和你一样的生活，你是在告诉大家：必须认清自己到底是什么样的人，明确这就是真实的自己，然后倾尽全力去成就那个真实的自我。
Original English **Speaker B**: One of the things that is obvious speaking to you is that self-awareness really is the advice that you've sort of given today because... I imagine a lot of people wouldn't like your life. They would find it miserable. Whereas you find it so exciting. And I think that's true. It's a really important point of nuance when we have these conversations, which is you're not necessarily saying from what I hear that everybody should have your life. You're saying just like be aware of who you are and this is who you are and you're just giving it everything to who you are.
**Speaker A**：没错！哪怕在我们UFC招聘员工时也是如此。比如就在我这堵墙对面的那位女士——莱恩·布雷尼奇（Len Breenidge），她工作起来就像头野兽一样拼命，才华横溢，我打心底里对她充满崇高的敬意。然后……
Original English **Speaker A**: Yep. And even when we hire at the UFC like the woman on the other side of this wall right here, Len Breenidge, animal and brilliant and I have so much respect for her. Then
### 核心圈子与创业者的残酷现实 **Dana White**: 我手下有克雷格·博萨里（Craig Borsari），有亨特·坎贝尔（Hunter Campbell）。我有这么一群为我工作的人，他们全都是狠角色（killers），对吧？然后你再看其他层面，有人来这里只是朝九晚五地上班，这也很正常，各种各样的人都需要。我并不是在寻找650个他妈的顶级杀手。
Original English **Dana White**: I got Craig Borsari. I I I I got Hunter Campbell. I have all these guys that that that work for me and they are all killers, right? Then you go and there's people that come in and they work 9 to 5, and it takes all types. I'm not looking for 650 fucking killers.
**Host**: 但那些在你身边紧密工作的人必须是。
Original English **Host**: But the ones that work close to you.
**Dana White**: 没错。他们必须离我很近。如果你不是个他妈的狠角色，你连离我一英里以内都不可能待得下去。是的。
Original English **Dana White**: Yes. They need to be close. You can't be within a fucking mile of me if you're not a fucking killer. Yes.
**Dana White**: 但确实需要各种类型的人。而且就像你说的，我也不是说我的生活方式适合所有人，绝对不是，差得太远了。所以这就是为什么我说，有些自以为想成为创业者的年轻人，根本不知道这背后到底需要付出什么。而且有很多已经创业成功的人，赚到了年轻人所谓的“大钱（the bag）”，他们拿了钱就赶紧抽身跑路，到此为止，直接收工，然后去干自己想干的其他事情了。
Original English **Dana White**: But it takes all types. And like you said, I'm not saying my life is the life for everybody. It's the furthest thing from it. So that's why I say some of these kids that think they want to be entrepreneurs, they don't know what it really takes. And there's plenty of guys who have been entrepreneurs and made that, you know, the kids call it the bag. They made the bag and they fucking run and that's it. It's a wrap and they go do other things that they want to do.
### 摩托车梦想与生命中最后的骑行 **Dana White**: 但是说到这种美好的憧憬——我本人是个狂热的摩托车迷，对吧？我记得我以前总说，等我到了某个阶段，我要把我的哥们和堂表兄弟们聚在一起，我们要环游全美，来几场不可思议的骑行之旅。然后我开始变老了，我心想，靠，我都四十多岁了，我到底打算什么时候才去实行？所以现在每年不管发生什么，我都会抽出一整块时间，我们选一个目的地，然后尽情骑摩托车。现在，我认识的每个人一旦到了某个年龄——就像我说的，男人老了就会变软弱——他们开始觉得自己掌控不了摩托车了，对吧？然后他们就不骑了。
Original English **Dana White**: But this beautiful thing, so I'm a big motorcycle guy, right? And I remember I always used to say when I get to a certain point I'm going to get my buddies together and my cousins and we're just going to go on these incredible rides all around the United States. And then I started getting older. I'm like, fuck, I'm in my 40s. When do I think I'm going to do this? So every year, I don't give a fuck, I carve out and we go to a destination and we fucking ride motorcycles. Now, everybody that I've known once they get to a certain age, when I say men start to get softer when they get old, they feel like they can't handle the bikes anymore, right? And they stop riding.
