Katie Aselton: Like we read Judy Blooms forever when we were that right age and stuck with us.

Mark Duplass: We read and took in art to make us feel things. It wasn't like the oh the story was it was like

Katie Aselton: take me for that ride break my heart I want to feel the feelings I want to go deep I want to connect on a level that is like I can't do with my peers because they don't get it

Anna Martin: and this was what brought you to well just tell me the story how did you

Mark Duplass: part of what brought us together um I was living in New York I was having a a very hard time in my life you know it it was a time where I was a struggling artist I was doubting my ability to be successful. And I went to visit my friend who was living out in Los Angeles cuz I was just like, it's New Year's. I don't have any friends back at home in New Orleans where I'm staying with my parents. I'm just lost and I just need to go like go get around someone who has some friends and and not

Katie Aselton: sun.

Mark Duplass: Yeah. And just get in the get in the goddamn sun. And then the next thing I know, uh, he picks me up at the airport and the car door opens and there's Katie and I'm I'm going to like start crying right now because it was like it was like this burst of sun and it was like this is my home and I saw it in her face which was with love a slightly like bloated with alcohol young 20s version of Katie. You know, you're saying blood with alcohol. There are tears in your eyes. It's not gender. She's blooded with alcohol. Little puppy,

Katie Aselton: but she was retaining water.

Mark Duplass: But I was just like, this is I I can't explain it to you that I just got hit by a bolt of lightning. Um,

Anna Martin: it was immediate for you. Wow. I can feel it from you and it's so vivid. It's making you emotional.

Mark Duplass: Pherommones just pure just like animals, you know?

Katie Aselton: Um,

Mark Duplass: and my flip side was

Katie Aselton: Katie's like, "This guy has a soul patch. what the do I do?

Mark Duplass: And that was a wild thing to have to come to grips with.

Katie Aselton: Um,

Mark Duplass: you gota you gotta invest early, you know? I was a puppy face soul patch. You guys are balancing each other out. Wait, I do want to like split screen it like it is a movie cuz it sounds like that to me. So,

Katie Aselton: I got in the car and he was sitting in the front seat and he turned around and I was like, "Fuck, I'm in trouble." All of a sudden, we just locked like and we started talking over the course of that afternoon in a way that like I had never talked to anyone.

Anna Martin: What are you talking about? Can you recall?

Katie Aselton: We talked about people we dated. We talked about

Mark Duplass: a lot of relationship, family stuff and we just were able to like spill to each other and be really honest and vulnerable. And I was like, I've never had this conversation. there was this energy of us kind of like leaning into something with each other that we couldn't quite define. Yeah. You know, but it's all surrounded by like the energy of New Year. So, it's like, well, what's this going to be, you know? And then we ended up at a bar later that night. Um,

Katie Aselton: and I think the defining element of the beginning of our relationship for me was,

Mark Duplass: you know, we had our first kiss that night, but it wasn't at midnight. It was at like 11:30.

Anna Martin: Well, I'm needing you guys to describe this kiss if possible.

Mark Duplass: I'm sitting at the bar at Daddy's right near the Jukebox. Daddy's is a bar in Hollywood that's no longer there. Good for everybody, honestly.

Katie Aselton: Name the best bar. Oh,

Mark Duplass: Jukebox is on and there's David Bowie going and Katie's coming out of the bathroom down a long hallway and I catch eyes with her and she catches eyes with me and it's busy. It's a busy bar. Time stops for like a little bit and she takes a nice initiative and walks slowly up to me and I'm like, "Okay, she's

Katie Aselton: I didn't like walk slowly, you guys. I think in his mind it was like in slow motion, but it's not like I filmakers like I slowly walked to him like seductively or anything. I walked toward him."

Mark Duplass: It was a saunter and you know it.

Katie Aselton: Listen, I got to sway.

Mark Duplass: Yeah. And she came up to me and I was like, "Okay, she made this move. So like I have to like do some sort of expression." You

Anna Martin: nervous? very nervous, but also like

Katie Aselton: I know I I can't just expl I was like I know we this is kind of what we're supposed to be doing right now.

Mark Duplass: Um

Katie Aselton: and and she looks at me and she says

Mark Duplass: you're cute. And I was like, even with the sideburns, he said, I blocked with two fingers. I blocked the soul part.

