Danielle Roberts: Just okay. Oh.

Katie Paris: Okay. Easy girl.

Danielle Roberts: Living on the edge big time here. Danielle, say a prayer.

Katie Paris: For me, I think realistically we could be at a point of 3-day work weeks.

Danielle Roberts: You're re-wiring my brain right now. Here we go.

Katie Paris: I'll hug for that one. I'm learning. You're supporting me. Okay.

Danielle Roberts: My name is Danielle Roberts. I'm the anti-career coach and I believe we are a long overdue for workplace reform.

Katie Paris: My name is Katie Paris. I am the founder of Red, Wine and Blue and I think we shouldn't have to choose between helping to take care of our world and taking care of ourselves.

Danielle Roberts: Let's see how much we have in common.

Katie Paris: Yes, we will. Today we're playing idea knockdown. Red blocks are rapid-fire questions and black blocks have questions that go a little deeper. Whoever knocks down the tower will have to do a mystery challenge.

Danielle Roberts: How that feel?

Katie Paris: Nerve-racking.

Katie Paris: Is it possible to stand up for what you believe in and not participate in politics? No, I think standing up for what you believe in means getting involved.

Danielle Roberts: Yeah, 100%. I think sometimes people have like very much a negative perception of what politics means, but I think that if we just accept that we're giving away all of our power. Here, okay. Here we go. What is democracy?

Katie Paris: That's kind of a big question, but the way I think of democracy, it's all of us getting to have a say. All of us having an equal voice. I'm concerned about trends in our own country and around the world on this right now and I think the only way we can actually have a democracy is if we do all actually participate. There she goes.

Danielle Roberts: Do you think one conversation can actually change someone's mind?

Katie Paris: Yes. I'm a believer that language matters and dialogue matters. I had one conversation before and it unearthed something I had never really considered before. It was with a women's reproductive health coach and she described how the 9-5 was never designed with women's bodies in mind and I'd never thought about it that way and how the workplace is not equitable just by design. So, that really opened up an entire different world view for me.

Danielle Roberts: I was going to say yes if there is a trusted relationship already in place. Sometimes we have an expectation of like, oh I can change their mind if I just get my one factor statistic, you know, in there and that's not actually how we're wired as humans. There's got to be that trust um that relationship for I think minds to change on that tougher stuff. So, got to have a little bit of patience with each other.

Katie Paris: Yeah, like are we listening to hear the person or are we just listening to respond? That.

Danielle Roberts: Yeah, that part. Hello. Hello. Okay, I'm doing another black one. Okay.

Katie Paris: We'll keep it keep it going.

Danielle Roberts: to get it. I'm getting the red ones, you're getting the black.

Katie Paris: We'll keep it going. How do you invite people into politics without overwhelming them? I love this one.

Danielle Roberts: This is right for you.

Katie Paris: You keep it personal and you keep it local. It can just feel so overwhelming to think like how can I possibly influence what's going on at the executive level of leadership, but you know what you can absolutely influence is like your town council, your school board and all of those things have so much impact on our day-to-day lives. So, I find that it's not only takes away the overwhelm, but you know, it's sort of the antidote because it's very empowering to work at that level.

Danielle Roberts: Yeah, and even when you impact one person, like that has ripple effects outwards. It like goes into neighboring communities. So, like one conversation locally matters and that's like see that every day. Like working on so many issues.

Katie Paris: Yeah. See, they're so heavy. Sorry, I'm going to drop

Danielle Roberts: Go for it. No, I mean, let's get this let's get this going.

Katie Paris: Is social media good for democracy?

Danielle Roberts: Speaking of. Yes and no. Personally, I worked in social media marketing for 15 years. Having access to more information made me a more informed citizen.

Katie Paris: Yep.

Danielle Roberts: But knowing how these algorithms work and how companies can target you, I think it can also be dangerous. Like whose voices am I not hearing as I am scrolling? Is this a good use of my social media consumption or am I just validating again my own perspectives and opinions? Okay.

Katie Paris: You got a red one?

Danielle Roberts: I got a red one. All right. Is opting out of politics a political choice? Well, hell yeah, it is. The phrase that comes to mind to me is that you may think you don't do politics, but politics will do you. You know? And so, choose to engage, use the power of your vote, the power of your voice, or you can step back, but that doesn't mean you may be opting out, but politics is not opting out of influencing your own life.

Katie Paris: Wobbles. Should the US abolish the 40-hour work week? Quick yes on that.

Danielle Roberts: Okay, let's hear it.

Katie Paris: There have been study after study done all across the globe that the four-day work week actually makes people more productive. It increases retention, so it saves a business money. And with our advancements in technology since the Industrial Revolution more than a century ago, work looks different. We need time back to be able to live our damn lives because we don't just exist to work. I think realistically, we could be at a point of three-day work weeks. So, I think if we can actually create containers in the workplace for more deep thinking rather than just productivity, how much can I get done how fast?

Danielle Roberts: We will actually see people be happier cuz they get to work less and better business outcomes. Oh, this one's loose, but guess what? Look, now that that is dangerous.

Katie Paris: Thanks for the setup.

Danielle Roberts: Yeah, well, you know, keep it moving.