**Dana White**: 如果我也到了那个阶段——我不知道这会不会发生在我身上，但如果真的发生了，我自己拥有大概30辆他妈的摩托车。我会把它们全部运到意大利去。比如，如果这是意大利，我会把它们运到意大利的最北端。我会雇一辆卡车装上我所有的摩托车，然后我骑着它们一路南下，一直骑到阿马尔菲海岸（Amalfi Coast）。到了之后，我就把钥匙直接插在车上，把它们扔在意大利他妈的路边。我就把它们全留在那里。那将是我人生中最后一次他妈的骑行。
Original English **Dana White**: If and when I get to that point, I don't know if that will happen to me, but if it does, I own like 30 fucking motorcycles. I'm going to ship them all to Italy. Like, if this is Italy, I'm going to ship them to the top of Italy. I'm going to have a truck have all my bikes in it and I'm going to ride them all the way down to the Amalfi Coast and then I'll just leave the keys in them and leave them on the side of the fucking road in Italy. I'll leave them all there. That's going to be my last fucking ride of my life.
**Host**: 等你真这么干的时候给我发条短信，我会，我会在终点等着接应你。
Original English **Host**: Send me a text when you do that and I'll be I'll be waiting down.
**Dana White**: 没问题。
Original English **Dana White**: Yeah.
### 终极目标：打造无法被超越的格斗帝国 **Host**: 达纳（Dana），我们这个播客有一个结语传统：上一位嘉宾会为下一位嘉宾留下一个问题，而且他们并不知道这个问题是留给谁的。留给你的问题是：如果你只能再完成一个重大目标，那会是什么？为什么？
Original English **Host**: Dana, we have a closing tradition on this podcast where the last guest leaves a question for the next not knowing who they're leaving it for. The question left for you is, if you could only complete one more major goal, what would it be and why?
**Dana White**: 你知道的，我已经打造了有史以来最庞大的格斗品牌。现在我正在进军职业拳击，我还有力量击掌联盟（Power Slap）。我接下来的目标——这是一个七年目标，因为我的派拉蒙（Paramount）合约还剩下七年——那就是打造一个最庞大的搏击运动帝国。虽然我已经做到了，但我要把它提升到一个根本无法被后人复制的高度。等到我离开人世的时候，在我生命走到尽头之前所建立的一切，将是绝对无法被超越的。
Original English **Dana White**: I've already built the biggest fight brand to ever exist, you know. Now I'm getting into boxing. I got Power Slap. My goal over the next, it's a seven-year goal because I have seven years in my Paramount deal, to build the biggest combat sports brand that is—I already did, but to a level that it just can't be replicated again. It's just like when I'm dead, it's going to be impossible to beat what I've built by the time my life is up.
### 颠覆拳击产业与对“不可能”的执念 **Host**: 说到质疑者（haters），很多人都在说你不可能在拳击界复制成功。拳击完全不一样。我听他们都说过：“这项运动已经有150年历史了，你不可能把在UFC做的那套搬到拳击里。”
Original English **Host**: Speaking of haters, there's a lot of people saying that you can't do it in boxing. It's different. I've heard them all say, "This is 150 years old. You can't do what you did in UFC in boxing."
**Dana White**: 那力量击掌联盟（Power Slap）呢？
Original English **Dana White**: How about Power Slap?
**Host**: 是啊。
Original English **Host**: Yeah.
**Dana White**: 对吧。我的意思是，大家都想看那些人们认为行不通、不正确、不可能发生的事情。但话说回来，我就是喜欢这个。听别人说这不可能，听别人对我说你做不到，这就是我最喜欢的燃料。现在正在收看节目的每一个人，都会在某种程度上遇到别人告诉你你做不到、这绝不可能的情况。世上没有什么是不可能的。在UFC总部，唯一不能说的一个字就是“不（no）”。
Original English **Dana White**: Right. I mean, you want to see something that people think doesn't work and isn't right and isn't possible. But again, that's I love it. That's all the fuel that I love hearing that and people telling me what you can't do. And everybody who's watching this right now is going to deal with some level of people telling you what you can't do and what's impossible. Nothing is impossible. And literally at UFC headquarters, the only thing you can't say is no.