Katie Aselton: Did I actually do that?

Mark Duplass: I closed when I No,

Katie Aselton: no. No, that would have been cool.

Mark Duplass: I just did one of these and I was like, there it is.

Anna Martin: For those listening, she's covering this whole back. Yeah. Uhhuh.

Katie Aselton: And I put my hand just like ever so lightly on your hip and we lean in. We have this pretty long but not like you know not to get too graphic but it wasn't like sloppy make out you know it was like

Mark Duplass: it was

Katie Aselton: it was like it was like a it was a movie kiss.

Anna Martin: Yeah.

Mark Duplass: Yeah. But to dig just a little deeper into it, you know, from there it wasn't like we're describing a lot of romanticism right now, you know.

Katie Aselton: Then from there it was

Mark Duplass: the first year was so hard. a lot really of fear and fighting and I love you so much. This is so exciting. Oh god, I'm not.

Anna Martin: Tell me about this because I think that what you are painting

Mark Duplass: is basically the ideal everyone dreams of going to this city and having a beautiful person step out of a door and into your life and have this mutual recognition that like, oh, it's on, you know, like it's on.

Katie Aselton: The music swells and the montage starts.

Anna Martin: I mean, this is it's a dream. It's a dream, but I'm liking to be brought back down to earth a little bit. Tell me about that.

Mark Duplass: 100%.

Anna Martin: What happened?

Mark Duplass: Well, we're dating long distance. That's difficult.

Katie Aselton: That's difficult. We're young. We're ambitious. We have really big ideas of what we want and who we want to be and where does this other person sit in that and exist in that? And do they believe in me in the same way? And how do you compromise all of these young hopes and dreams? And we're babies

Mark Duplass: and and I would say pretty emotionally unevolved at this point in terms of like haven't gone to therapy. I haven't diagnosed the fact that I have depression and need to treat this. No, none of this has happened yet, you know. So, so we're trying to work this out with our arms and our legs tied behind our backs. Um,

Katie Aselton: and yet still more communicative than like any relationship I had been in before. still better, but we're still operating at a C++ essentially. I think a lot of the fighting early on was I think on me because um

Mark Duplass: I'm so deeply smitten with Katie. I see my future there. I'm terrified that um I'm not going to be able to be a healthy, successful human being. So, how can I possibly be in a relationship with the the probably the right person for me at a time when I'm just not there?

Katie Aselton: And that created an energy that was

Mark Duplass: so maddening. I mean, I'm I'm projecting, but we've talked about this. So maddening for Katie that was just like on Tuesday, I'm your everything. And then on Wednesday morning, you wake up and like you're terrified of this and you tell me, "Oh, I need to go on tour with my band because I need to figure this thing out or I need to, you know, write the next great American independent film."

Katie Aselton: And and so that was um confusing.

Anna Martin: Tell me how that was. I mean, it was going through your mind.

Katie Aselton: Great. I come from like a really traditional family. I'm the youngest of four.

Anna Martin: My sisters got married when they were 21 and 24.

Katie Aselton: Wow. And I was like 23 with this guy who like maybe loved me more than anything in the whole world, but maybe also wasn't ready for this and didn't want it daytoday. And so I was like, what am I doing? I'm wasting my youth. And like and I will also say like I think that if you look at the trajectory of our relationship

Mark Duplass: the codependency was there almost from the beginning in like a very that was early times

Katie Aselton: if you ask anyone around us a very unhealthy dynamic like I was going to ask about what friends

Mark Duplass: we were like addicted to each other in a way of like part of it it was because we were long distance but when we were together it was like we had to like physically be touching all the time and talking and kissing and like

Anna Martin: wait really I have friends like that and it's pretty annoying.

Katie Aselton: It was but it was like we were

Mark Duplass: we were insufferable. Let's be honest.

Katie Aselton: It was awful but we didn't feel it or know it or see it at the time.

Anna Martin: Did you want to tell her about the airport?

Katie Aselton: Oh my god. I would love to know about the airport.

Mark Duplass: We were catching a flight somewhere together and we weren't separating. It's not like we were saying goodbye. We were like just had some downtime and we're full-blown making out in one of the seats. Like

Katie Aselton: I didn't even register that we were making out. I thought we were just like hanging out.

