Chase Hughes: This is how social media starts roping you in. This is how politics starts roping you in. This is how cult leaders will recruit you into a cult. It's the number one way that we influence another human being. Micro compliance. And hypnosis is a great example of this. Like I can have a person laying on the floor unconscious in maybe a minute and a half. And it's very easy to do. But one of the things you'll see me do at the beginning of that is like give me your hand, put both hands out like this, and then flip them over. I make them do like 50 things. None of the things that I just did with them are meaningful. Everything was micro compliance. Use what works for brainwashing because our brains have not developed one more wrinkle in the last 200,000 years. So a regular example of this is novelty. Anything novel hijacks our brain.

Stephen Bartlett: That might just be the most important skill in the world. Chase, the world is changing rapidly with this whole AI thing accelerating. Elon Musk says we'll have 10 billion humanoid robots in the world in the future. In a world where we're going to have all this intelligence, what jobs are going to remain? One of the points of consensus is that human skills, social skills, people skills are going to be of extreme value. You said the thing you like talking about the most is helping people understand how to guide human decision and have great conversations. What does that mean in real specific practical terms?

Chase Hughes: When it comes to influencing human beings, the most important thing is this thing called the PCP model. PCP is a three-step cascade. P is perception. The first step to changing somebody's outcome is to change how you're viewing this situation. When people talk about owning the frame or redefining what a situation means, that is changing the perception. If we're talking about AI, AI can say, "Stephen, I see what you mean, I see why you're frustrated," but then it gives you this layer that makes you say, "this is going deep." It hit the P on the PCP model. The biggest mistake people make is language should be resonating and not directing.

Stephen Bartlett: So if it just given me a new one, I might not have believed it. But because it first acknowledges my point of view before delivering a different one, that's more effective?

Chase Hughes: Yes. After I shift your perception, I change the C, which is context. Context dictates what behavior is permissible. If I can change context to where what I want you to do is just an automatic thing, I can make you do anything. The real skill is just being able to shift perception and context. You can radicalize someone politically just through context. Context gives us the final P, which is permission. If I'm entering into a negotiation and I set a frame right from the beginning, it gives permission to find common ground.

Chase Hughes: I'm a behavior profiler. One of the things I teach is the childhood development triangle. When you're growing up, what did that child have to do most of the time to earn friends, to feel safe, and to get rewards? That tends to get written in childhood and carried into adulthood. 90% of us are walking around with this exact triangle governing our life. If you look at people at work, you see an eight-year-old who got yelled at at a family dinner table. Awareness is what you want.

Stephen Bartlett: Since these survival mechanisms will be with me forever, what do I do if one behavior I've learned is making my life worse?

Chase Hughes: You can't get rid of it. What truly changes for you is hearing a child's voice—a misguided child who developed a coping mechanism. Part two is identity. Identity is the number one thing when it comes to persuasion. I have my clients download the face app that makes you look real obese and put it on the refrigerator. You're creating cognitive dissonance. "I am the kind of person that goes to the gym" is a much more powerful identity-based action.

Chase Hughes: I refer to this as the most dangerous persuasion skill there is. I'm going to put a Lego on the table, and another Lego, but I will never put them together for you. Any idea that you think came from your own mind, you have no ability to resist it. A regular example is the news: "Local woman reported missing. Neighbors said earlier people saw her arguing with her boyfriend. Details after the break." Your brain is like, "I know exactly what happened." They make you feel clever.

Stephen Bartlett: As we head into this AI world, are these skills irreplaceable?

Chase Hughes: Absolutely. AI will never replace the third row of Maslow's hierarchy—belonging. Our brains were not wired to receive digital connection. Number one is making people feel heard and seen and not judging them. It's supposed to be fun. It's supposed to be a game.