Nicolai Tangian: Hi everyone, I'm Nicolola Tangian, the CEO of the Norwegian Sovereign Wealth Fund and today, hey, I'm in really good company with Fabricio, the CEO of Process. Now, you may not know what process is, but they basically have incredible companies. I food, which is the equivalent of Door Dash in Brazil, Just Eat, which feeds millions and millions of people across Europe, Swiggy in India, and PayU, one of the biggest fintech platforms in emerging markets. So all in all they reach like a billion and a half people across the world and he's pretty pleased about it himself. I can see he's smiling here on the screen. So Paris we we look forward to hearing all about it. But before we talk about you, what is process?

Fabricio Bloisi: Hello Nikolai. Pleasure to be here in good company. Proess is a tech company and uh we offer amazing products for one and a half billion customers on delivery, food delivery, on top of that payment, on top of that lifestyle services like events and travel and uh and we are just getting started. We do all of that in three big regions, Latin America, India and Europe. And we are reinventing everything we are doing. We are in a moment of amazing change through AI. My whole story is about reinventing everything. So I'm very excited to build the next chapters of pros.

Nicolai Tangen: What do these companies have in common?

Fabricio Bloisi: I think our focus is to build an ecosystem and this ecosystem means we have to not we are not investors just to start. What we build are operational tech company that are very good in execution technology services. So when we build an ecosystem, we make sure that one company help each other through culture management model crossell innovation AI and I'm I'm investing the same kind I'm building the same kind of ecosystem in Latin America, India and Europe. So if you look to Latin America, I already had it working in Latin America. In Latin America, people talk about food, but it's 10 times bigger than I. have beverage and pet shops and payments and meal voucher and grocery and travel. The same the same ecosystem that is very sophisticated that I have in Latin America I'm building today in India where I have very similar companies and the same ecosystem I'm going to build in Europe start with just it and Alex but I'm going to expand that to the same kind of ecosystem.

Nicolai Tangen: What uh what region are you the most excited about just now?

Fabricio Bloisi: The more mature for sure is Latin America. As I told you, people talk about Thai food, but what we have in Latin America is very similar to the ecosystem that existed in China. In China, we have 10 cents, but also Alibaba, Bite Dance. And we really can crossell lots of our services. For example, we bought a travel company deparing twice as fast today because we acquired it. So it's not only does travel but we also have as I told you grocery and payment and lots of business there. So Latin America is very advanced and my objectives to replicate the same thing I did in Latin America in India and Europe. But an interesting thing I'm very excited about India because India is a really big market with a lot of potential. We invested in China. Oh we didn't talk about that but we own 25% of 10. We invested in China 25 years ago and it was more or less like India today. But I can see many of the potential to grow in India in terms of market size and grit and focus in creating big tech companies. So it's very exciting to be in India right now and I think the next 10 years is very exciting and I'm a big I'm a Brazilian but I'm a big believer in Europe. I think Europe deserves and has the opportunity to have big tech in Europe. It's our challenge to make it happen.

Nicolai Tangen: But Fabio before we go into the businesses in a bit more detail, we have we start we have to start with your your life story, right? So you are 21 years old, you live in Brazil, you're straight out of school. What do you do?

Fabricio Bloisi: I was finishing school and I said I love the Bill Gates story and Microsoft story. I want to build a hundred billion dollar global company and I started startup with two people in a small room and we started what was Maui and became food over the next 15 years 20 years actually.

Nicolai Tangen: What was the first thing you did? So you had two people sitting in a room and it's just like hey let's do hundred billion dollars. What's the first thing you do? What what was the first company?

