--- author: a16z date: '2026-10-27' guest: '' layout: post.njk source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T4u2FoIm3pw speaker: a16z tags: - edtech - ai-education - k-12 - entrepreneurship-education - learning-science title: Alpha School与大学重塑：用AI与认知科学重构教育 summary: Alpha School校长Joe Liemandt与HA创办团队探讨如何利用认知科学与大语言模型重构学校日常。学生每天只需2小时完成学术学习，其余时间投入生活技能、团队协作与创业实践，并通过个性化学习引擎与高标准挑战重塑学生的学习动力与抱负。 insight: '' draft: true series: '' category: ai-application area: tech-engineering project: [] people: - Joe Liemandt companies_orgs: - Alpha School - Horowitz and Dre Academy products_models: [] media_books: [] status: evergreen --- ### 重新构想上学日：AI 与学习引擎驱动的教育变革 >> 你是否愿意重新设计你的上学日，让孩子们喜爱学校胜过假期？借助认知科学和学习科学，加上大语言模型的出现，你可以构建一个让孩子学习速度提升10倍的学习引擎。我认为你所实现的转变在于其可信度。很快，人们就会问：我们为什么还要用其他方式来做这件事？
Original English >> Are you willing to redesign your school day so kids love it more than vacation? With cognitive science and learning science, plus the advent of LLMs, you can build a learning engine that teaches kids 10 times faster. The shift that I think you've been able to make is the believability of it. Pretty soon, people are going to ask, why would we ever do it any other way?
>> 我希望下一代人能够成为对 AI 充满乐观并具备相应能力的人，能够说“我们要去创造一个精彩的未来”。这就是我们作为教育者的工作，去建立那样一个世界。对于那些说着“我要把孩子送去常春藤盟校，我知道它不完美，但这是一所新机构，我为什么要冒这个险？”的家长，你会怎么说？
Original English >> I want this next generation to be the ones who are optimistically capable with AI and saying, we're going to build an awesome future. That's what our job as educators are, is to go build that world. What would you say to the parent who's saying, "I'm sending my kid to Ivy League school. I know it's not perfect, but this is a new institution. Why should I take a risk?"
>> 那么，Joe，欢迎来到播客。
Original English >> So, Joe, welcome to the podcast.
>> 非常感谢。
Original English >> Thank you very much.
>> 我们今年有幸在一起相处了一些时间，参观了学校，你在 Alpha 所建立的一切简直令人难以置信，这极大地启发了我们在 HA 的工作。我们非常感激能有你的参与。对于不太熟悉的人，你能不能简要描述一下你认为的核心创新是什么，或者说你通过 Alpha 真正给这个领域带来了什么？
Original English >> So, we've had the luxury of spending some time together this year and touring the schools and what you've built with Alpha is just incredible and it's inspired us at HA. We're grateful to have your your involvement. And for for people who are unfamiliar, what why don't you just briefly describe what you think of as this the central innovations or what you've really br to to the space with uh with Alpha.
>> 好的。我们正在重塑 K-12 学校，重塑上学日，对吧？也就是孩子们在课堂上或学校大楼里度过的那六七个小时是怎样的体验。你首先必须理解并认同的一点是：教学设计和传授方式在过去一百年里都没有变过，对吧？就是把一位老师推到教室前面。而正确的做法是什么？现在如果回顾过去的几十年，随着认知科学和学习科学的发展，加上大语言模型的出现，你可以构建一个让孩子学习速度提升10倍的学习引擎，对吧？一旦你拥有了这种能力，让孩子们学习的速度比过去一百年里老师站在教室前面的模式快10倍……
Original English >> Sure. So, we're reinventing how K12 school is um uh you know the the school day, right? How kids spend their six or seven hours that they're in class um uh or in a school building. What is that like? And sort of the the first part that you have to understand and buy into is that uh you know instructional design and delivery hasn't changed for a hundred years right you throw a teacher in front of the classroom and what's the right way to do this and now if you look you know over the last couple decades with cognitive science and learning science plus the advent of LLMs you can build a learning engine that teaches kids 10 times faster right and so as soon as you have that ability where kids can learn 10 times faster than they could the last hundred years with a teacher in front of a classroom model.
### Alpha 的三大承诺：喜爱学校、高效学习与下午的生活技能 >> 问题就变成了：你用它来做什么？这就是我们在 Alpha 所做的事情，也就是如何重新构想上学日？在我们的模式中，我们对孩子们做出三项承诺：第一项是他们要喜爱学校。上周我刚刚拿到调查结果，我们有90多百分比的孩子说“我喜爱学校”。学校里50%的孩子说“我宁愿去上学也不愿去度假”。实际上我有一个校区，65%的孩子都表示“我宁可去上学也不去度假”。如果你要在那里待12年，那就建一所孩子们喜爱的学校。但依托这个引擎的第二部分是，我们的做法是让孩子们每天花2小时学到的东西，是坐在课堂里6个小时外加做家庭作业的两倍。所以每天只有2小时用于学术学习，而且他们学得更多。如果你不断累积并且学到的内容是你在其他学校的两倍，那么假以时日，无论你的起点如何，你都会进入前1%。
Original English >> The question is what do you do with it? And so that's what we're doing at Alpha, which is how do you reinvent the school day? And so, you know, in our model, um, you know, we make three commitments to the kids, which the first is they love school. Um, and I just got the surveys back uh last week. 90ome% of our kids say, "I love school." 50% of the kids at the school said, "I would rather go to school than go on vacation." I actually have one campus where it's at 65% of the kids are like, you know, uh, I'd rather go to school than vacation. Um, and so, you know, build a school where kids love it if you're going to be there for 12 years. But then the second part with this engine, what we do is the kids learn twice as much in 2 hours a day as sitting in class for six and doing homework. And so, you know, it's it's two hours a day, right, of the academics and they learn more, which, you know, if you're compounding and learning twice as much as you would at your other school, right, you're going to get to top 1%, you know, sort of no matter where you start given time.
>> 所以孩子们成绩非常拔尖，在标准化考试中名列前茅，我们是学术表现最好的学校。
Original English >> And so, the kids crush it and all, you know, the best on standardized tests were the best academic performing school.
>> 然后第三项承诺就是：一天中剩下的时间你要做什么？我认为这就是我们现在讨论的核心内容。嗯。
Original English >> And then the second and the sort of the third commitment is well, what would you do the rest of the day? And I think that's a whole thing of what we're talking about now. Mhm.
>> 我相信现在每所学校——不论是 K-12 还是大学——都必须思考：如果传统方式和传统课程现在的完成速度快了10倍，那一天的剩余时间该做什么？
Original English >> I believe now every school and it doesn't matter K12 university has to say if the traditional way and the traditional curriculum is now 10 times faster what do you do with the rest of the day
>> 作为一名校长，我可以肯定地告诉你，家长们绝对讨厌的一件事就是我在2小时后就把孩子送回家。
Original English >> and as a principal I can definitely tell you the one thing parents would hate is if I sent the kids home after 2 hours
>> 对吧，你需要带他们一整天，一天六到七个小时。孩子们希望待在那里，他们喜欢那里。我们的做法是去思考：为了在即将到来的世界中茁壮成长，哪些生活技能是至关重要的？世界正在改变，对吧？我们该怎么做？因此我们设立了五类生活技能：领导力与团队协作、创业精神与财务素养、社交与建立关系、讲故事与公开演讲、毅力与努力工作。然后你在小组里和所有朋友一起做项目，由一位成年人来引导他们。这就是你度过下午时光的方式，也就是一天剩下的时间。Alpha 最初只在奥斯汀，去年我们增加了12个校区，现在已经达到50个。需求极其旺盛，人们想要这种新事物。但我们算是先驱者，而每个人都将不得不面对这个问题。今天没有人相信“2小时真的管用吗”，我们需要实现规模化并获得更多证据支撑。但一旦你意识到孩子们在2小时内就能学完他们需要的所有东西……
Original English >> right you got them all day you six six seven hours a day right and the kids want to be there right and they love it and and you make it so it's what we do is it's what are all the life skills that we consider critical to thriving in the world that's coming, right? The world's changing, right? What do we do? And so we have we have five categories uh of life skills, leadership and teamwork, entrepreneurship and financial literacy, socialization, relationship building, storytelling, public speaking, grit, hard work, right? And so then you're doing projects, you know, in a group with all your friends with an adult, right, who's who's writing them. And that's how you spend your afternoons, right? The rest of the day. And so we've, you know, so Alpha, you know, we started, we had, we were just in Austin, then, um, you know, we added 12 campuses last year. We're up to 50. You know, demand's insane. Uh, that, you know, people want this this new thing. But I think it's, you know, we're we're sort of first, but everybody's going to have to look at this. That is, you know, today no one believes, oh, does a 2-hour work and we have to get scale and and more proof points. But once you realize, wow, kids could learn, you know, everything they need to in 2 hours.
>> 是的。每个家庭、每位学校领导、每个人、全世界的每位教育主管官员都会问：“我们如何为下一个一百年重构上学日？因为我们不需要再像过去一百年那样去做了。”
Original English >> Yeah. every family, you know, every head of school, everybody, every, you know, um, education minister around the world is going to say, "How do we rebuild the school day, right, for the next hundred years, because we don't need to do it like we did the last hundred?"
### 产品化与高标准：为何孩子热爱挑战 >> 是的。我记得6年前去过 Alpha，那是在你全职投入之前。我立刻就理解了，因为我在学习科学和教育领域已经待了15到20年。但我必须说，我认为你做出的转变在于其可信度。我认为你在展示其可行性方面做得非常出色，而且很快人们就会问：我们为什么还要用其他方式来做？从商业角度来看，我认为这就是你过去5年所取得的卓越成就。
Original English >> Yeah. I I remember visiting Alpha 6 years ago. Um, this is before you were full-time on it. And I immediately got it because I've been in learning science and sort of education for for 15 to 20 years. But I will say that the shift that I think you've been able to make is the believability of it. And I think you've done a great job of figuring out how to show that not only does this work, but pretty soon people are going to ask, why would we ever do it any other way? Um, and that's really the brilliance of from a business standpoint, what you've accomplished over the last 5 years, I think.
>> 是的。我是四年前成为校长的，我的背景是产品和创业，这件事情正好需要某种产品包装，也就是如何将其产品化为一个易于理解且可规模化的事物。另一个难点在于，学校很难进行规模化，如何保证质量的同时进行规模扩张？这也是我前三年的工作重点：如何做到这一点。引入 AI 的一大好处正是它能帮助你在保持高质量的前提下进行规模扩张。我们的口号是“我们随着规模扩大而变得更好”。如果你看过去四年的各项指标，无论是考试成绩、客户满意度、学生幸福感，还是工作坊的质量，所有这些每年都在变好，因为系统会随着变大而变得更好。
Original English >> Yeah. I think I you know I became principal four years ago and my background is product right and entrepreneurship and this just needed sort of product packaging right which is how do you productize this into something that is understandable and scalable right that's the other part is it's really hard to scale schools how do you scale them to quality and so that's for my first three years right it was is how how to do that and that's actually one of the big benefits of you know bringing AI is it helps you scale um at at high quality. Um, you know, our phrase is we get better as we get bigger. And if you look at anything over the last four years, our test scores, customer s, you know, employ uh student uh happiness, the quality of the workshops, all of those get better every year because the system gets better as it gets bigger.