Katie Paris: Is joy a form of resistance? Yes. The whole point of, you know, oppression, I think, is to create this idea that we shouldn't be allowed to be joyful. Joy is not only sustaining in resistance, but it reminds us of what we're fighting for.

Danielle Roberts: Yeah, I love that. You know, we only get this one life, and it's like we should be optimizing toward joy in whatever we can do.

Katie Paris: Yeah. Oh, here we go.

Danielle Roberts: I like the wobbles. I do. Living on the edge.

Katie Paris: Yep.

Danielle Roberts: Do you think most people actually want to connect?

Katie Paris: Absolutely.

Danielle Roberts: Yeah. Belonging is a fundamental human need. Like, we are social creatures, and I think people really just want to feel seen and understood.

Katie Paris: Yeah. And I think that's true regardless of like personality or introvert or extrovert. We need it in different ways. You know, and maybe different amounts of time, but yeah, no question. Just Okay. Oh. Okay. Easy, girl. I'm living on the edge big time here. Danielle, say a prayer.

Danielle Roberts: For me?

Katie Paris: Hello. Can she put it on?

Danielle Roberts: Good job. That was stressful.

Danielle Roberts: Do you feel guilty about resting? Honest answer, yes. Do I know that I should work on that? Is it something I'm working on? Also, yes. I do know that if I'm rested, I've better ideas, I'm a better team member, I'm a better leader. It's something I know for sure and I'm working on it like getting my body to recognize that so I can do it better. Rest is productive.

Katie Paris: Okay, you're re-wiring my brain right now.

Danielle Roberts: We are not programmed to do as much as we do, to work as much as we work. So, like when we are depriving ourselves of rest, our body, our health is going to break down and then we can't show up to do our most important work. And there's, you know, active rest, which is like I'm going to sit and do nothing and sleep. And then there's also restorative rest, which is doing something that brings you joy, like a hobby that is not work-related and that you do not monetize. And getting out in community, right? Being with your people, experiencing their love. So, there are multiple forms of rest and it gives, you know, it makes it makes your work more sustainable. It makes infrastructure for democracy more sustainable.

Katie Paris: You get a hug for that one. I'm learning. You're supporting me. Okay. That was great.

Danielle Roberts: Anti-career coach.

Katie Paris: Yes. Getting wobbly.

Katie Paris: Can young people fix what older generations broke?

Danielle Roberts: Not can, we must.

Katie Paris: I think sometimes what we can see with folks who are maybe, you know, my parents' age and older, especially, is this sense of, well, we did the best we can, but I have so much hope in, you know, Gen Z and so they'll take care of everything. But that actually kind of lets go, I think, of the role that, you know, I don't care if you're in your 70s, 80s, or 90s, or 60s, or 50s, or 20s, whatever. Like, we all have a role to play here. There's so much we can learn from the people who've come before us.

Danielle Roberts: Agreed. And also, older people can learn a lot from younger people. That goes both ways. All right.

Katie Paris: I feel like I should do that lean. Breathe. I'm going to like very carefully take this. Uh is compromise a sign of strength or weakness? It's a sign of strength. But also, only if it is grounded fundamentally in your values. Oh, no. That could have been a really risky choice. Come on. You got this. Slow and easy. I DON'T KNOW.

Danielle Roberts: [gasps]

Katie Paris: I THOUGHT I HAD IT.

Danielle Roberts: I THOUGHT YOU HAD IT, TOO. So good. So good. So good. All right, what's it going What are you going to be doing?

Katie Paris: Ask 10 people to vote on a silly law. If six agree, it is passed. Wait, that's a lot of power. I want to see what you're going to do with this.

Danielle Roberts: So, my law is that every workplace requires a dog. Do you want to help vote to pass my silly law? You have a very small workplace, so your perspective could be interesting. Would one or both of you like to vote to pass my silly law? Have every workplace require a dog?

Voter A: Yes.

Danielle Roberts: Oh. Optional, not required. We got to know.

Voter A: Yes.

Danielle Roberts: Thank you. We are get We are on our way towards six.

Katie Paris: [laughter]

Voter B: I need a dog on a leash. As someone who is deathly allergic to dogs, I sadly can't support that.

Danielle Roberts: Okay, we have a no vote.

Voter B: It's a sad face no, but I like to breathe.

Voter C: Bigger dogs, they're more calm and I like that. But the small dogs, it's just, you know, whatever.

Danielle Roberts: So, it sounds like yes with some stipulations.

Voter C: Definitely yes with stipulations.

Danielle Roberts: Okay. All right. Thank you so much.

Voter C: You're welcome.

Danielle Roberts: Excuse me, ma'am. Do you want to help vote in my silly law?

Voter D: No.

Danielle Roberts: Okay. Do you think that every workplace should require a dog?

Voter E: I think yes. You know, there are people that just have dogs just for a comfort.

Danielle Roberts: we're getting our fourth yes. Thank you so much. Appreciate it.

Voter E: Good luck.

Danielle Roberts: Where are all the people? Okay, so should every workplace require a dog?

Voter F: Absolutely.

Danielle Roberts: Yes. We got our way to six. Your votes are helping me pass my law. I needed six votes out of 10. We made it thanks to you. Appreciate it.

Voter F: Congratulations.