Fabricio Bloisi: I think we did uh mobile content uh so like rington and messaging etc like in 2000 many many years ago but the first thing I did was failing I really failed a lot the company didn't succeed for the first one two three four five seven years and I learned not only about failing but I learned about the importance about culture and moving faster and innovating and managing people to have an amazing result and even we were like a 20 30 40 people company where we were always dreaming big to create a global leader and that very small company learned about management model and culture innovation and we grow to become a 10,000 people company

Nicolai Tangen: but how if you if you fail for five years a lot of people give up right why did you give up

Fabricio Bloisi: I think I think that's that's what we that's what I learned first I choose something that I love I love my job since day one I love the opportunity to learn to meet good people to do better to become better and uh and I also learned that failing is part of the process to learn so although we failed a lot the company become better year after year for many years we didn't raise a lot of money in this beginning we were like a very poor small company but we became very good in having the best people and innovating very fast

Nicolai Tangen: but tell me uh uh 1998 uh you start from scratch and then 2024 you are CEO of 20 40,000 people just what's in between there what did you do in between

Fabricio Bloisi: failing learning finding very good partners amazing people that are better than me so my job is to find people better than me tell them a a a vision about what we can do better and how we can challenge how the world is today and those people together with me they keep improving and improving our company innovated a lot. I food is one of the best operators in the world in food delivery. We started very small. It was a $5 million investment in food I made like 2013. It became a 10,000 people company that has the best products in the world. And it's not because I'm smart, not because I have an idea. I don't I don't believe in being smart. I have an idea. I believe in working a lot with very good people, being open to learn a little every day. And the result was even in Brazil not like a core country of the world we have one of the best operations in the world.

Nicolai Tangen: Okay. So how do you so how do you do that? How do you how do you go from a dream to actually achieving this? What are the what are the important steps if you want to build a business like that?

Fabricio Bloisi: The important steps people think big is very important. Believe you can do it and really think big. Having the best people and I invest a lot in people, not people that I can hire, people that can execute and deliver and dream and do better every week.

Nicolai Tangen: How do you find these people?

Fabricio Bloisi: I find people that is that deals well with uncertainty and with big challenges. I hire people that's that that can that I tell them look my goal is unbelievable big and most people get uncomfortable about that and I say you are going to be in charge of that. Many people they don't they don't feel empowered enough to build amazing things. So I I I hire entrepreneurs. That's the question, the point. My first value is entrepreneurship. I hire people that want to to have big impact and then I empower them a lot. Let me tell you one thing. I also fire people. So many times doesn't work. And I know in Europe people doesn't like to talk about that. People in Europe say, "Oh my god, doesn't find anyone ever." I don't know. I have to find the best the right people to the right place. And sometimes they're not the right people and they leave the company. And it's it's good for the company. It's good for them. I need to have people that say I'm going to be empowered to have an amazing impact and that's my job. Put the people there and they do amazing things and innovate everyate.

Nicolai Tangen: What's the key to innovation?

Fabricio Bloisi: Innovation to me is look we have a successful business. We have 10 to 15 billion dollars in revenue and every day and we have profitable now like a one to one and a half billion dollars in profitability. But every day I started the company saying it's not good enough. We are not the best in the world and if we even if we are we have to do better. So the level of pressure in the company to disrupt everything and do better is daily every day we have to do it better. So you have to have people with the open mind to think I'm going to find a new way. I'm going to find a hack to do things better. Uh we are in a technology business and we are in a AI moment. I see the people in the financial world talking about AI and doing spreadsheets. I hire people that understand the how AI transform everything and this is so amazing.

Nicolai Tangen: Tell me about tell me about the tell me about the jet skiis.