>> 是的，我们有很多队友、同事、朋友把他们的孩子送过去，你看到孩子们非常喜欢。这是怎么做到的？我记得自己当时很讨厌 K-12 的经历。究竟是什么原因？是这种两小时的安排吗？你觉得是什么让孩子们如此热爱学校，以至于其他学校也应该借鉴？同样，我们在镜头外也聊过，学习动力被低估了，或者说它可能是拉开孩子们不同成果的最大要素之一。你们在这方面又是如何解决的？
Original English >> Yeah, we have a number of uh, you know, teammates, colleagues, friends who send their kids off and just the Do you see the kids love it? What is it? And I remember you know, hating my you know, gay 12 experience. What is is it this two-hour, you know, sort of arrangement? Is it like what is it that you find is most contributing to kids uh loving it that other schools should should be adopting? And similarly, we were also talking off camera about how motivation is is underrated or or maybe, you know, nearly like one of the biggest elements in terms of what is separating outcomes for kids. How are you tackling that as well?
>> 我认为最核心的事情是，教育科技在历史上并没有在学校中取得良好表现，没有产生人们期望的影响。如果你看着这个学习引擎说“哦，这就像教育科技，我只需把它放入普通的上学日中”，那它注定会失败，会和以往的所有东西一样。当我和听说过 Alpha 及学习引擎的人交谈时，我只有一个问题，这也是一切的核心：你是否愿意重新设计你的上学日，让孩子们喜爱学校胜过假期？如果有某位学校领导给出肯定的回答，那就成了。但这种跨越和动力显然属于这个范畴：如果你每天醒来都在思考“我怎样才能让孩子们喜欢这里”，这正是让我们能够开展其他所有事情的核心。当人们听到这些时会担心：“哦，那岂不成了迪士尼乐园，他们只是四处乱跑不学习，或者缺乏严谨性，只是在玩电子游戏或看电视。”
Original English >> Yeah, I I think the biggest thing is um you know, edtech historically hasn't done well in in schools, you know, hasn't had the impact uh that people wanted. And if you look at this learning engine and say, "Oh, this is like edtech and I'm just going to put it into a normal school day," it'll fail, right? It'll be just like everything else. And you know when I talk to somebody who hears about alpha and they hear all this learning engine I one question and this is the core of everything which is are you willing to redesign your school day so kids love it more than vacation and if you have a head of school who says that right then you're all set right but that that leap right and that motivation falls under that obviously which is if you are waking up and saying how am I going to make kids love this
>> 是的。所有这些担忧，而事实恰恰相反。我们经常讨论的一点是：让孩子快乐的关键在于高标准。孩子们想要去挑战困难的事情，他们喜欢攻克难关，并且喜欢和朋友们一起做困难的事。如果只是整天玩电子游戏，他们在家就能做。而要坐在那里说出“我想上学而不是去度假”，是因为他们正在和朋友一起做自己热爱的具有挑战性的事情。是的。
Original English >> right that is the core of what allows us to do everything else and people are worried, you know, when they hear that of, oh, it's Disneyland and they're just running around and they're not learning or it's not rigorous video games or TV. Yeah. And all these things and it's literally just the opposite, which is, you know, one of the things we talk about is, you know, the key to your child's happiness is high standards. Kids want to go do hard things, right? They love to do hard things and they love to do hard things with their friends, right? If it was just playing video games all day, they can go do that at home, right? And but to sit there and say, "I want to do this instead of vacation." It's because they're doing challenging things with their friends that they love. Yeah.
### 团队协作与个性化学习：从密室逃脱到80-85%精准难度区间 >> 这其实并不难。举个简单的例子，比如团队协作，以及作为团队去互相激励同学。在传统学校里他们不教这个。在美国，放学后的体育活动当然会培养团队协作和领导力，但学校里不会。实际上学校里大多数团队项目或小组作业都很糟糕：一个人在做，其他人只是干坐着。你一定记得那些糟糕的项目，你学到的反而是团队合作的反面模式。在我们的学校……
Original English >> Um and it's and it's just it's not hard. Like an example like an easy example is you know so like teamwork right and you know uplifting your classmates as as a team. You know in traditional school they don't teach this right after school sports absolutely in America teamwork leadership. But in schools they don't. Actually most team projects in school group projects are terrible. One person does it everybody else just sits around right? You always remember those. They were terrible, right? And so you learn the opposite of Tabwork. You learn like the anti-attern. And you know, in our school,
>> 一个很好的说明是：沃顿商学院有一个 MBA 挑战项目，他们有一个登珠穆朗玛峰的模拟测试。50%的 MBA 都在团队协作上不及格……
Original English >> actually a good indication of that is, you know, the Wharton has an MBA challenge where they have a simulation that you take and it's go up Mount Everest. 50% of MBAs fail the teamwork
>> 因为他们在整个求学阶段从未接受过团队协作的系统培养。
Original English >> because they never were taught teamwork sort of their whole, you know, stack through through school.
>> 我们把每个三年级学生都带过来，给他们戴上麦克风，把他们放进密室逃脱里。他们必须通关密室，而在结束时……
Original English >> We take every third grader, right, and we mike them up and we throw them into an escape room, right? and they're all getting through the escape room and at the end of it
>> 我们让 AI 分析他们的对话记录：你的语言中有多少百分比是以团队为导向的、是在提供帮助的？我可以告诉你答案：初始时只有不到20%的语言是相互激励的，大部分都在争吵、强推自己的想法等等。针对这个我们设立了一个为期8周的工作坊，他们反复进行，不断回到团队协作上来。为了毕业通过这门课，他们必须达到85%……
Original English >> we have AI analyze the transcript what percent of your language right were you team oriented were you helping or were you and the answer I can I can give you the answer less than 20% of the language is uplifted fighting and pushing in my idea right all these different things and so we have an 8week right or 8week you know workshop for this and they go through it and they keep going back to the teamwork and to graduate right to pass the class, they have to get up to 85%.
>> 是的。
Original English >> Yeah.
>> 达到85%的团队行为。而且我们还会向他们展示：在具备团队协作的环境中，他们解开密室的速度快了三倍。
Original English >> Right. Of right. Team team behavior. And you know, we also show them that they finish the escape room three times faster.
>> 是的。
Original English >> Yeah.
>> 当你在团队环境中时就是如此。这是一种极佳且有趣的方式，孩子们很喜欢。这也是一项生活技能，每位家长都会说：“这正是我希望孩子学到的东西。”是的。
Original English >> Right. When you're doing team environment. And that's just a great fun way. Kids love it. It's a life skill that every parent's like, "Oh, that's the stuff I want my kids to learn." Yeah.
>> 因为他们不必整天坐在课堂里，所以他们能够做到这些。到了四五年级，我们的生活技能课程和核心课程一样严格。通过物理或数学考试，和通过密室逃脱测试是一样的。在四五年级，我们实际上让他们去通过沃顿商学院的 MBA 挑战——那项有50%的 MBA 学生都无法通过的测试。当你看到四五年级的孩子通过了它，这就回到了自豪、兴奋和积极主动的状态。你可以在更年轻的时候吸引他们并传授这些技能。我相信着眼于当今世界，我们以前没有能力在这么小的时候教会孩子们这一切，因为你整天都要坐在教室里；但既然现在我们能做到，我们当然必须去做。
Original English >> And because they don't have to sit in class all day, they can do that. And then fourth and fifth grade, right? Our life skills curriculum is as rigorous as our Yeah. you know, core, you know, passing a physics test or a math test is, you know, you have to pass, you know, the escape room test. You know, in fourth and fifth grade, we actually make them pass the Wharton MBA challenge that 50% of the NBA's can't. And you take a fourth and fifth grader and they pass it, right? That back to being proud and excited and wanting to do it, right? You can engage them and teach these skills much younger. And I believe as we look at the world, you know, we haven't had the capability to teach kids, you know, all this at a much younger age. Um because you're sitting in class all day, but now that we can, of course, you know, we must.
>> 是的。所以他们享受其中的原因在于，他们能切身感受到自己学得更快、成长更快、建立了更深厚的人际关系，总的来说，这是在度假中得不到的。
Original English >> Yeah. So, so the reason they're they're enjoying is cuz they can feel themselves learning faster, growing faster, building deeper relationships, and just overall uh you know, that's something you can't get on vacation.
>> 是的。这给家长树立了很高的标杆。第二点，针对你提到的为什么孩子不喜欢学校，我们把学术和生活技能分开来看。在学术方面……
Original English >> Yeah. Well, and it's well, it's like that would you that escape room like it's it's a high bar for your parents. The second is to your point of what else kids you know kids don't like school a lot of ca let's talk academics versus life skill there's sort of two different different on the academic side
>> 孩子们不喜欢做自己会失败的事。无论在学术上还是任何事情上都是如此。这就是为什么在美国体育运动中我们会让孩子留级，因为你想让他们长得更强壮，然后突然间他们就表现得更好并赢得比赛，获得赞誉，从而走上正轨。而在美国的学术体制中，因为我们实行的是基于时间推进的系统，一旦你落后了……
Original English >> kids don't like to do things they fail at that's true on academics that's true on anything that's why in America we hold kids back on sports right because you want to give them they're bigger right then all a sudden they're playing better and they win and then they get the accolades and okay right and you get them on that path and in academics in America because we're a time based system, right? Once you fall behind,
>> 剩下的时间就成了一种折磨，无论你在哪里落后，都变得痛苦不堪。
Original English >> right? Then it's just now it's torture the rest of the time, right? Wherever you fall behind, right? And it's just it's you're and
>> 而在我们的系统中，因为学习引擎会为你提供个性化的课程。
Original English >> in our system because our learning engine will give you a personalized lesson.
>> 是的。
Original English >> Yeah.
>> 这与你的年级无关。你可以读八年级，但如果你需要五年级的课程——因为在来到 Alpha 之前你遗漏了该知识点……
Original English >> Right. It doesn't matter what your age grade is. You can be in eighth grade and if you need a fifth grade lesson cuz whatever before you came to Alpha, you missed it.
>> 引擎就会为你提供五年级的课程，你能够做出来、能够理解并顺利通过，然后继续前进。因此，我们在学术上为孩子们设计成功的体验。如果要说这个引擎的核心价值是什么，那就是确保孩子们处在80%到85%的正确率区间。如果你在做某件事，怎么判断它太容易还是太难？如果正确率是100%，那就太容易了，你什么都没学到，只是在复述已知的内容。任何电子游戏开发者都会告诉你，如果你掉到三分之二以下，失败率超过三分之一，你就会丧失兴趣。因此，面对坐着30个人的教室，老师无法做到、而学习引擎能够做到的，就是确保源源不断地为孩子提供准确率在80%到85%之间的课程和问题。太难了，我们就提供脚手架课程帮助他们赶上；太容易了，就加快推进进度。如果因为提供的任务是他们力所能及的而让孩子们保持投入，他们就会喜欢上学习。当孩子们真正取得好成绩，同时你又对他们保持高标准时，他们会非常兴奋，看到自己在学术上势如破竹而不是苦苦挣扎。当他们做得很好时，他们自然会热爱这一切。
Original English >> It's going to give you the fifth grade lesson, right? And you're going to be able to do it. You're going to be able to get it. you're gonna be able to pass it and then move forward. And so, you know, we engineer wins for the kids in the academics that, you know, if you had to say the core value of what the engine does is, you know, for the kids, you you basically want kids in this 80 to 85% correct zone, right? Like just what percent of the time if you're engaging with something, is it too easy or too hard? If it's 100% correct, it's too easy. You're not even learning anything. and you're just regurgitating what you know. And any video game developer will tell you if you drop below 2/3 and you're failing more than 2/ird of the time, you're going to disengage. So, one of the things that, you know, a learning engine can do that a teacher in front of a classroom with 30 people can't do is make sure the kid gets an unending stream of lessons and questions that's 80 to 85% accurate, right? And we can just do it. And if it gets too hard, right, we can give them scaffolding lessons to catch up, right? Too easy, you progress them faster through the material. And if you keep kids engaged because you're giving them work they can do, right, then they like that. And when kids actually do well, right, and you hold them to high standards, right, they get very excited, you know, and just they see themselves crushing their academics instead of struggling with it. And when they're doing well, right, they they love that.