**Dana White**: 我不接受“不”，别告诉我这件事办不到。你看，比如克雷格·博萨里，有一次汤姆·布雷迪（Tom Brady）联系我说：“嘿，我在城里，你想去U2乐队演唱会吗？”我问：“在哪里？”就在刚建成的MSG Sphere（拉斯维加斯大球馆）。我去了Sphere，亲眼看到之后，我心想：“卧槽，这场演出的绝对主角就是这个球体建筑本身。”我立刻打电话给博萨里：“我不管你下周末有什么安排，全部取消。你和团队必须来看U2的演唱会，赶紧过来，我们必须在这里办比赛。”然后我们真的做到了。后来总统靠过来对我说：“我们应该在白宫办一场比赛。”我说：“好的，先生，我完全同意，我们应该在白宫打一场比赛。”现在克雷格·博萨里又带着他自己的新点子来找我，我认为那个点子简直他妈的绝了，我现在正在推进这个项目。在UFC我们从不说不行，无论大家认为什么是不可逾越、办不到的，我们不仅要把它做成，还要做到让所有人叹为观止的极致水准。
Original English **Dana White**: I don't accept no, don't tell me this can't happen. You know, on Craig Bor—again, Tom Brady hit me up and says, "Hey, I'm in town. You want to go to U2?" I'm like, "Where?" The Sphere. First, I went to the Sphere and I saw it and I was like, "Holy shit, the star of this show is the Sphere." I called Borsari, I said, "I don't know what you're doing next weekend, but cancel it. You and the crew are coming to the U2 concert. Come. I want to do this." And we did it. The president leans over to me and says, "We should do a fight at the White House." Yes, sir. I agree. We should do a fight at the White House. And then now Craig Borsari came to me with his own idea that I think is fucking brilliant, and I'm working on that one now. But we don't say no at the UFC, whatever people think is impossible and can't be done. Not only will we do it, we'll do it at the level that just blows people's minds.
### 拳击推广人的新旧对决：赫恩与沃伦 **Dana White**: 为什么你能在拳击界胜出？首先，拳击是我的初恋。
Original English **Dana White**: Why will you win at boxing? First of all, boxing was my first love,
**Host**: 而且我知道这项运动已经破败不堪了。随着它开始衰退，我心里很清楚该怎么去修复它，我知道该怎么做。
Original English **Host**: and I knew the sport was broken. And as it started to decline, and I just know how to fix it, I know what to do.
**Dana White**: 你和我过个五年得再坐在一起，再好好聊聊拳击。看看我们接下来的五年会做些什么，看着吧。我是说，我现在所取得的进展已经比我预期的提前了整整两年，因为目前正在操盘拳击的这帮人实在做得太烂了。我本该在入局前就预料到这一点的。但是，你知道，我习惯给每个人先入为主的信任，我不会轻视任何人说“噢算了吧，别拿这家伙当回事”。我严肃对待每一个人，而且我酷爱竞争。如果你说你想和我竞争，我就会把这种竞争视为一场真正的肉搏战。
Original English **Dana White**: You and I got to get together again in like 5 years and talk about boxing again. And watch what we do. Watch what we do over the next 5 years. I mean, I'm already 2 years ahead of where I thought I would be because the guys that are doing it right now are just so bad at doing it. And I should have known that going in. But, you know, I give everybody the benefit of the doubt. And I don't look at anybody and say, "Uh, oh yeah, let's not take this guy serious." I take everybody serious and I love to compete. And if you say you want to compete with me, I look at competing as a fight.
**Host**: 你指的是埃迪·赫恩（Eddie Hearn）吗？
Original English **Host**: Are you talking about Eddie Hearn?
**Dana White**: 我说的是他们所有人，每一个拳击推广人。埃迪·赫恩太软弱了。他的商业帝国是他父亲一手打拼建立起来的。他的父亲才是一个真正的硬汉。随着我在这行涉足越来越深，我发现他老爸才是真正的掌局者。而且我在弗兰克·沃伦（Frank Warren）身上也看到了同样的特质。弗兰克·沃伦最近刚公开露面，他自始至终没有到处瞎喷废话，他什么废话都没说，对吧？整场风波里他一直保持沉默。我前几天刚看了他的一篇采访。弗兰克·沃伦才是一个真正的硬派角色。埃迪根本不是这块料，埃迪的老爸才是那个真正的人物。我说这些绝不是为了故意贬低埃迪，我只是实话实说。我并不讨厌埃迪，真不讨厌他。但是他撑不起大局，他老爸才是真正的大人物。弗兰克·沃伦，我刚看完他的采访，我心想，这他妈才是我喜欢的人。
Original English **Dana White**: Talk about all of them. Every one of them. Eddie Hearn is weak. Eddie Hearn—his dad built that business. His dad's a real guy. As I get deeper into this thing, his dad is the—his dad is the guy. And I see it in Frank Warren. Frank Warren just came out recently. He hasn't talked any shit. He hasn't said anything, you know? He's been completely silent through this thing. And I just saw an interview with him the other day. Frank Warren's the real guy. Eddie's not the guy. Eddie's dad is the guy. And I'm not saying this to shit on Eddie. I'm just being honest. And I don't dislike Eddie. I don't dislike him. But he's not the guy. His dad's the guy. And Frank Warren. Frank Warren. I just saw this interview with him and I was like, fucking love it.