Mark Duplass: We were like at a gate like deep.

Anna Martin: I want to be super clear. You were on the same flight.

Katie Aselton: We were going We were traveling together.

Mark Duplass: We're at the gate waiting to get on the flight.

Katie Aselton: Totally where your seats are essentially next to each other.

Mark Duplass: Next to each other.

Katie Aselton: This is not in fear of separation. So I just want to be clear. I just could not like I wanted to inhale him at all times

Mark Duplass: and so I did. It's gross. Uh but someone walked a security guy walked up to us and he goes, "Would you kids like to find a more private area?"

Katie Aselton: That was a that was a real moment for us.

Anna Martin: And what did you say?

Katie Aselton: Oh my god.

Anna Martin: And then you guys go to a bathroom and just we just had sex.

Mark Duplass: That was the first moment we realized that this could be a problem.

Anna Martin: Stay with us. Is there a specific story that sticks out to you about a conflict that you had? Um, probably when you were living apart

Katie Aselton: one time at a concert,

Mark Duplass: he was at a like an indie rock show and I was back in LA. He was at a show here in Brooklyn and he called me and he was so excited because Borc was there

Katie Aselton: and like two people in front of him in line and I got pissed.

Mark Duplass: I was so jealous like in a rage in a rage. I was like, "What are you do?" Like I was like, "What are you going to talk? Are you going to talk to her? Oh, you're going to talk to Oh, you should go. You know what? You should totally go do it. Go talk to her. You should." And he was like, "Why are you crazy?"

Katie Aselton: because in my mind he was everything and I was like obviously she's going to fall in love with him if she meets him of course. Like he's the easiest person to fall in love with and if that is okay that is so sweet because I thought it's like it wasn't even that you were jealous of her. It was more so like I love you so much. You're so magnetic. If she even gets in your presence,

Mark Duplass: if she has the opportunity to meet you, she's going to fall in love with you. And she's Bork. Like, you're going to fall in love with her, too. I can't sing like that. My hair isn't cool. Like, I knew I wasn't her. And I was like, "Oh, this is terrible. If you meet her, but you know what? You should just, you know, fine. Fine. I'm not mad. I'm not mad. Go meet her. Good. I hope you guys are having so much fun."

Anna Martin: Tell me how you go from this kind of whiplashy volatile connection. I mean, now we we started this conversation off by saying you're incredibly codependent, which we will circle back to. How did you decide? Was there a breaking point? Was there like a

Mark Duplass: I think that this is my like

Katie Aselton: maybe a breaking down.

Mark Duplass: This is my dime store analysis of it is that in this sort of like swirling whirling soup of like we love each other so much we can't stop fighting. Holy what is this? There was a forced level of honesty that was beyond what we were emotionally prepared to share and receive. And so we grew up together, creating a new language that we didn't know how to use. We didn't see our parents use. And then we would get in fights, but then we kept showing back up the next morning. And so we were revealing these awful things and awful sides about each other. And then we kept saying, "I love you the next day, but I'm still here." and and we started to build this bedrock of I think subconsciously. Oh my god, this person is still here and they know all of this really ugly, scary about me. And that to me is the seeds of what I think led to this beautiful or terrible, whatever you want to call it, codependency that we have now, which is this very firm belief that like no one will ever be able to know me or understand me and love me the way that Katie does.

Mark Duplass: Um, that's me sort of jumping far ahead into these seats now for a moment. Um, but it was a very long road. this ability to be so open that was really present from the beginning of your relationship. Now, how long have you been married?

Katie Aselton: It'll be 20 years in August.

Anna Martin: Oh my gosh. Congratulations.

Mark Duplass: We've been together for almost 25.

Anna Martin: Wow.

Katie Aselton: Yeah.

Anna Martin: How does that show up now? What are the ways that those patterns you established in the beginning are still a part of your everyday? If they are, maybe they look a little different.