### 从 K-12 到大学：以学生为中心的体系重塑 >> Gagen，我很想知道你是如何看待这场对话，以及 Alpha 在 K-12 阶段的探索对我们与 HA 的合作有什么启发？
Original English >> Gagen, I'm I'm curious how you think about this conversation and what Alpha is doing, you know, in K2 and how that informs what we're doing with with AJ.
>> 受到了极大的启发。自从我第一次走访 Alpha School 以来就深受触动，我认为它证实了我们在 Horowitz and Dre Academy 的核心假设：如果你用现代工具为现代时代重新设计系统，你可以在产出方面得到你想要的一切。你可以拥有更好的网络，很多人说上学是为了人脉网络，我们将把你的网络质量提升10倍。大家都说去学校是为了成为更好的人，Horwitz and Dre Academy 绝对希望你成为更好的人，我们将对系统进行设计，使你更有可能成为一个正和的人。你想拥有强大的自主行动力（high agency），想去做困难的事，Alpha 在如何确保学生获得这些方面给了我很多灵感。我认为唯一的不同在于，在每个年龄阶段你必须采取截然不同的做法。听 Joe 讲述，K-8 和高中非常不同；从高中过渡到大学时代，又完全不同。因此突然之间你必须做出正确的调整，不能直接照搬一切。归根结底，如果你拥有以学生为中心的心态——如果你告诉全美任何一所顶尖大学的领导者，他们的首要且唯一的职责就是确保学生取得成功，我相信美国会有很多出色的学校。遗憾的是，这样的学校并不多，因为大多数大学领导被迫把90%的时间花在他们周围的成年人身上，而在学生身上投入不足。而你在 Joe 身上看到的一点是，他总是在谈论孩子们。
Original English >> Incredibly inspired. I think that I've been inspired by Alpha School since I first visited and it proves I think the thesis that we have at the Horowits and Academy that if you redesign the system for the modern era with modern tools that you can have everything that you want in terms of outcomes, you can have more network. A lot of people say you go to school for network. We're going to take your network and make it 10x better. Everyone says you're going to go to school to become a better person. Like Horwitz and Dre Academy absolutely wants you to become a better person. We're going to engineer the system so that you're more likely to become a positive somehum. You want to have high agency and you want to do hard things like Alpha has given me a lot of inspiration on how to ensure that students get that. I think the one difference is that at every age range you have to do something very different. So if you actually listen to Joe talk K8 high school very different when you go from high school to college era very different and so now all of a sudden you have to make the right changes you can't just copy everything over that is uh and so ultimately if you have a student centric mindset you know if you just told the leaders of any major university in the country that their number one job and no other job was to make sure that the students were like succeeding. I'm sure that there would be many great schools in the United States. Um, unfortunately, there aren't many. Uh, because most university leaders are required to spend 90% of their time focused on all the adults around them and not enough on the students. And one of the things you see with Joe's is always talking about the kids.
>> 是的。Joe，我很好奇，你非常慷慨地作为投资者和顾问参与到了 HA 中。关于我们的探索，是什么让你感到兴奋？你又是如何看待大学和高中之间的区别的？
Original English >> Yeah. Joe, I'm curious. You've, you know, very generously uh gotten involved with HA as an investor and adviser. what um what excited you about what what what we're up to and how how have you thought about the differences between you know college and uh and high school?
>> 我感到超级兴奋，因为我坚信大学和我们在 K-12 所做的一样，需要被彻底重塑。虽然我专注于 K-12，但我非常兴奋你们能够站出来说“我们来做这件事”。所以凡是我能帮上忙的我都全力以赴。第一，我需要为 Alpha 的孩子们寻找接纳他们的去处。
Original English >> So, I'm I'm super excited because I absolutely believe that university needs to be reinvented just like we have in K12, right? And so, I'm focused on K12, but I'm very excited uh that you guys jumped in and and said, "Let's do this." So, anything I could do to help I I I want it one I need places for alpha kids to go.
>> 是的。
Original English >> Yeah.
>> 会有一整批孩子渴望去到那里。正如你所说，它们完全不同。我们高中的模式就与 K-8 非常不同，我认为大学也必须与众不同。我不认同那种认为所有人高中毕业后都不会再去读大学的论调。我其实不这么认为，我相信重塑大学并让它变得精彩存在着巨大的机会。没有人想去糟糕的学校，面对糟糕的体验且无法为未来做好准备。举个例子，今年夏天有超过70名来自麻省理工学院、斯坦福大学和德克萨斯大学的学生来到 Alpha 实习，我们交流的一部分就是让他们聊聊大学生活：情况怎么样？感觉如何？我问：“你们当中有多少人认为现在的大学无论哪一所正在让你为毕业后的真实世界做好准备？”只有一个孩子举了手。我当时就惊了：“认真的吗？你们其他人都不觉得？”他们说：“我们很害怕。我们拼搏了12年才考进这些顶尖名校，但现在我们非常担心毕业时以往那些刚入行的岗位已经不存在了，那些一两年的初级岗位没了，AI 正在替代它们。我们该怎么办？”于是今年夏天这些实习生花了大量时间构想他们认为大学该如何重塑、他们真正想要的是什么。回到孩子们渴望做困难事情这一点，这些实习生来到这里提出：“我们要构建一个专用的教育 LLM，以便让全世界的所有人都能免费使用，因为每个主权实体都将需要自己的教育大模型或设备端运行的小语言模型。”
Original English >> Right. that there's, you know, there's going to be a whole set of kids who are like, I I want to go there. Um, and uh, you know, and so what what have we done, you know, what have we thought about? To your point, it's completely different, right? Each each our high school is very different than our K8. Um, and I believe university needs to be different. And I don't believe the whole concept of, you know, is university is everybody just going to come out of high school and not go to university anymore? I actually don't think that's true. I believe there's a huge opportunity to reinvent university and make it awesome. No one wants to go to a bad school, right? And where it's terrible and it's not getting the kids ready. You know, as an example, we got we had um uh we had uh over 70 MIT and Stanford kids and UT came to Alpha this summer um as interns and part of what we were saying is tell us about university. How's it going? You know, what do you think? And I was like, "How many of you guys expect that, you know, this university is getting you ready, whatever one you're going to, is getting you ready for the world when you graduate?" And one kid raised his head. Like, it was just like I was like, "Seriously?" Like, "None of you?" And they're like, "We're terrified. We do not feel, you know, we worked, you know, our 12 years really hard to get into these great universities." And now we're terrified that, you know, when it comes time to graduate, there's not going to be those jobs that you used to get coming out of it. you know, those first one and twoyear jobs aren't aren't there, you know, and AI is going to be doing it. So, what do what do we do? Um, and so we they spent a lot of time this summer as interns, you know, coming up with what they thought, you know, would be um, you know, reinvention of university and what they would want. Um, and, you know, and back to kids wanting to do hard things, right? you know, these they were interns and they came in and they came up, you know, we're going to build this educational LLM, you know, so we can make it free for everybody in the world because every sovereign is going to need its own, you know, uh, LLM, educational LM, small language model sit, you know, so not an small language model that sits on a on a device.
>> 那些孩子每周工作80个小时，去摸索、做研究、研究学习科学的概念。他们的成果将会发表。到最后他们说：“这就是我们希望大学该有的样子——大家一起攻克极具挑战性、对世界具有重大意义、能够真正推动改变的事情。我们希望这些能成为麻省理工、斯坦福或德克萨斯大学的正式课程……”
Original English >> And those kids worked 80 hours a week, right, figuring out, doing research, figuring out the concepts of learning, right? They're going to be published, right? Um and you know at the end of it they're like this is what we would love the university to be where we're all working together on this super hard thing right that has meaningful impact to the world right that could could really help change the world like I wish these could be classes at you know
>> 但现实中并不是。这就是我对你们正在做的事情感到兴奋的地方：重塑大学，让孩子们真正去创造和构建。这不仅关乎课程本身，更关乎为现实世界做好准备，以及掌握所需的所有技能。我相信大学阶段的这些技能有所不同，但我对你们围绕此构建的方案感到非常振奋。
Original English >> MIT and Stanford and UT um but they're they're not right and that's when I think about what you guys are doing of reinventing it and letting kids really build right it's not just about the classes it's about getting ready for the real world and all those skills you need. I believe those are different at university, but I'm very excited about what you're you're building around that.
### 动机驱动的学习：打破传统大学的“大班讲座”模式 >> 是的，我认为至关重要的一点是理解：一个进入大学的普通学生如果有雄心壮志，他们需要亲自动手实践。他们在三到四年内就要步入现实世界，去亲自构建东西、体会实际情况、犯错误并直面挑战是极其关键的。你提到他们将研究作为80小时工作周的一部分，我很欣赏这一点……
Original English >> Yeah, I think it's really important to uh understand that an average student who's going to university who's really ambitious, they need to get their hands dirty. like they are entering the real world in 3 to four years and it's super critical for them to be going and building things and understanding what it's like and making mistakes and dealing with the challenges and you know I really love that you said that they were studying
>> 他们在奥斯汀参加每周80小时的实习，你提到了学习与研究，我猜你并没有布置任何教科书。
Original English >> as part of the 80our so they're in they're in Austin for an 80hour week internship and you mentioned studying and I'm guessing you didn't assign any textbooks
>> 没有，他们必须为了构建一个大语言模型而自主完成所有研究。所以他们字面意义上去研究学习科学，研究我们被称为“brain lift”的数据结构，并且付出了艰苦的努力……
Original English >> No, they and back to this, they had to go do all the research to build an LLM. So they literally are researching learning science, researching it the, you know, we have this data structure called the brain lift, you know, that they and they were working hard,
>> 放在传统大学里这些会被视为必须完成的经典学业内容，但在这里它不仅仅是读书研究，而是如何应用并成为一个构建者。
Original English >> right, on what would be considered classical, you know, stuff you need to do at a university, but it wasn't just the studying part. It was how do you apply it and be a builder,
>> 是的，我认为你说得对，做好准备涵盖了这两方面。你提到过学习有90%取决于动力。
Original English >> right? And I think your point of getting ready is is it's both. Well, you talk about learning as being 90% motivation.
>> 是的。
Original English >> Yeah.