**Host**: 为什么？
Original English **Host**: Why make—
**Dana White**: 他那态度就好像在说：“你知道吗？别扯那么多废话了，别搞那些破事了，直接他妈的开打吧！开打就完了。”他就是这种硬气作风，我看了就觉得：“对，这才是真正的汉子。”还有其他关于弗兰克·沃伦的事情，他就是一个他妈的纯正老派硬汉。
Original English **Dana White**: He's just like, you know what? All this talking and all this bullshit, let's fucking fight. Let's start. You know, he's like—and I'm like, "Yeah, that's a guy." And a few other things that I've seen with Frank Warren. Frank Warren's like a fucking real guy.
**Host**: 埃迪·赫恩的工作投入度确实让人印象深刻。我记得有一次在纽约看到他，他在媒体面前一站就是六七个小时，几乎接受了每一个自媒体和博客的采访，我当时就想：“他他妈的到底在干什么啊？”他在大楼屋顶上接受了每一个人的访问……
Original English **Host**: Eddie Hearn's work rate is impressive. I just remember seeing him one day in New York and I remember him standing there for like 6, 7 hours with the media just doing like every single blog and going, "What the fuck is he doing?" He just did every—on this rooftop in the—
**Dana White**: 他对发生的每一件琐碎破事都要逐一回应。事实的真相是，在阻碍安东尼·约书亚（AJ）与泰森·富里（Tyson Fury）巅峰对决这件事情上，没有人比埃迪·赫恩使的绊子更多了。他就好像……我不知道，我真心希望约书亚能在Matchroom公司持有股份。埃迪·赫恩的父亲巴里·赫恩（Barry Hearn）才是一个真正他妈的牛人，他是真正的骨干。还有弗兰克·沃伦，这些老派的真正硬汉，当听到他们开口说话时，我完全能懂。我能一眼看穿所有的虚伪和废话，我很清楚谁才是真正的人物，什么才是事情的本质。
Original English **Dana White**: He's responding to every little fucking thing that's going on. And it's just like the the truth is nobody's done more to try to hurt the AJ-Fury fight than Eddie Hearn. It's like he's—I don't know. May I hope AJ owns a piece of Matchroom. Eddie Hearn's dad is Barry Hearn, a real fucking guy. He's the guy. And Frank Warren, these old-school fucking hard dudes that, you know, when I see them talk, yeah, I get it. I see through all the bullshit and I know who's who and what's what.
### 格斗之上的博弈与致谢 **Host**: 采访过你们两位之后，我觉得非常振奋的一点是，你们都极其不屈不挠、毫不留情。这很有意思，因为除了擂台内的格斗生意，在格斗生意之上还有一层更高维度的博弈，作为一个格斗迷，我觉得这极其引人入胜。达纳，非常感谢你慷慨地抽出时间。很显然，我很久很久以前就是拳迷了，你所做成的一切令人叹为观止。作为一名创业者，这对我来说极其鼓舞人心，而且你真正拓宽了人们对于“何为可能”的认知范式。非常感谢你能抽出时间，给我这个对话的荣幸。
Original English **Host**: Having interviewed both of you, what I find exciting is you're both absolutely relentless. And so it's funny cuz there's the fight business and then there's this other fight business going on above the fight business, which I think is quite interesting as a fight fan. Dana, thank you so much for being so generous with your time. I've been a fan obviously for the longest longest ever time and it's remarkable what you've done and so it's super inspiring for me as an entrepreneur but also yeah you expand the paradigm of what is possible. So thank you so much for taking the time and giving me this privilege.
**Dana White**: 等着瞧吧，看看我们在接下来的七年里会干出什么样的大事。
Original English **Dana White**: Wait to see what we do in the next seven years.
**Host**: 我已经迫不及待了。
Original English **Host**: I can't wait.
**Dana White**: 我也是。
Original English **Dana White**: Me too.
**Host**: YouTube最近推出了这个不可思议的新算法，能精准地预测出你最想看什么视频……
Original English **Host**: YouTube have this new crazy algorithm where they know exactly what video you would like to watch.
### 算法推荐与下期视频 **Speaker**: 下一个视频是基于人工智能以及你所有的观看行为推荐的。算法判定这个视频对你来说是最合适的内容。现在正在观看的每个人所看到的内容都是不一样的。去看看这个视频吧，我敢打赌你很可能会喜欢它。
Original English **Speaker**: next based on AI and all of your viewing behavior. And the algorithm says that this video is the perfect video for you. It's different for everybody looking right now. Check this video out and I bet you might love it.