Katie Aselton: Yeah. I mean, it's it's a really good question. I mean,

Mark Duplass: I don't think the patterns look different. The patterns look like Well, I just mean as far as the communication goes, like It is really wonderful to have a partner that you can be completely open and vulnerable and be like, "Hey, this is really hard for me to say out loud, but like I'm having a really hard time with X, Y, and Z." And

Katie Aselton: um and I feel like it's me, but I I worry that you think it's you, and so like let's talk about that. Like

Mark Duplass: those are things

Katie Aselton: that like feel like accomplishments on our side, but it is because of the the patterns that we establish very early on of like I know I'm not going to scare you away and I know you're I can say something without your ego coming in or if it does come in I know you will work on it and come back to I think that's a good point because I think like I don't want us to come come across sounding like we don't still um like fight basically

Mark Duplass: and we step in all the time.

Katie Aselton: We do because new things are constantly coming up and particularly we have an you know two kids 18 and 14 um two daughters um

Anna Martin: and you work together

Katie Aselton: and we work together and we sleep next to each other

Mark Duplass: rescuing dogs

Katie Aselton: and Katie keeps rescuing these dogs. develop this habit of rescuing dogs.

Mark Duplass: It's a real issue in our marriage.

Katie Aselton: That is maybe our biggest conflict right now.

Anna Martin: You're not the first couple I've talked to where dogs.

Katie Aselton: Yeah.

Mark Duplass: We spend a lot of time together. I

Anna Martin: say, are you constantly in touch? Yeah. Yeah.

Katie Aselton: Yeah. We spend a lot of time together. We're very um

Mark Duplass: Sounds gross to say, but we're very like intimate. There's like a lot of there's a lot of like hugs. just sucking off.

Katie Aselton: When I see a couple that's at the airport gate absolutely lit down there. We burn that out in our 20s. The truth is we're not so tired.

Anna Martin: That's so funny. That's

Mark Duplass: We're not doing that at all cuz our our bedroom is right off of the kitchen and the kids are just everywhere.

Katie Aselton: They're walking in all the time. But the intimacy is like how does it show up then if it's

Mark Duplass: we are still very affectionate and very loving and like we do love to share meals together in the middle of the day or like

Katie Aselton: and it's like dumb We play music in the kitchen and we dance and we and we kiss a lot and we hold hands a lot when we walk. And

Anna Martin: do your kids comment on that? Ye

Katie Aselton: yes they do. They're they're sort of comfortable with it because they have like grown up with it. But then when they got out into the world and saw that other parents aren't like that, they were like, "Oh,

Mark Duplass: yep."

Katie Aselton: Uh,

Mark Duplass: yeah. For a long time, I think they thought everyone else was weird and now I think they think we're weird.

Katie Aselton: So that's where we're at.

Anna Martin: Can I know like what do you feel like you need the other person to do? Like what's something that you feel like you couldn't do on your own?

Mark Duplass: That's really interesting. I mean, the first thing that comes to my mind when you say that is that um I really believe this. I I don't know that I would have made it if I had not met Katie. Um I think that the nature of what I was dealing with and the depths of my depression um and what she brought to me in terms of the ability to bring out this goofiness that I had inside of me.

Anna Martin: You guys are so goofy. I can't believe there was ever a time where you were not being cool.

Katie Aselton: He was so cool when I met him. You know, he was wearing like he was like Greenpoint in 03. You know what I'm saying?

Anna Martin: I was in third grade, but I can imagine.

Mark Duplass: But you remember those ding-dongs walking around with their skinny dickies?

Anna Martin: In fact, I am worried that this whole conversation is going to give women who are dating sort of deadly boyfriends and bands all the false hope. So, I'll just say that. But they're not all

Mark Duplass: I made it up. Not ladies, not all men. You know what I'm saying? Not all men.

Katie Aselton: You joke about being cool, but I was depressed. I mean, that's just really what we're dealing with. So, that to me, that is like the biggest intense need I have for Katie and my and this feeling that I have to put a finer point on this codependency, which is like

Mark Duplass: here's some negative things about it. Okay.

Anna Martin: Yeah. Good. That was my next thing.

Mark Duplass: I go to New York for a few days and I have rescue dogs and I have kids and I have a company and I have a lot of people that rely on me. and I should just be in full glee and elation to be free and do whatever I want, make whatever decision I want for food at my whim. And after 36 hours of that, an ache starts to form. And it's really hard to be away from Katie. And I can't exactly tell you why, but I think that these 25 years, all this stuff we have built, how I relate to her, and it just it doesn't work the way I would like it to be able to. And so I I'm not there. You you it doesn't work. Life doesn't work.