>> 当你18岁时，你的动力来自于构建人们会使用的东西，来自于创造收入、获得工作等等。那么，为什么不让整个学习体验都由这种动力来驱动，并利用这种动力去促使人们真正学习知识呢？因为我对大学的担忧在于——我和 Eric 都有过这种经历，我们聊过这个——我当时其实没学到多少东西，因为我不喜欢那种模式。坦白说，我现在去斯坦福或别人的校园，似乎没人喜欢这种模式。20年前我还属于少数派，大约只有20%的学生认同我，当时上课出勤率大约有一半；而现在我听说到课率远远低于10%。学生们觉得这种形式根本不管用。你必须重塑这种形式以激发动力，让他们真正学到东西。是的。
Original English >> And when you're 18 years old, you're motivated by building things that people will use. You're motivated by revenue and getting a job and that kind of thing. And so, why not make the entire learning experience uh driven by that motivation and using that motivation to actually go and learn things? Because my my concern with college is I I mean, I know Eric and I had this experience. We've talked about it like I didn't learn very much because I did not like the format and to be honest now I go to Stanford's campus or someone other someone else's campus. No one seems to like the format. So 20 years ago I was a little bit in the minority maybe 20% of students agreed with me. Um our classes were about half full I would say in attendance. I hear they're now way under 10% full. You know people are students are not finding the format to work. you need to reinvent the format in order to create motivation so they actually learn things. Yeah.
>> 这正是 Academy 的核心重点之一。
Original English >> Um and that's one of the main focuses of the academy.
>> 另一个例子是，三年前 Alpha High 迎来了第一届毕业生。在他们上了大学后的那个圣诞节，我把他们召集在一起，问：“大学怎么样？在真实大学里表现如何？”因为这很关键：从这里毕业后在大学里表现如何？
Original English >> No, I think another example is, you know, our first graduating class from Alpha High was three years ago. And so at Christmas after they'd all been, you know, at at university, I you know, I got them together. I was like, "How's it going?" Like, "How do you do in real?" Because that's right. How do you do in university after you come out?
>> 他们回答：“挺好的，我们很喜欢。”他们所有人的 GPA 都是4.0，成绩拔尖。但他们说：“那些大班讲座课完全是浪费时间。”他们中有五个人甚至给校报写了社论，直言这纯粹是一场演戏：学生们走进来刷 TikTok 或在电脑上做别的事，根本不听讲或者直接逃课，老师也不好好教，他们觉得这些根本没有存在的必要。我问：“那你们喜欢什么？”他们说：“喜欢那些精彩的小班研讨会，在社团以及相关的各种活动中投入。”大学就像是一个产品包，对吧？他们喜欢这个组合包，但对于像大班讲座这样的纯学术部分，他们觉得应该被淘汰。
Original English >> And they're like, "Okay, we love it." They all had four O's. They were crushing it. And but they were like these hundred series lecture classes are a complete waste of time. Five of them had written editorials to their school paper about how it's just a charade. How the kids come in are like scrolling TikTok or, you know, on their computers not paying attention or not showing up and the teachers aren't, you know, teaching and they're just like that those don't need to exist anymore. Right now I was like, well, what do you like? And they're like, oh, there's all these great small groupoup seminars. were working on, you know, uh clubs and and all the activities around it. The, you know, a university is a bundle of products, right? And they liked, you know, the bundle, but the actual academic part of like these big lecture classes and stuff, they're like that needs to go away.
>> 是的。
Original English >> Yeah.
>> 荒谬的是，你提到的那个学术讲座部分，恰恰是大学官方唯一正式提供的服务。
Original English >> And what's crazy is that that academic part that you're talking about is the only thing the university formally provides.
>> 实际上这个包里的其他部分都是由学生自主驱动的。
Original English >> So, it's actually the the the rest of the bundle is student driven.
>> 是的。而学术部分占据了大约50%的时间，对吧？
Original English >> Yeah. Um, and the academic stuff takes up about 50% of the time, right?
>> 我从斯坦福退学了，我当年就是那样的学生。对我来说并没有占去50%的时间，因为我翘课了；但如果你去上课，确实如你所说。回想我在那里的几年经历，之所以很棒是因为其他所有事情：结识的人，比如史蒂夫·乔布斯过来做演讲，我的一个朋友随后就去 NeXT 工作了；比尔·乔伊（Bill Joy）和斯科特·麦克尼利（Scott McNealy）会过来演讲，之后你可以和他们交流或共进午餐。所有这些结识他人、接触现实世界的经历，加上和朋友一起做项目——这些后来变成了我们的公司——对我而言才是那款产品的真正魅力所在。而坐在那些大班讲座里，体验完全相反。是的。我们谈到了如何让学生热爱学校。但当然，决定孩子去哪里上学的更关键群体是他们的家长。是的。所以谈谈你与家长的对话是如何演变的，无论是针对基础教育还是高等教育，以及你给他们的建议。
Original English >> Well, so I just, right, I dropped out of Stanford, right? And I was this kid, which was it didn't take up 50% of my time because I me but if you go if you go to the classes, it takes what you said. But back to I my experience there and you know for the couple years I was there. It was great because of all the other things the people I met you know Steve Jobs came down right was given a talk and one of my friends went and was working at next and you know uh Bill Joy and Scott Mcneely would come and and and talk and you'd go spend time with him afterward or have lunch. all of those experiences that you had of who you met and you know seeing the real world plus building stuff with my friends, right? Uh that eventually became our company, right? That was what was great about the product to me and sitting in these lecture classes were, you know, uh the opposite of that. Yeah. One thing we've talked about is how to make the students love it. But of course, uh you know, even more important constituent in terms of where where kids go to school is their parents. Yeah. And so talk about how the conversations you're having with parents are evolving whether it relates to, you know, uh, early education or or higher education and some of the advice that that you give them.
### 家长观念转变与“1910年拖拉机时刻” >> 好的。我与数以万计的 K-12 阶段家长交流过……
Original English >> Great. So, you know, Yeah. So, I I talked to tens of thousands of parents now, you know, sort of in the K12
>> 在 K-12 这个阶段，这种转变其实让我感到震惊。虽然仍有一些家庭表示：“我是幼儿园家长，我希望能有一条直通常春藤盟校的现成路径。”但有同样数量、甚至更多的毕业于斯坦福或哈佛的家长却表示：“不，我知道我不想让我的孩子走那条路。你们打算如何让他们为这样一个不同的世界做好准备？”是的。
Original English >> K12 range and I've been shocked actually at the at the switch, which is there's still some families who are like, you know, I'm a kindergarten parent and I I want to see the direct path right into the Audi league. Um, but an equal number, maybe even more, of parents who went to Stanford or Harvard who are like, "No, I know I don't want my kid on that path. How are you going to get them ready for a world that's not that?" Yeah.
>> 他们非常渴望看到另一条替代路径。因为当他们审视时，哪怕是在幼儿园阶段，他们往前看12年后的未来，会想：“我们该怎么做？你们如何让我的孩子为那个世界做好准备？”他们对世界的看法是：是的，我当年上了常春藤盟校，但这不适合我的孩子，我认为那无法让他做好准备。如果你告诉我还是老一套，我不要你们的 K-12 学校。这种情况现在屡见不鲜。
Original English >> Right. And they absolutely want to see this alternative path cuz when they look, especially even in kindergarten, they're looking forward 12 years from now and they're like, you know, what am I going to do? you know, and how are you preparing my kid for the world? And my their vision of the world is yes, I went to the Ivy League, but that's not going to be for my kid. I don't think that's going to get him ready. And if you're telling me that, I don't I don't want your I don't want your K12 school. And so we're that that's happening a lot now.
>> 他们在寻找新的出路。因为我认为大家现在意识到——相比过去三四十年——世界真的在发生巨变。如果你跟高二或高三学生的家长交谈，他们基本放弃了改变的想法，只想说：“只要让我孩子进大学就行”，他们觉得已经在这条轨道上走到了最后5码线，不想再推倒重来。
Original English >> Um and they're they're looking for what what are they? Cuz I I think there's recognition now, you know, versus maybe the last 30 or 40 years that the world is really changing, right? And you know, if you're an 11th grade or a 12th grader and I'm talking to you, the parents are sort of done. They're like, just get my kid into college, right? Or, you know, they're sort of like, I've I've been on this route and I'm at the 5 yard line. I'm not throwing all the cards up in the air.
>> 但当你去看低年级时，那些家长会觉得，目前的路径绝不可能是正确的。因此我认为，当你们去面对需求时，你们会迎来孩子们的巨大需求，他们会觉得：“这太显而易见了，太棒了，我必须去。”但你们需要对家长开展另一场说服工作，向他们证明：虽然这与你们当年的方式不同，但这是未来的方向。这里有一个历史先例可能对你们有用，如果你们想了解的话：1910年，90%的美国人只有八年级文化水平。
Original English >> But when you look younger, right, those parents are like, there's just no way that the current path is going to going to be the right one. And so when I think you know of of this I would expect and I don't know when you get your demand you're going to have massive demand from all the kids right who are going to be like okay I have to go do this it's so obvious this is awesome and then you will have to have a separate sales job right with the parents right to show them look while it wasn't the way you did it right this is the way and you know um you know there's there there there's a historical precedent for this that um you know might be useful for you, right? If if you want to go through it, which is you know in 1910, you know 90% of America had an eighth grade education.
>> 当时基本上没有高中……
Original English >> Um there was no high schools basically,
>> 超过30%的美国人是农民……
Original English >> right? And over 30% of America's a farmer,
>> 所有人都在农场上，八年级足够了，大家都在地里干活。随后在1910年，凯斯（Case）拖拉机开进了美国农场。你可以去翻当年的广告，它看起来就像现在的 Anthropic 广告一样写着：“一台顶50个农工”（正如现在说“顶50个程序员”）。当时几乎所有美国人都意识到：30%的岗位要消失了，我们的子孙后代代代相传的劳作方式彻底结束了，那条路走不通了，我们必须让孩子为新的未来做好准备。
Original English >> right? And so everybody's on the farm. Eighth grade was enough. You're working in the fields, right? In high school. And then um in 1910, the tractor case tractor rolled up on the American farm, right? And literally, you can go look at the ads. It literally looks like an anthropic ad. You know, does the work of 50 programmers, does the work of 50 farm hands and literally everybody in America realized 30% of the jobs are going away, right? My kids and grandkids, we've been doing this for generations. It's gone. That path is gone. And we have to get our kids ready for this new future.
>> 是的。
Original English >> Yeah.