Fabricio Bloisi: Jet skis means empower a small team with five 10 people to experiment as if they were the owner of that business. So they have to experiment, take risks, try 10, 20, 30 things, fail a lot until they find a way that has amazing impact. So all the innovations I told you started as yet please. a small group trying very fast until we have the best operations of our category or of the world. And why is important to tell this story? Because that's not how big companies work. Big companies usually they say let's make a a budget. The budget is a billion dollars to the CEO like this this project. Then we have one year to deliver a big big thing and then one year after you lost a billion dollars and you lost one year. So what we have to find first without money without team without one year uh timeline is to find how we make this really work that is was a jet ski a small company a a startup inside a big company with the right people to innovate and deliver I don't know there's an expression I love I love that that's called ambidextrous organizations I think we heard that in I think Harvard talks a lot about that that means a corporate is very good in operate with scale. So it's very good in discipline, in budgeting, in financing, planning, but being aidextrous mean the company is very good also in disruptive innovation just like a startup. I think what I do as a manager and that's I think what people should could learn from pro today and model it should be always ambidextrous. I operate startups as a real startups crazy fast with entrepreneurs. At the same time, I can have the discipline to make a plan and execute that over one year after I find a way to succeed on a jet ski.

Nicolai Tangen: But I'm sorry but just before before we get to that you had to sell your stake in delivery hero right whilst at the same time competition could make acquisitions. just how do you look at the you know the European regulatory environment?

Fabricio Bloisi: I am a optimistic CEO founder but it's frustrating to operate in Europe because at the same time I have everyone in Europe saying I need big tech. I need innovation. I need AI. I said I'm ready to invest $10 billion to build that in Europe. And then the regulator said no you have to divest. And I even told the regulators, I'm going to divest and sell to an American or a Chinese company. They said, we don't care. So Europe. So a funny thing, I see the the the American companies having the government trying to say, I need big tech here. Let's make my big tech global leaders. I see the same thing in India, the same thing in China. In Europe, I have to fight Europe. I have to spend a lot of energy say Europe. It is good. It's necessary to have big tech here. And what's happening right now in Europe is that Europe is succeeding in avoiding big tech in Europe and succeeding in making the Americans and the the the Asian big tech to win in Europe because the European companies can't win in Europe. So they I I have I I had I have an obligation to sell my participation delivery hero. I absolutely disagree with this direction. Uh I interesting thing uh two weeks ago Europe said we are going to change our guidelines on the M&A and then we we said okay so like why we are selling we are an European company have two European players why we are selling one of them and they said we are changing next year you have to sell this year so I think Europe didn't understand that AI things happen every month.

Nicolai Tangen: let's talk about AI do you think AI AI is underhyped.

Fabricio Bloisi: I think AI is underhyped. This is a crazy phrase to say and the reason is I do that operationally. I am a CE of a big company but I understand the details about what's happening. Many people last year was talking uh maybe there's overhype and next year things are going to cool down. It's the opposite. What's happened the last three months? It's much more than everyone expected for this year. In robotics, obviously robotics is moving at crazy speed, but what's happened with open claw or with cloud code in the last 60 days is substantially more than what happened before and it's going to change completely how companies work.

Nicolai Tangen: How is your group going to work going forward with by implementing the you know everything you can do in AI?

Fabricio Bloisi: We will have every time more autonomous organizations where AI do much more than making the job of one person 20 times faster. What AI is going to do is to make the whole company 100 200% more efficient. Until now people are trying to make their job faster. I have to do a document. I say AI help me with this document. what is possible today is much more than that and it was not possible in December. So that's the thing that many people didn't understand from December to May now it's possible to teach an AI to to to teach the intelligence of the company to an AI. So the company can really operate for not for 10 minutes by itself but can operate for one to three days by itself. Internally we have 20,000 people creating agents that makes their substantially more productive. The last month I gave a a course to all our executives starting with the CEO so they can program by themselves. You can think are you crazy? We're talking about CEOs of five 10 billion dollar company making software. Yes. Because when they learn what they can do in four hours work they they understand that all their goals can be substantially bigger. They can deliver software substantially faster. They can automate things substantially faster. I myself I did a soft that we call auto research software that enable parts of the company to auto to work by themselves and me myself and the cos are doing that not because I'm going to run the the soft we do but because after we do that I can I can started to operate in weekly cycles and not in monthly or bimonthly cycles. I think that's going to all the comps are going to change completely because of what's possible to do today. Many people ask ah when AGI arrives that's not the right question. AGI will arrive in one two three four years. The point is that with the technology we have today for example open claw and how you can ask an assistant that has memory to build a whole system for you and you're not even a programmer. So because of this kind of technology the companies are going to be different and the compan that are fast enough to do it first they are going to have a disproportional benefits over the next I'm not three years I'm talking this year

Nicolai Tangen: Promise how would you characterize the corporate culture in the company?