Katie Aselton: Life doesn't work. So I am not an idiot. I I know that I can't have the beautiful codependent thing that I have with Katie and just be able to easily eject out of that and function perfectly on the other side. I want it. I I choose it,

Mark Duplass: but it's not free.

Anna Martin: We'll be right back. Can I turn it to you and say how do you feel like you need Mark? And is there because that's what I want to transition to too is like we're painting a it's not all rosy but a really beautiful picture but there are ways in which you can lose yourself.

Katie Aselton: Sure. I think honestly I'm like the complete opposite of him where he he saw in me a depth and uh intelligence that um no one else really saw. I'm the youngest of four. I was a cheerleader. I was Miss Mainten. I was

Mark Duplass: Miss Mainten Hold on. Runner up Miss Teen USA

Katie Aselton: Oh my god.

Mark Duplass: So I was like

Katie Aselton: with no training and no nothing. She was this girl from a town of 300 people, a lobster town in Maine, and they're like, "We need somebody." And they threw her in. Didn't know what the she was doing.

Mark Duplass: There. Thank god. USA doesn't do a talent. That's Miss America.

Katie Aselton: Oh, sorry. Okay. Uh, my talent. I won the swimsuit competition. That was my talent.

Mark Duplass: And I was cute.

Katie Aselton: Yeah.

Mark Duplass: And everyone was like, "Oh, she's so cute." And

Katie Aselton: that was kind of my identity until I met Mark and he looked at me and he was like, "No, you're so much more. You're so smart. You're really talented." and you have depth and you know you're interesting and it changed me and no one saw me like that and I didn't see myself like that and you know he was the one who first looked at me and was like you know I said after we had our first kid I was like I miss uh being in movies like will you please like write something for me and he was like write something for yourself do it you have the stories um I did write a movie about a woman who cheats about her husband. If you're going to make me if you're going to make I didn't sort of mean that

Mark Duplass: if you're going to make if you're going to make me do the work, I'm going to do the work, you know. Um but it was that that really, you know, I've never no one believed in me like he he believed in me and still to this day believes in me. Like no one believes in me more than Mark does.

Katie Aselton: And I don't believe in myself as much as Mark does. That is like a scare the scary side of codependency for me where I'm like I guess I should probably get to that point.

Mark Duplass: Um yeah.

Katie Aselton: Yeah. I think a therapist would be like you walk into a general therapist room they'd be like

Mark Duplass: love this is my therapist voice by the way. You know love is such this wonderful thing where you can join forces with someone and know that you can stand on the precipice of life together and enjoy it but also if you have to stand alone that's okay too. Yeah.

Katie Aselton: And that last part is what I'm missing. Well, I I was going to this is what I was going to say is like I'm really grateful for you two for being so open. It's very instructive. I feel like I'm learning a lot.

Anna Martin: And we're also talking about this thing and you're hinting at it where it's like to become so inshed with another person, you can lose it's like you're both seeing these things in each other that no one else sees which is electric and beautiful and connective.

Mark Duplass: But then there is a way in which you lose your sense of individuation. I mean you cease to sort of become an individual. And I guess what are the ways that you try to or you do maintain your sense of self as individuals or is that still something you're struggling with?

Katie Aselton: I have a pretty good um little system I think you know which is that um I love hiking and I love backpacking and I mostly do that alone. I'm going to go out and join the herd on the PCT for a couple of days.

Mark Duplass: That being said, he's invited me and that I don't want to go.

Katie Aselton: And that is why he doesn't be thirsty. An excellent that is an excellent point.

Mark Duplass: I definitely wanted it to be something we did to

Katie Aselton: that is completely sweet. You're like I'm striking out on my own. Manifest destiny. You're like

Mark Duplass: I don't need anybody out here backpack and everything.

Katie Aselton: Hey, you want to come? No. Okay, I'll go.

Anna Martin: That is so cute and completely undermining your point,

Katie Aselton: but proving you tried. Yeah.

Mark Duplass: But proving it also has realized he can do it by himself

Katie Aselton: and that is gross.

Anna Martin: What's a specific thing that you do?

Katie Aselton: Um, okay. So, what I realized I love is going to dinner and a show by myself.

Mark Duplass: I love sitting at a bar. I love ordering a cocktail.