>> 我认为现在的家长也有着同样的认知。传统路径对应的那些工作正在受到冲击，就像今年夏天来的那些实习生一样，他们感叹：“从斯坦福、麻省理工毕业，我们可能连工作都找不到。”但当年全美13万个城镇的做法是：他们投票决定提高税收，去资助一种他们从未体验过的教育体系——他们从未见过高中课程，也没上过高中。他们只有八年级学历，但他们明白必须采取与自身背景截然不同的举措，必须以不同的视角看待世界，以帮助孩子们做好准备并获得好工作。在当时，那个学校体系逐渐演变成了过去一百年里的工业化教育体系，它在过去的一百年里运作得非常出色。但现在到了迎接下一轮变革的时刻，你们需要说服那些家庭像1910年的农村农民一样意识到：尽管自己未曾经历过，也与自己的过往不同，但这正是孩子在未来茁壮成长所需要的。
Original English >> Um and it was that same recognition I think that parents have today. The the traditional path is those jobs. It's the the hund the kids coming in the summer where they're like, "I'm going to get out of Stanford, MIT. I'm not going to have a job." Right? And um but what America did back then is 130,000 towns, right? We used to have a it was um they voted to actually raise their taxes and this is the key part, fund an education that they'd never experienced. They'd never seen a high school curriculum. They'd never been to high school, right? right? They had an eighth grade education, but they knew they had to do something different than their background, right? They had to see the world differently to get their kids ready, right? And get them the good jobs, which back then that school system became the industrial system we've had the last hundred years. It it served us really well for a hundred years. But now it's time for the next change. you're going to have to convince the families to be like those 1910, you know, uh, rural farmers who realized, while I haven't experienced it and it's different than what I did, this is what my kid needs to thrive in the future.
### 早期接纳者与破局点：从谨慎观望到规模爆发 >> 是的。对于那些说“我要把孩子送去常春藤盟校，我知道它不完美，但你们是一个新机构，我为什么要冒险把赌注押在 Academy 上？”的家长，你会怎么对他们说？
Original English >> Yeah. And and what would you say to the parent who's saying, you know, hey, I I'm sending my kid to a Ivy League school. Um, I know it's not perfect, but this is a new institution. you know, why why should I take a risk? Why why would you consider taking a risk on on uh the academy?
>> 在过去的四年里，我在 K-12 阶段切身体会到了这一点。
Original English >> Yeah. Um so I've been living this actually at the K12 level now for four years.
>> 是的。
Original English >> Yes.
>> 幸运的是，你不需要赢得所有人。这就像其他任何技术或模式的采纳曲线一样：有一批家庭明确意识到现有系统已经不行了；还有一些人内心有所感觉，只需要有人推他们一把。我自己的两个女儿在八年级时，别人都说如果她们去 Alpha 就不可能考上大学，必须去传统学校，否则绝无机会。这种分歧一直存在。但对于家长来说，看看四年前送孩子去 Alpha 的家庭与没去的家庭——选择 Alpha High 与走传统路线的人相比，有很多家庭现在后悔地表示：“我当时真应该送孩子去 Alpha。”他们走了一条自以为安全但其实并不安全的传统路线。看到 Alpha 的孩子们现在蓬勃发展，他们当年觉得这帮人太疯狂、太冒险了，如今面对现实，他们追悔莫及。我认为你们必须挺过第一年，因为一开始你们没有任何数据支撑；但一年之后，大家就会看到学生们表现出色，一旦看到这一点，对比就显现了。我甚至可以拿自己的经历来说：虽然我现在谈起来非常乐观积极，但12年前 Alpha 并不是由我创立的，而是由麦肯齐·普莱斯（Mackenzie Price）和布赖恩（Brian）创立的。我上的是天主教学校，我的孩子们当时也在天主教学校。虽然我不喜欢那种学校，但家长们总希望孩子按照自己被教育的方式接受教育，这就是遗留习惯与痛点，也是必须克服的障碍。当时麦肯齐对我说：“来我的新学校吧。”而我是大学肄业生，曾在一间车库里创办了初创公司，我的反应是：“学校怎么能在车库里办呢？这太奇怪了，麦肯齐，你办了个粗制滥造的奇怪学校。”我当时完全就是这么想的。
Original English >> And it it is one where you know back to the the lucky part is you don't need everybody, right? It's there's going to be that set and when we would talk when I talk to families you know it's there's a you know it's an adoption curve just like any other one and there's a set of families who absolutely realize the current system's just not there right or the people who sit there and say I feel it but I just need to be you know moved over um you know the number you know I both my daughters right you know were told they're not going to get into college you know when they were at eth paid, you know, if they went to alpha and they had to go to a traditional school, right? And there was just no chance that, you know, uh, that would occur. And so you're there there is that, you know, dichotomy, but for parents, you know, if you look, you know, sort of across the families who went to alpha four years ago, right, and the ones who didn't, you know, went to Alpha High versus not, there's a lot more families who are like, I totally should have sent my kid to Alpha, right? that I went the traditional path, right? I thought it was the safe path and it totally wasn't. And look at how those alpha kids are thriving and I thought those guys were crazy and risky, but now looking looking at the reality of what happened with my kid who didn't go to alpha versus those, they regret it. And you know, I believe that you you have to get through the first year because you don't have any data. But one year in people are going to see that the students are thriving, right? And once you see that, then you that's the comparison. And I'll I'll even go back to my own experience on this, which is I sort of am talking very positive and optimistic, but I I didn't start Alpha 12 years ago, right? Mackenzie Price and and Brian did. And you know, uh I had my I went to Catholic school. My kids were in Catholic school. I didn't like it, but you know, parents want their kids educated the way they are. That's the legacy. That's the problem, right? That's what we have you have to overcome. And so my kids are in Catholic school. And no, you know, and and Mackenzie's like, "Well, come to my new school, right?" And I I dropped out of college. Like I I started a startup in a garage. And I'm like, "Schools shouldn't be in a garage. Like this is so weird, right? You have a janky weird school, Mackenzie." And I was totally right. I was right. And then
>> 我花了两年时间。
Original English >> it took two years
>> 我是那个反应迟缓的人，我花了两年时间才转过来。
Original English >> for me. So I was the slow I Right. It took me two years to move over.
>> 那已经是10年前的事了。显然后来对我们全家来说结果非常好，但我的孩子们现在依然会因为我当年迟缓了两年而责怪我，他们说：“爸爸，你当初应该更早行动。”所以寻找那些早期接纳家庭非常重要。我们在全美各地奔走，开设了50个校区，说明会有上千人参加，你会问：谁愿意成为前10个？前25个或50个？一年前我们开设那12个校区时，说明会上一千多人，我们有时连25个人都招不满，往往只能招到10个人；我们在纽约开设校区时只有10到12个人……
Original English >> Um and uh and then finally, that was 10 years ago. you know, obviously turned out great for uh you know, our family, but uh I look at that, my my kids still yell at me for being slow those two years, right? They're like, "You should have started earlier, Dad." Um but that concept of, you know, finding those families and so we travel all around the country, right? We've opened 50 campuses, you know, and you get, you know, a thousand people in the info session and you're like, who wants to be the first 10? Who wants to be the first 25 or 50, right? And a year ago when we were opening the 12 campuses literally thousand plus people in info sessions and we couldn't get 25 right we would get you know 10 right we opened New York City with you know 10 or 12
>> 而现在那个校区已经满员了。
Original English >> and uh now the campus is full
>> 总共达到了150人。他们需要先看到第一批人的成功，然后一切就顺理成章了。所以第一届学生往往是那些明知现状糟糕而渴望投身其中的人。你们很快就会看到，这正是我们在需求端所见证的：大家只是需要有人先行一步，一旦有人带头且证明可行，需求就会呈爆发式增长。
Original English >> right the 150 you know total people and you know they had to go see the first ones that it works and then it's there so your first the first class is always those people who are like I know it's bad I want to jump in what you will see immed immediately and sort of what we're seeing on the demand is people just need someone to go first and once you get that first and it works the the demand just skyrockets
>> 成为先驱者的回报是非常高的。从把孩子送到 Alpha 的同事和朋友身上，或者从参加过泰尔奖学金（Thiel Fellowship）的朋友身上我看到——刚开始时申请人数同样很少——那些早早申请的人对自己的信念充满勇气，这是积极的自筛选机制。因此无论是在孩子层面还是家长层面，你周围都是最聪明、最有勇气的一批人，这确实是一种非凡的体验。
Original English >> and the benefits of being first are are high you know what I see in colleagues and friends who are sending their kids to alpha or even you know friends who've done something like teal fellowship um which is also small application numbers in the beginning is those people who are applying early have the courage of their conviction it's positive self- selection and so you're around some of the most brilliant people, some of the most courageous people both on the kid level and the parent level and uh it's really just a phenomenal experience.
>> 回到对此的建议：你绝对需要双方——家长和孩子——都全心投入的家庭，因为过程中难免会遇到波折与小插曲，这是初创阶段必然的一部分。如果是极其怀疑的晚期采纳者，他们会被波折彻底击垮而承受不住。而那些真正渴望这个产品的人……我们常谈到“磁吸营销”（magnet marketing）：吸引对的人，劝退错的人。对于那些在说明会上表示“我不喜欢 AI 或屏幕时间”的落后者，我会直接建议他们别来。如果无法把握这种办学特色，明确你的产品定义是至关重要的——大多数学校做不到这一点，但明确“我们是什么、不是什么”有助于找到最契合的群体。当对的群体聚在一起时，因为包含了社区属性，所有学生以及家长社区在创业阶段都非常关键，创始家庭如今是我们学校最大的财富之一，我相信在你们的事业中也会如此。
Original English >> And I that is back to advice on that you absolutely want the families who are both sides, right? All in because it is there will be hiccups, right? There's just there's hiccups that happen and for sure and you know it's just it's part of it when you're starting and someone who's super skeptical and on the you know the late adopter side they're just going to not right they're it's going to destroy them right because they won't be able to handle it the people who are over here who really want the product right we talk about magnet marketing you want to attract the right people and repel the wrong and people who want to be laggers I don't like AI or screen time you know that's a set of people in the infosition say that I'm like I you shouldn't Um I I you know if you can't balance right what this offering is it's being clear on your product definition is a a thing that I don't think most schools do but if you're clear on your product definition this what we are this we're not it helps you find those right group and exactly what you talked about when the right groups together right because part of its community right you're building the community there all the kids who are there and the parent community does matter when you're doing startup our founding families are one of our biggest assets now um you know uh at our school and I believe it'll be the same for for what you're doing.
### 大学试错的低风险与自主意识觉醒 >> 是的。这让我想到两点：第一，我认为我们在录取审核上会非常严格，而不是过分看重班级规模。你跟我说过这个，我也听过这种建议，这是一堂非常重要的课。第二点是，这种项目你并不希望大多数人都想要它，你只希望那些真正极度渴望它的人加入。另外我还想补充一点：我们设定为一年制，而且第一年免学费，所以它的风险实际上比错过八年级要低得多。
Original English >> Yeah. Yeah. I think that that makes me think of two things. One is I think we're going to be pretty uh like strict about who gets in and less about class size. You've told me this, I've heard this. I think that's a very important lesson. The second lesson I think is that um this is the type of thing where you don't want most people to want it. you want the people who really want it to do it. Um, and then actually I'll add one more thing which is we did make it one year and it's not no tuition the first year. So it is also a little bit less risky than you know you're missing eighth grade. Yeah.
>> 你不想错过八年级，八年级不能重来，但……
Original English >> And you can't repeat you know you don't want to miss eighth grade but
>> 如果你从大学抽出一年的时间绕个道，随时都可以回去，其实并没有什么实质差别。所以这确实是我们的优势之一。观察大学体验与高中体验的微妙差异很有意思，因为双方所面临的赌注在不同维度上是截然不同的。
Original English >> if you take one year uh detour from college you can always go back. It's it's really no different. So I do think that's one of the things we have the benefit. It's one of it's interesting to see the nuances of a college experience versus a high school experience because the stakes are different in different directions.
