Host: The Canada-United States-Mexico Agreement has been in effect for almost six years now, but relations have been rocky, to say the least, since President Donald Trump started his trade war. Just recently, he warned he'd slap a 100% tariff on Canada if it made a trade deal with China. And he doesn't seem convinced that Canada and Mexico have much to offer. "You know, we don't need cars made in Canada. We don't need cars made in Mexico. We want to make them here." So does he want to keep Kuzma or not? With the three countries heading back to the table to review it, we're going to find out in the coming months whether the largest free trade region in the world has a future. To help break this down, I spoke with Colin Robertson, senior advisor and fellow at the Canadian Global Affairs Institute. He also served on the NAFTA implementation team and Martha Hall Findlay, director of the School of Public Policy at the University of Calgary and former Liberal MP for the riding of Toronto Willowdale. They are both members of Carleton University's Expert Group on Canada-US relations. Colin, Martha, great to have you on the show. How are you both doing?

Colin Robertson: Great. Good to be with you.

Martha Hall Findlay: Thank you. And it's great to be here.

Host: Awesome. Well, let's start off as we know the upcoming CUSMA joint review our talks about changes to the agreement and possibly extending it to 2052. Colin, how does Canada approach these talks if it suspects that the US is negotiating in bad faith?

Colin Robertson: Well, you have to take them seriously, even if we think they're negotiating in bad faith because this agreement accounts for 75% of our exports to the world and about 60% of our imports, it is our preponderant trading relationship. And as you know, we're trying to diversify trade, but this is still the most important market for us. And you can't change geography. And whatever happens, it's still going to be a major market for Canada.

Host: Martha.

Martha Hall Findlay: Slightly different perspective, I think. One, I think it's worth remembering that this was not ever supposed to be a renegotiation. This was just supposed to be a review to determine whether to extend it even further than it otherwise would. Of course, you know, that would open the opportunity to have discussions. But Donald Trump has been treating this as if it isn't the law and it isn't the law of our two countries. And it is. And so the very fact that we're all now accepting that this is going to be renegotiation feels a little bit like we've fallen into their trap. And I would argue this was the deal that Donald Trump the last time around, said was the best deal ever, right. So I think there's a massive challenge in terms of trust. I don't know how much so-called renegotiation is going to get us anything that we can count on. So we have to just be really, really careful. I think, you know, Colin, you and I have both heard this. We must take Donald Trump seriously, but we can't take him literally. But the other part of where I might differ a little bit is, yeah, it's the relationship with the United States, 75% of our exports. But, you know, we had a pretty decent economy before the free trade agreement was signed. We had a pretty good we have great relationships with an awful lot of Americans in different parts of the country. If you recognize that this isn't just an Ottawa-DC thing. Yeah. It's important. It's a really important deal for us. But it's not the end of the world. And I think we have to be really conscious of the fact that Canada, you know, we're not we're not going to live or die on this. And I think if we keep saying that we're almost going to be giving Trump more.

Colin Robertson: More leeway, if you will.

Host: With that being said, Colin, I am curious, you know, if these are just reviews and perhaps not negotiations, some people might feel that is the case and they're curious what are the changes or adjustments that you suspect the US might be looking at?