Katie Aselton: Oh, you bring that book, too.

Mark Duplass: I bring a book.

Katie Aselton: You bring that book.

Mark Duplass: And I like all of a sudden I'm like Carrie Bradshaw just eating by yourself. And it is and I love going to a show by myself.

Katie Aselton: Can I also just ever so slightly undermine which is which is that

Mark Duplass: you're like there but you're quiet. You're like a different table,

Katie Aselton: which is, you know, for better or for worse, you always text me or call me during these moments to share it with me.

Mark Duplass: Well, yeah, cuz I look cute.

Katie Aselton: Yeah,

Mark Duplass: I don't want to waste it.

Anna Martin: That is so Oh, god. I love that there still is this thread of And I don't know, maybe we're using the word codependency to your point. Maybe it's not

Katie Aselton: Maybe we don't understand.

Anna Martin: Is there Maybe Finish your sentence.

Katie Aselton: Maybe we don't understand. Like maybe I don't know. Are we going to make up a word right now for what we are

Anna Martin: like in the rebranding? Is there a new word?

Mark Duplass: I'm going to call it englobulation because

Katie Aselton: it is confusing where I begin and and where Katie ends uh to a certain point. Um but the good news is with englobulation it's just a big thing of goo. So you can

Mark Duplass: It sounds so gross.

Katie Aselton: Well, hold on a second. Let me finish. Okay.

Mark Duplass: It's going to be great. Then you pull it apart like slime, you know, and you're like, "Oh, great. So now there's two and we're individual. But the problem is there's a bunch of pink and the blue and there's a bunch of blue and the pink and you can't really separate them. It's mostly me over there, but I got a bunch of the other stuff.

Katie Aselton: Mozzarella and a pizza

Anna Martin: in globulation. How are you feeling about that word?

Katie Aselton: I think it's gross.

Mark Duplass: Okay. I I I would agree with you. If we're talking about branding, it's a little

Katie Aselton: I don't know what the word is, but I I've always said this thing, and it's just the way I see couples,

Mark Duplass: and I think couples are like trees that grow in a forest, right? And sometimes trees go completely parallel and they're super healthy, and it's amazing. Sometimes trees grow together and they wind around each other and they help bring each other to the sun or one strangles the other one, right? And then sometimes two trees grow in two separate directions and fall over.

Katie Aselton: Like I that is how I look at it. And I think

Mark Duplass: who are we?

Katie Aselton: Oh, we think we're I'm growing to the sun. I think we've wound around each other and we bring each other.

Anna Martin: Is there any strangulation?

Katie Aselton: No,

Mark Duplass: I don't feel like you.

Katie Aselton: I think I probably strangled you in the beginning.

Mark Duplass: Yeah, you strangled

Katie Aselton: like what are we going to do?

Mark Duplass: No. No. I think that um I I personally feel like there is some strangulation inherent in being that intimate and that close. We've also chosen it. I mean it sounds we're just kind of like, you know, using words at this point, but I think that

Katie Aselton: that's what speaking is.

Mark Duplass: Yeah, we've Let me rephrase. Let me rephrase. I think we're getting into semantics a little bit with this, but to me, um, to be so inherently inshed like this, to compromise so much to make this relationship work for not only you and me, for the for the kids and everything like that, that involves a couple a couple of your limbs getting a little choked off.

Katie Aselton: Sure. But for the greater good. So, I guess it feels like you're still growing to the sun.

Mark Duplass: necessary strangulation, but we I I think we would be dishonest to say that like there aren't moments where at least I can say this and maybe you disagree

Katie Aselton: where you know

Mark Duplass: every now and then I question like wow in order to be in this family in this marriage everything that I do this is quite a bit of compromise am I am I moving too far from some core tenants of myself should I be careful to protect those things you know question this is where maybe where we're different because I look at it and I'm like I am a way better version of myself than I could have ever predicted.

Katie Aselton: Like I had I think much lower expectations of who I was going to become.

Mark Duplass: But I think like Mark I think might have had much higher expectations is what it sounds like. But I had a way I like sort of had an idea of who I was and who I was told and I was and I think I had a different idea of what it was all going to look like, what marriage was going to look like in family and parenting and

Katie Aselton: career and and I I sort of surpassed those things in a way that I I surprised me um and excites me and I'm very proud of. But um I very rarely ever say, "Oh gosh, have I lost where I am?"