>> 我相信这一年制将成为你们面对家长的王牌之一，因为这里没有下行风险，尝试它没有任何弊端。你可以随时在其他大学办理延期入学或重新申请，所以并未切断其他选项。面对家长，正如之前提到的——学习有90%取决于动力——当孩子真正热爱它时，如果让我给那些孩子极度渴望加入的家长提建议，那就是放手让他们去尝试。即便最终没有成功，这也会成为他们人生中最宝贵的学习经历，他们随时可以转回传统轨道。而反向去压制这种想法，反而危险得多。
Original English >> I believe that is going to be one of your assets with the parents on the one year is there there's no downside, right? There's no downside to trying it, right? And uh you can always defer at some other college or reapply. And so you're not you're not, you know, um shutting down other options. And you know, and just to the parents stuff, what you'll see is, you know, when your kid loves it, back to schools being 90% motivation. I I I just, you know, if I was talking to the parents here and they were their kid really wants to go, I just give you advice for all the stuff is just let them go do it, right? Let's even just say it doesn't work out for him, right? And whatever and it's not it'll be the best learning experience of their life, right? And they'll be right ready to do the other. and fighting that the other way. It just is isn't as riskier in this.
>> 是的，去压制它的风险要大得多。我们在高中阶段有太多这类故事了。
Original English >> No, it's much riskier. And we can go to a lot of stories I have of of those at our high school level.
>> 回想我们三个人以及许多我们认识的人，大家在某个阶段都不怎么喜欢上学。
Original English >> Well, I I think that's actually if you if you think about the three of us and we're we're there are actually like many people we all know who are like us who didn't love school at some point.
>> 我们最讨厌的是什么？
Original English >> And what is the thing that that we dislike the most?
>> 对我来说，就是被迫去做那些我自己并不认可的事情。
Original English >> And for me, it was that I was being forced to do things that I was not bought into.
>> 是的。比如在13、14、15岁时，我的自主意识开始觉醒，我开始看穿“皇帝的新装”，意识到：“等一下，我的老师其实根本不知道怎么教数学，这可能不是最好的数学教学方式。糟糕，现在我还得去应付这个愚蠢的考试。”所以，我认为 Academy 和 Alpha 的核心教学理念之一，就是围绕学生进行设计，以降低产生这种叛逆心理的几率。
Original English >> Yeah. like my agency had started to grow 13, 14, 15 years old and I started to, you know, see the emperor had no clothes and I started to to believe like, wait a second, my teacher doesn't actually know how to teach math. Like, this might not be the best way to teach math. Oh, shoot. So, I got to take this stupid test now, you know? And um a and and so I think that one of the pedagogical philosophies of the academy and of alpha is that you design it around the student to increase the chance that you or to decrease the chance that you get that rebellion.
>> 是的。
Original English >> Yeah.
>> 相反，如果获得了他们的认同，他们更有可能茁壮成长并做出成就。
Original English >> And instead if you have buy in they're much more likely to thrive and do things. And so, you know,
### 从叛逆退学到全力以赴：高标准与做困难的事 >> 我可以分享一个亲身经历：在 K-12 期间我总是惹麻烦，经常逃学。我付出了考上斯坦福所需的最低努力，考上之后我就退学了。当我退学时，我父亲曾在《福布斯》之类的刊物上留下一句名言，大意是“我的儿子是个……”之类的话，他当时非常生气。但文章里没写的是几年后的事：我退学后创办了我的公司，进展很顺利，我突然间每周工作100个小时，大家睡在办公桌底下，极其拼命。两年后他对我说：“我必须改变我的看法，你当年退学是有史以来最正确的决定。”他说：“我得承认，我当时非常担心你会变成一个懒惰的家伙，因为你过去的学业表现就是那样。作为一个父亲，我很害怕自己没把你教育好。但现在我看到，一旦你在做自己热爱的事情，你就会全身心投入，我当初真该早点促成这件事。”我认为面对学生也是同样的道理：当我们谈论建立一所让孩子们喜爱胜过假期的学校时，你是在围绕他们热爱的事物调动他们的积极性。当你做到这一点时，很多家长会惊叹“我的孩子一个月内就彻底变了”，因为我们让他们去做他们自己想做的困难事情，这种转变就是这么迅速。
Original English >> no, and I think that's I and I'll tell the personal story on this, which is, you know, um I during my K12, I was always in trouble, right? I was skipping school all the time. I did the minimum to get into Stanford, you know, and then I dropped out, right? And when I dropped out, my dad had a famous quote that was like on Forbes or whatever, you know, my son's a you know, and you know, and sort of, right? and uh he was not happy and um you know but then the part that didn't get in the article was you know a couple years later so I dropped out and then I started you know my company and it was awesome and then all a sudden I'm working 100 hours a week and we're sleeping under the desks and it's just you know it's crazy crazy and you know two years later he's like you know I I got to change my mind this was the greatest thing ever that you dropped out. He's like, he's like, you know, I I have to admit, you know, I was really worried that you were going to be a lazy little you know, and cuz that's was your academic career, right? And he was like, as a dad, you know, I was just terrified that I had, you know, done poorly. And he's like, now I see that now that you're doing what you love, right? You're fully engaged, go I should have, you know, gotten this done earlier. And I think that's the same thing when you have a student like when we talk about building a school they love more than vacation. You're engaging them around stuff they love, right? And when you do that, that's what causes all the parents who say, "My kid changed in a month." It's because we have them doing hard things that they want to do, right? And all of a sudden it does change and it's that quick,
>> 拥有一所孩子因为要去迎接挑战而主动想去的学校，是一件非常棒的事情。我相信这也是为什么这套模式会取得巨大成功的原因之一，因为你会吸引所有这些孩子，他们会说：“我知道这很难，但我想去做。”
Original English >> right? And and having a a school where your kid wants to go to it because they're going to be doing hard things, right? Is, you know, is as as is it's a great thing. And I believe that's why one of the reasons why I think this is going to be a home run because you're going to get all these kids, right, who are like, I know it's hard. I want to go do this.
>> “我本可以在普通学校里轻松混过去，但我不会选择那条路。相反，我要选择这条路，而这会比其他所有学校都要艰难。”孩子们热爱这种挑战。我们高中有一个“世界学校”（World School）项目，他们会在非洲度过一年进行志愿服务，出发前必须签署一份合同，上面写着“我明白这将是我人生中最艰难的一年”。所有人都签了字，大家都非常喜欢，兴奋地前往。我认为这与你们正在做的事情有着异曲同工之妙。
Original English >> I can coast through normal school and I'm not going to pick that path. Instead, I'm going to pick this and this is going to be harder than all the other schools, right? In what you're doing in all of those. And and that's the, you know, that's part of it. And and kids love it. You know, we have we have in our high school, we have a world school where they're spending a year in Africa, a year of service, and they have to sign a contract that's like, I realize this will be the hardest year of my life, right? And they all sign it, and they all love it, and they're super excited to go, right? And I believe this is sort of the equivalent uh of that.
>> 顺便提一句，我在非洲待过相当长一段时间。其实也可以送一些孩子去印度或斯里兰卡，那里的挑战会严峻得多。
Original English >> By the way, one note, I've spent a fair amount of time in Africa. I would send some kids to India or Sri Lanka. It's going to be much harder.
>> 好建议，我们会把它列入清单。它叫“世界学校”，所以他们会走遍各地，但我很喜欢这个想法。把非洲作为目的地本身就是一件了不起的事。我们探讨过的一个设想是设立津贴——我们不常对外公开讨论这个，但我们已经为每位学生拨出了5,000美元的旅行预算。我个人的目标是（虽然由他们自行决定如何使用旅行预算，我不会强加给任何人），希望他们中的许多人能够独自前往人均 GDP 低于20,000美元的国家。这能带来广阔的视野。
Original English >> There we Okay. Well, that'll that'll be on the list. That'll be it's called World School, so they're going to be going, but I love that. I um I think Africa that's such an amazing thing that you're doing. One of our wishes that we've talked about, we we have a stipen, we don't talk about this too much, but we we've already allocated $5,000 per student to uh for a travel budget. And my personal goal, now they get to decide how they use the travel budget. I'm not going to force anything on anyone, but my personal goal is that a lot of them go solo to countries with less than $20,000 GDP per capita. Yeah, it's a great idea. Yeah, this perspective.
>> 我完全赞同，这极其宝贵。
Original English >> No, I totally I think that is that's uh super valuable.
>> 你会学到很多关于自己和生活的认知，而且这种视角对未来的商业活动大有裨益。
Original English >> Yeah, you you learn so much about yourself and about life and I think that it also will provide perspective that will help in business. Of course.
>> 是的。
Original English >> Yeah.
### 从被动接受到主动创造：职场真正看重的核心能力 >> 很有意思，回到关于那些在学校里被贴上“懒惰”标签的孩子的话题。正如你提到的家庭故事，像我们年轻时以及很多类似的人，之所以没拿到4.0的成绩，只是因为不认同那套体系；但一旦找到了热爱的事业，他们愿意每周工作100个小时。反之，另一类人能拿全 A，可一旦脱离了预设的框架，他们并没有培养出内在的渴望或寻找热爱之物的能力；当他们步入技能要求截然不同的职场时，就无法正常施展拳脚了。我强烈感觉到，你们从更早的年龄阶段就为孩子们创造了空间，让他们真正接触到自己关心的事情，变得更加自我驱动，这非常有力量。
Original English >> You know, it's so funny going back to this idea of, you know, kids who are the story you mentioned your parents reminds me, you know, kids like us when we were younger and and others who are quote unquote lazy in school and that they, you know, don't get 4.0 because they're just not bought in. But when when they find the thing, they're willing to put 100 hour weeks. Um there's so many people like that. And conversely, there are people on the other side who will get straight A's, but once you take away the structure, they haven't really cultivated this inner desire or this ability to find what they love. And when they get to the working world and in which the skills are just remarkably different, they they can't they can't operate in in the same way. And um it just strikes me that we're going to just create the space and you're you're creating the space, you know, from a much earlier age where people really get to get in touch with what they care about, be much more self-driven and um yeah, it's just really powerful.
>> 是的，这就是所谓的生活技能。当我们谈论培养一个全面发展的人时，不仅仅看其 GPA。你可以在成绩上拿到满分，但这并不意味着你在现实世界中能表现优异。我认为家长们实际上意识到了需要更加全面，只是缺乏实现的途径。在重塑大学方面，你们将向他们展示：这些核心能力应该成为大学正式课程的一部分，而不是课后由学生选择性参加的社团活动。我认为雇主显然也会意识到这一点。
Original English >> Yeah. No, that you know the correct that the those are what are all the life skills that's when you talk about a holistic person. It's not just what their GPA was and and you can you can max, you know, uh score max on on just your grades, but that is not something that means you do well in the real world. And I think parents actually realize that, you know, you need to be more well-rounded. They just don't have a path of of doing it. And I believe that one of the things back to reinventing university, you're going to show them here's all these things that should be part of the university curriculum, not a club after that the kids, you know, optionally do. Um, and so I think that's going to be a great a great thing. I I think employers obviously will realize the same thing.
>> 坦白说，雇主们似乎非常认同。
Original English >> Yeah, I the employers seem very bought in honestly.