Fabricio Bloisi: First thing I do is to kill the corporate world. Culture means empowering people to move faster to be innovative. We call our culture process way. Entrepreneurs that feel that they are in charge to to to have results. Innovation innovation is core to everything. We have to question what we are doing all the time. Obsession about results. We need results. I don't need smart people giving nice excels. I need results and impact. I really believe big companies should have impact and have a positive contribution to the region they are. So we talk about culture all the time. I think my job is to set the culture and the vision and some people love this culture and they work two three times more. some people doesn't fit and we have to politely suggest then keep looking to the a company where they c they fit the culture. To me the most important thing pro had a good year. We had good results. We grow we are more profitable. Uh the financial people like to talk about results and numbers. To me I like to talk about culture because every result we have is because the company is more focused about giving more power to the right people, moving faster, delivering results and being more innovative.

Nicolai Tangen: Do you have the same culture in uh in all areas like in Latin America, India and Europe?

Fabricio Bloisi: Yes. We start with a very clear set of goals and we summarize all of that like in one page. We call our strategic map and we reinforce that with all 4,000 people every month. Also, we put people together. everyone usually is less like 5,000 people when like the more 5,000 and then they replicate it to the other 40,000 but quite often we do big events we call strategy share usually it's four five hours event where I show direction I show what we are doing I show what's doing well and I show what's doing bad I'm very directed to say to face the brutal facts this is doing very bad and we have to fix it this month so the company has a lot of transparency that is unusual to a a big company and that's what create entrepreneurial culture. It's not talking about that or putting that in the walls. It's is be believing in people enough to share what is good, what is bad, what were my mistakes and who will deliver and saying look you if you deliver more you also are going to benefit from all of that. Last week as a curiosity we did the last strategy share it was around five six thousand people all around the world and we only talk the big thing was disruption not only results but disruption so now I have the whole company thinking about okay open claw was a big disruption how process is going to be as disrupted as open claw and we are launching token claw our version of open claw and now have 40,000 people focusing on that

Nicolai Tangen: Where could the process be in 10 years time?

Fabricio Bloisi: My goal for the short term is to have hundred billion dollars more. In 10 years time we will be a half trillion dollar company or bigger and a a clear global leader. Today people talk about global leaders in Silicon Valley in China. Uh 10 years to me we have to to see clearly pro as a company that's create the future of the world through technology with innovation done in Latin America and India and Europe and uh and I think this will be a big contribution to those regions

Nicolai Tangen: and global leader in what kind of industries?

Fabricio Bloisi: agentic lifestyles ecosystems. So agents that can deliver much more than it's not pure e-commerce deliver as I told you travel deliver payments deliver other services for the user and uh and this is a very big market and this is a very big market because people usually think then as individual companies if you can integrate then as a as people do in China it's a there is a space to be a real global leader

Nicolai Tangen: What is your advice to young people who listen to you?

Fabricio Bloisi: Dream big. Uh it's possible to change everything. Young people usually look to the world and think that's how the world is. It's a lie that it's how it is today. Everything is going to to change. so much in the next one, two, three, four years and the young people that can learn and build the future can do much more than they think. So study a lot, be some do something that you are passionate about because the opportunities are much better ahead than before us than behind us.

Nicolai Tangen: Well, this has been tremendous. It's uh I'm not sure I've met anybody who's been dreaming bigger than you. So, it's been a real pleasure. Great fun run, you know. Good luck and uh go get them.