Anna Martin: You're like, "Those branches have died, but you're not worried about it is what you're saying."

Katie Aselton: No, I mean because I like the tree that's

Mark Duplass: Yeah.

Katie Aselton: Yeah. It's like bonsai.

Mark Duplass: I don't know if that makes sense, but yeah. I like

Katie Aselton: you. You got to make little trim. It is interesting because we are we're far in the metaphor now. But the thing I want to zoom out and say is I am seeing this communication and practice where actually the thing you said is it's pretty heavy. It's like for the good of the family there's lots of compromises and sacrifices both of you have had to make. Y

Anna Martin: I I said at some point that it it's very instructive to me hearing you two speak. I am currently dating. I'm looking a lot of my my brain is consumed with just the question of how am I going to find this person?

Mark Duplass: I know.

Anna Martin: And when I hear you guys talk, it's like you so found the person. And then when you do that, all of these other questions and fears,

Katie Aselton: it's only the beginning of the question.

Anna Martin: I guess one of my final questions to you is like, so why is it worth it? If all of these other fears come up,

Mark Duplass: right, when you find the one, why what do I have to look forward to?

Katie Aselton: Well, it's 100% worth it. Um, for me, the reason it's worth it is um because I constantly feel like my brain is um pingponging around space looking for meaning about why I'm here. And when you have someone that you deeply love and deeply understands you and loves you, um it's pretty much the only centering force that that makes life truly meaningful in the quotidian daily living. And here's what I would say as like as you're on like the the the hunt, right? You know, um my I can only speak from my own experience and the experience I have is that um Katie opened the back door of that car um and there was something about the way she was, the way she smelled, the way she looked. It was just that was it right there. And then everything else was a decision and work. Everything else from there. And so, you know, I love this old adage of like there there are no really right or wrong decisions. There's a decision and then you make it right. And while that isn't a perfect one toone analogy for relationships, um everything after that big bang that happened with us. I shouldn't have said bang. That really sounds like something else.

Mark Duplass: By the way, did not happen right away.

Katie Aselton: It happened the next night. You didn't

Mark Duplass: for She's like 48 hours. You go wait. make him work for it.

Katie Aselton: Uh be everything beyond that initial um spark I should say. Um really has been a growing together a concerted effort of like making that stuff work and making it the right decision. Um,

Mark Duplass: and I will say it is 100% worth it because like I was saying earlier, to be seen in a way you didn't know was possible and to unlock something in you because of the way this person sees you is what a gift to see me better than I saw myself.

Katie Aselton: And it's so centering having someone who just loves you like you can all it is just your touchstone. You just come back to it and you know everything's going to be okay. It's your fence in the storm that you know as cows are flying by you. You have the post that like holds you.

Mark Duplass: Yeah. You know

Katie Aselton: I know

Mark Duplass: the most the most definitive way I could say it. This is going to sound kind of stupid but we were on the subway last night uh coming home from a magic hour screening and it was a little bit delayed and we were a little tired and you know just that moment where you just kind of want to get in bed and we're

Katie Aselton: a huge dude farted

Mark Duplass: and it was bad. It was bad. Welcome to New York.

Katie Aselton: It was bad. It was It It was bad.

Anna Martin: It was bad. Wow. That Yeah, that sounds really bad.

Mark Duplass: And but for some reason, and we were kind of like crowded on the subway together, so we were like experiencing that like nice little intimacy we have of like having our arms around each other. Um, and I was talking about how excited I was to get back in the bed because when when we go to sleep, I like to put the top of my foot underneath the bottom of Katie's foot and it's very comforting to me and she doesn't like it and I end up like chasing her foot all around the all around the bed. You hate it.

Katie Aselton: I know she hates it. But you don't see it. The foot

Mark Duplass: Yes. You don't hate it because you you would be very sad if that foot wasn't chasing you around the bed so much. And we just in the middle of that huge man fart delayed on the subway. We're just cracking up in our own little shared story that only 25 years of being together can create that little fifom of our love. That is everything to me and I don't know how to get that anywhere else.

Anna Martin: Wow. I think we have to end it there. Katie Mark, thank you so much for this conversation. It was truly a blast.