>> 在这一点上的沟通完全没有任何阻力。很多雇主都反映，刚毕业的学生缺乏实际干活的技能和素养。如果你在我创立公司之前看我，问我是否准备好胜任一份工作，我显然没有；但两年后，在我做完了这个校外非学术项目之后，我可能就成了一个非常优秀的候选人。
Original English >> Yeah, that that part's that part of the whole thing is there's no there's no there's no problem on that pitch which is right the number of employers are like these kids coming out right don't have the skills and capability to do it and it is that you know they uh well if you had just taken me you know before I actually started my company and looked at me and said you know are are you ready for a job I wasn't but then you know two years later after I was doing this outside project Yeah right this you know non non academic project, then I'm like, I'm probably a pretty good employee to hire.
>> 是的，这很有趣。大多数雇主面临的痛点其实并不是“你是否懂得编程、设计或打造产品”这类硬技能的差距；我们听到最多的其实是人际交往技能、心智成熟度和系统性思维。这些才是真正的核心技能。而学习这些的唯一途径就是真正与大量的人互动交流……
Original English >> Yeah. Yeah. It's funny actually because the issue that most employers have is not one of a skills gap in the like do you know how to code or build products or design. It's I mean what we hear more than anything is uh people skills, maturity and systems thinking. You know those things are the the actual skills. So the only way to learn those things is to actually just interact with lots of people,
>> 必须亲自去构建复杂的系统。
Original English >> have to build complex systems.
>> 是的，迫使自己面对被拒绝的现实，经历缺乏外部预设结构、必须自我构建框架的成熟过程。
Original English >> Yeah. Right. Um and uh being able to forcing yourself to deal with the reality of rejection and sort of uh the maturation process of not having things structured for you, but having to structure them yourself.
>> 回到 AI 正在将智力大宗商品化这个话题，当问及 AI 时代我们追求的人性特质是什么时，答案是领导力、团队协作能力、自主行动力（agency）、主人翁意识以及接收反馈的能力。所有这些你都可以通过做项目获得，但坐在教室里是学不到的。
Original English >> Yeah. No, those as back to AI commoditizing intelligence, right, and scoring on this when you can ask it, you're like, well, what is what are the human traits you want, right? And it is it's leadership, right? It's being able to work in a team. It's agency, right? It's ownership. It's receive feedback, as you say. All of those skills, right? Um uh that you have to have that you can get from doing projects. Yeah. But you don't get from sitting in class. Yeah.
### AI 时代的学习法：认知摄入与成为构建者 >> 关于 AI 对编程、数学或物理的影响，目前有许多讨论。结合你现在的认知，如果你今天刚满18岁，面对未来的趋势和自身的兴趣，如果有机会在类似 HA 这样的地方自主设计自己的教育，你会如何思考自己有动力去学习什么？
Original English >> Yeah. There's a lot of questions around what is AI doing to coding? What is AI doing to math? You know, what's it going to do to to physics? If if you were, you know, knowing what you know now, but if you were 18 years old today with with with your interests, how would you think about, you know, if you had the flexibility at something like ha to kind of design your own ed education, how would you think about what you would be motivated to learn based on what where you see the world going and your own interest?
>> 我有一个思维框架：关于认知摄入（cognitive onload）。AI 让你将知识装进脑海的速度提升了10倍。
Original English >> Yeah. So I we I sort of have this this this framework, right? And um of you know load there's sort of cognitive onload, right? And AI allows you to fill your head with knowledge 10 times faster.
>> 是的。
Original English >> Yeah.
>> 这些孩子可以比以往任何时候都更快地成为自己所选领域的专家。
Original English >> Right. So these these kids can become domain experts in their field that they want to faster than ever.
>> 是的。
Original English >> Yeah.
>> 我高中的一些学生正在重构我当年写的 Timeback 软件栈，他们正在成为学习科学领域的专家并有能力完成重构。这在以前的高中是无法想象的。因为认知摄入速度提升了10倍，你用不了多长时间就能完成。我可以在一年内学完相当于硕士课程的内容；但第二部分在于，AI 赋予了你成为构建者的机会，赋予了你无与伦比的构建超能力。我相信在你们大学里的学生会意识到：“我想去构建某些东西，我将以前所未有的速度学习所需的预备知识。”就像今年夏天的实习生一样，他们查阅资料、学习知识，全都是为了构建产品。如果你和我们 Alpha High 的高中生交流，他们对 AI 和未来绝非悲观主义者，反而会对成年人说：“你们这帮大人完蛋了，我们掌握了超能力，我们要来颠覆你们了。”看着这些孩子开发的应用程序，我预计两年后大部分学习软件将由学生编写，多数学生将通过同龄人编写的软件进行学习，因为这些软件融入了学习科学的所有概念，而且有趣得多。
Original English >> Right. I mean I I have kids in my high school who are rebuilding the timeback software stack that I wrote. Right. and they were becoming experts in learning science and and and being able to do this right which wasn't able to be done before in high school. So the cognitive onload part because it's 10 times faster you do it and it doesn't take that long right and so I can get the equivalent of a mast's you know while I'm you know in a year right and you know uh do that part but then the second part is the AI gives you a chance to be a builder right it gives you superpowers to build like no one else right and I believe that's the kids who are at your university is they're going to realize I want to build something and I'm going to learn faster than I ever have whatever prerec just like those the the interns this summer were doing it, right? They were doing research, right? Learning all this stuff, but they were doing it doing it to build. And I believe just, you know, if you talk to our high school kids at Alpha High, they're definitely not doomers about like AI in the future. They're like, you adults are cooked like we're coming for you and we have superpowers, right? And they do like that is these kids. No, these kids who are building like these apps, I'm like, you know, my, you know, I'm like, two years from now, I absolutely expect most learning software is going to be written by students. Your most students are going to learn from learning software written by their peers, right? Because it'll embed all the learning science concepts, all these things, and they will make it more much more engaging.
>> 是的。
Original English >> Yeah.
>> 我们在这方面已经有了大量数据支撑。顺便称赞一下 Austin，他开发了我们的 AP 课程体系，所有选修该课程的孩子都在 AP 考试中拿到了5分满分。他还开发了一个世界历史课程，做成了一个地理类游戏，将世界历史事件结合毒舌 AI 进行了 S 级排名。所有这些词我也只是照搬，并不完全懂其含义，但每个孩子都极度投入并且学得津津有味。我意识到，我和老一辈的成年人团队永远不可能做出这种东西。这些孩子将去构建未来，而 AI 让他们在大学一年级就具备了构建未来的能力。
Original English >> Right. And we have plenty of data around that already. You know, shout out to Austin who built our AP curriculum and he built this crazy great curriculum and all our kids who took it got a five on their APs, you know, and he built a world history one, but he did it cuz he built this geoging game where he took all these world history events and, you know, and did an S tier ranking with a snarky AI. Anyway, all these things that I I'm throwing those words out cuz I don't actually know what he really, you know, what they mean, but every kid was like engaged and loved it and did it. And I'm like, okay, me and the old adult team are never going to be able to build that ever, you know. And so I think that's that's what these kids are going to be able to do is they're gonna go build the future. Yeah. Right. And AI gives them the capability to build the future and start freshman year of college.
>> 是的。
Original English >> Yeah.
>> 回应你的问题，Eric：我认为“我应该学习什么专业才能确保在未来立于不败之地”本身就是一个错误的问题，真正的问题应该是“我对什么领域感兴趣？”
Original English >> Um, just to take a stab at your question, Eric, you know, I think the question of what field should I study so that I can be sure that I'm resilient to the future is is not the right question. So the question is what field am I interested in?
>> 是的。
Original English >> Yeah.
>> 我有充分的信心，只要你在任何领域成为 AI 原生的人，学什么其实并不重要。很多人担忧编程或数学，但在 AI 原生数学家的推动下，将会诞生全新形式的编程与数学。那些依然依靠黑板和纸笔的老派做法确实行不通了；但热爱数学的新一代学生会表现得极好，他们将完成我们以前认为不可能做到的事，一个全新的数学家时代即将到来。这也是我们在 HA 极力筛选的标准：我们绝不招收那些只求“未来不受冲击”的人。这是一种非常防御性的处世之道，而我们希望你采取进攻态势，去追问“你对什么感兴趣？我会想办法搞懂它”。举个例子，我从事教育行业，在过去的15到20年里，教育并不是创业者最赚钱的赛道，我只是恰好在过去15年中做出了教育领域为数不多的几个成功案例之一，这本质上是一个糟糕的市场。
Original English >> And I think there's enough I have enough faith that if you're I AI native in any field it does not matter. You know a lot of people are concerned about coding or math. Look there's going to be a whole new type of coding and math that happens with the AI native mathematicians. It's just that the old school ones who are still doing chalkboard and pen pencil and paper are cooked. But the new students who love math, they're going to do just fine. In fact, they're going to go and do things none of us ever thought possible. And so there's going to be a whole new era of mathematicians are going to be successful. So I I think and that's actually by the way something that we we are trying to screen for a lot at HAA um which is that we really don't want someone who's like I want to make sure I'm resilient to the future. It's uh it's a very uh defensive way of approaching the the world and we want you to be on offense. We want you to say what are you interested in? I'm going to go figure it out. You know as an example I work in education. Education has not been the most lucrative founder field of the last 15, 20 years, right? Like it just so happens that I built one of like four wins in education in the last 15 years, right? Like literally, it is a terrible market.
>> 历史上一向是个糟糕的市场。我们要改变这一点。
Original English >> Yeah. It's it's been historically a terrible market. We're going to change that.
>> 我们绝对正在做出改变。但我仍然对自己从事这项事业感到由衷的高兴和自豪，我依然觉得自己能够保持与从事 AI 或 SaaS 等领域的人同等的水准。我选择了一个我热爱的领域，过着健康而充实的生活；我虽然不是亿万富翁，但过得很好。在任何领域，只要能进入前1%的顶尖水平，都会非常出色。
Original English >> We absolutely are changing. Um, but I'm still super happy and proud that this is what I work on and I still get to, you know, I still feel like I know how to operate at the level and quality of someone who's doing something in AI or doing something in SAS or whatever. I've chosen a field. I love it. I have a very healthy and fulfilling life. I'm not a billionaire, but I'm I'm doing well. And you know, I think anyone who gets to that level in any field, if they're in the top 1% of their field, it's it's going to be fine.
>> 是的。
Original English >> Yeah.
>> 我很赞同你说的，这关乎培养孩子的优秀品格，绝不是被动承受。不要抱着“世界将变成什么样、将强加给我什么”的被动视角，而是“我们要去创造这个世界”。这些孩子是未来的创造者，你可以被动地感叹世界会变糟，也可以选择主动去构建它。我们需要培养一代乐观的构建者。我们的学生都读过《理性乐观派》（Rational Optimist），他们深知自己能够掌控未来。我们作为教育者的使命，就是确保大学能够培养出这样一代走出校门、能够乐观熟练运用 AI 并矢志创造精彩未来的人才。
Original English >> And I love what you said, which is I I actually believe very much what we have to do with with, you know, back to raising kids, right? And building high character, you know, kids uh for the future. Your point of they're not this isn't passive, right? this back to what is going to happen to the world and it's going to be imposed on me. It's like no, we're going to go make the world, right? These kids are the ones who are creating it, right? And you can you can have the passive view of what happens, right? And oops, it's going to be bad. Or you can be the other, which is no, I'm building it, right? And we need to create a generation of builders who look at this optimistically, right? All our kids read rational optimist, right? and they sit there and say, "Yes, I'm in control of it." Right? And we need to build our future. Um, and we need to raise the next generation and have our kids coming out of university sort of, you know, as they they I look at the world and I'm like, I want this next generation coming out of university to be the ones who are optimistically capable with AI and saying, we're going to build an awesome future. Right? That's what our job as educators are, is to go build that world. um and uh make sure that our universities do that.
### Founder School 与百万美元承诺：提升下一代的抱负 >> Joe，这是一场非常棒的对话。最后我想了解的是：你实际上正在为高中生创办一所名为“Founder School”的创业学校。能谈谈你创办它的初衷、它的运作模式，以及为什么它值得我们借鉴吗？
Original English >> Joe, this was an amazing conversation. I think the last thing that I'm thinking about is you're actually building an entrepreneurial school, right, for high school students called Founder School. Can you tell us a little bit about why you built it, how it how it works, and and why you think it's a good model for us to be inspired by?
>> 当然。在我们的生活技能体系中，包含创业精神与财务素养。我们对未来就业有着强烈的观点：由于 AI 的发展，大型财富500强公司的规模将会缩减，但这将引发创业的爆发式增长。AI 为创业者提供了巨大的机遇，而这恰恰是以往学校从未教过的。我们从幼儿园就开始教学，教每个幼儿园小朋友如何赚钱、储蓄、消费、投资和捐赠，我们甚至有名为“alphas”的货币体系来进行启蒙。创业并不是天降闪电凭空发生的，它是一套可以传授的技能。到了高中阶段，我们设立了专门的 High School Founders，让想创业的孩子在此度过高中生活。让家长们不敢相信的是：我们保证你在高中期间创立一家能够实现100万美元利润的企业，否则退还全部学费。我们坚信这些技能是可以被可靠、可重复地传授的，学生以此为基础创办企业。学校在八月份开学了，基于过去四年的积累，我们已经有了成熟的经验，现在将其做成了专门的学校。课程是阶梯式递进的：先赚到100美元，学会相应技能，再到1,000美元、10,000美元、100,000美元，最终达成1,000,000美元。才开学几个月，孩子们已经在快速通关，看起来他们第一年就能赚到100万美元，我的课程都不够用了，而他们才高一。孩子们表示接下来显然要做更大的项目。这种能力的培养很大程度上依赖于技能以及人际交往与网络。
Original English >> Sure. I mean I back to skills you know one of our our life skills stack is entrepreneurship and financial literacy you know we actually have a very strong point of view of when we look at the jobs of the future you know big Fortune 500 compan are going to be smaller you know because of AI but I believe it's going to be lead to an explosion of entrepreneurship right AI gives entrepreneurs this great opportunity and it's something we just don't teach right we just don't teach kids this so we we teach it we have a stack starting in kindergarten right We literally teach every kindergartener, you know, how to earn and save, spend, invest, donate, right? Get them get that foundational going, right? We have a currency called alphas to to start teaching them this. Um, but back to it's a entrepreneurship is not, you know, a bolt of lightning and it just happens. It's a set of skills, right, that you can teach people. And so, uh, you know, we teach them, but by the time you get to high school, we have a high school founders, uh, which is sort of our peak specialized school for that. This is for kids who want to spend their high school building businesses. Um, you know, the part that's crazy that parents don't believe, you know, is we you we guarantee that you'll start a business that will earn a million dollars of profit while you're in high school or we give you all your tuition back, right? That we absolutely believe that these are skills that can be taught, right, repeatably and reliably where I actually can build a business on that. And, you know, so it actually opened in August. We actually have from Alpha High kids, right? People who've been able to build businesses over the last four years. So, we have data points, but this is now a specialized school for that. And, you know, we it's scaffolded. You know, they come in and they have to earn $100, and there's a set of skills they have to learn, then $1,000, then $10,000, $100,000, and a million dollar. And, you know, we're only a couple months in, you know, to where the process is. And kids are speedr runninging it, and we're like, okay, they're going to earn a million dollars in the first year. like I'm out of curriculum and they're freshman, right? And I'm like, "Okay, well, you know, and the the the kids are like, okay, well, I'm going to then obviously just do a bigger one after that." But that concept of can they do this, you know, can you build it? And I believe a lot of it is just, you know, there's a set of skills around it. Um, there's also the the relationships and networking, right? And I think that's, you know, one of the things that uh I believe that you guys are bringing at the university level that we're trying to bring even down in the high school level is just is is um networking, relationship building, you know, on the networking side. A lot of it for kids. You know, I always thought a lot of the magic of Stanford was you had all these luminaries come and then you'd meet them and you'd be like, "Oh, this is like a normal human, right?"
>> 是的。
Original English >> Yes.
>> 虽然他们确实很厉害，但也是普通人，这让你觉得“我也能做到”。
Original English >> I mean, they're obviously really impressive, but they're just like a normal human. And it makes it accessible to you to be able to say, "Well, I can do that, too."
>> 尤其是年轻、懵懂又超级自傲的时候，你会想：“我也可以做那个。”这确实是其中的一部分。我们在高中阶段也做着同样的事，让他们建立人脉。例如，我们一个14岁的孩子直接给黄仁勋（Jensen）打了陌生电话（cold call），黄仁勋不仅回了电话，意识到是个孩子后给了他90秒的时间做陈述，最后给了他非常好的反馈。总结起来就是：“你问我的这些背景核实问题，完全可以通过调研或询问我公司里的其他人搞清楚，你把跟我沟通的宝贵机会浪费在了这些问题上，如果提前做好案头准备效果会好得多；你的冲劲值得肯定，但在通话准备上只能拿不及格（F）。”这个通话成了那孩子人生中最深刻的一堂课，他在社交媒体上分享，全校都在讨论。成功的成年人乐于向下一代投入时间，这种人脉网络的建立极其宝贵，是传统大学所欠缺的。
Original English >> Especially when you're young and dumb and super arrogant. You're like, "Oh, I could do that." Right? And that is that is part of it. And, you know, we're doing the same thing here at the high school level where they're able to build up relationships. You know, actually, one of the stories is one of our 14-year-olds cold called Jensen, right? Literally. and you know he was having a cold call thing and he literally called him and you know and uh Jensen returned the call and uh you know realized it's a kid you know gave him 90 seconds right for his pitch and then the end gave him like really good feedback which basically if I had to summarize was you know all these qualification questions you're asking me you could have done research or asked other people in my organization about it and you just used your bullet with me and you should have done your prep work and it would have been much better, right? Instead of wasting it by calling me. So, you know, kudos for, you know, aggressiveness, but you get an F on call prep. Y okay, that call, okay, that kid, right? He's tweeting about it, right? Everybody in the school, it's like the best learning lesson in that kid's life. And you know, the the the you know, adults, right, successful adults are willing to invest in the next generation. And um I believe that kind of of networking and relationship building that they're going to get um uh at HA is just going to be awesome. Awesome. And more valuable than what normal universities, traditional universities don't do.
>> 是的，Eric 在这方面是真正的专家。你们帮助我们汇聚了来自各个领域的庞大人才网络来支持 HA 学生的成功。我觉得你们在 Founder School 所做的事情非常酷，我认识很多演讲嘉宾和导师都投入时间参与其中，对于高中或大学阶段的学生来说，获得这种资源完全是无价的。
Original English >> Yeah. It's something that you know Eric is is a true expert at if I may say so myself and uh you and have helped us galvanize this really large network of amazing people from all disciplines um to come and help the the uh HA students like succeed and I think it's really cool what you're doing with founder school as well because I actually know a bunch of people who are speakers or coming in and investing time at Founders School and it's just completely invaluable for a student who's in high school or college level to have the opportunity to get access to that.
>> 是的，对我而言这始终是最有价值的部分，而你们有意将其置于核心，这非常重要。麦克斯·列夫钦（Max Levchin）几周前坐在这张椅子上时谈到，他之所以敢于进行如此宏大的思考，是因为他曾与埃隆·马斯克、里德·霍夫曼（Reid Hoffman）、大卫·萨克斯（David Sacks）共事，亲眼看到他们经历了起起落落，发现他们也是普通人。希望未来邀请黄仁勋、萨姆·奥尔特曼（Sam Altman）、萨提亚（Satya Nadella）等业界传奇来和孩子们分享实战经历与起伏，也能激发他们的雄心壮志。
Original English >> Yeah. No, that is that back to for me that's always that's the most valuable thing and you guys are putting it intentionally at the center of what you guys do and I that's really important. Max Levkin was in this chair a few weeks ago and he was talking about how hey, you know, he was inspired to think so big and so ambitiously because he, you know, worked with Elon, he worked with Reed Hoffman, with David Saxs, and he saw that they, you know, sort of went through the ups and downs. They were just like him. Um, and yeah, hopefully us having, you know, Jensen and Sam Alman and, you know, Satia and all these legends come and share war stories with the kids, share share their ups and downs will uh also Yeah. elevate their ambitions as well.
>> 确实如此。正如泰勒·考恩（Tyler Cowen）所说：老师能做的最重要的一件事，就是提升学生对自己抱负的追求。我们每天都在 Alpha 践行这一点。我相信在你们的设计、引入的人才和营造的文化中，也会显著提升他们对自己人生可能性的雄心。这至关重要。
Original English >> It does. And that that point he also made which is your ambition is set you know when for kids somebody has to you know there's um I think it was Tyler Cowan who's like the number one thing a teacher can do is raise a student's ambition for themselves right we try to live that at alpha you know days and I believe that's very much when you sit here is that it's intentionally in your guys design of the people you're getting the culture you're building that you're going to be raising their ambition for what they can do in life And I think that's just so important.
>> 最后我想说，虽然我们探讨了 K-12 与大学之间的诸多重大差异，但一个共同点在于：正如你提到的1910年，在过去的一百年里该模式并没有太多的颠覆，在大学层面几乎没有重量级的新入局者。你们在 K-12 的实践以及我们共同所做的，正在提升教育可能性的上限。你们在过去几年乃至十多年里一直是这项事业的开拓者，我非常荣幸能参与到你们各自的旅程中。谢谢你们。
Original English >> Yeah. Well, lastly, I'll say from my end, you know, we've been talking about some major differences between sort of K through 12 and college, but one similarity is that, you know, you mentioned 1910 in in the last 100 years, there hasn't been a ton of disruption in the model. There hasn't been a ton of major new entrance certainly on the on the on the college side. And what you guys are doing uh in K through2 and and and college and we're all doing is elevating the ambition of what's possible in in education. and you you guys are are pioneers of the work that you've been doing uh the last few years and and and decade plus. So so I'm inspired to to be part of your respective journeys and yeah, thank you.
>> 孩子们太棒了，他们能做到的远超我们所有人的预期。我相信走出你们学校的学生，会把这份可能性提升到全新的层次。
Original English >> Well, kids are kids are awesome. They can do way more than all of us expect and I believe that coming out of yours, you're going to just raise that to the next level.
>> 很荣幸能与大家一起做这件事。
Original English >> Proud to do this with y'all.
>> 是的，谢谢。
Original English >> Yeah. Thank you, Tendon. Thank you.