I don't want my space to feel like anyone else's space.

I want it to feel just like me and interesting and weird.

And that's how I do it. Whether it's at a thrift store, a vintage store, Facebook Marketplace, even Craigslist in the day.

[Music]

I'm Christine Sir Cleette.

I'm Kyra Blackwell.

I'm Rosie Garin.

And you're listening to the Wire Cutter Show.

[Music]

Hey friends.

>> Hi.

>> I was going to ask y'all a question. Um, but I think I know the answer already, which is, do you like to buy things used and secondhand?

But I'm looking at Christine's water bottle on the desk here, and I know that it's secondhand.

>> For listeners, I have a tequila. I'm probably mispronouncing that name, but it's a really cool water bottle that Wire Cutter recommends.

I found it at Goodwill two weekends ago, brand new, and I got it for like a third of the price I would have paid full price.

>> Bagging shopper,

>> but I think you both know that I buy a lot of used things.

Very, very open to the world of used products.

>> We're a little bit concerned sometimes, but we appreciate that

>> an extent that Yeah. We're we're a little worried.

>> Yeah. Yeah. Cyro, what's your what's your sense?

>> I love to buy used things. cuz I hate buying retail price for anything.

I grew up negotiating for stuff because I was always taught never to buy anything at the price that somebody gives you.

So that's what I do.

>> You know, we at Wire Cutter are in the business of recommending products that people can, you know, easily go online and buy.

But there is a deep passion at Wire Cutter around used products.

And we decided that it would be really awesome to do a big suite of articles around our staff's best strategies for doing this.

So, we just recently published three really big ones about how to buy used furniture, how to buy used clothing, and how to buy used table wear.

So, that's like glassware and plates.

And we got the people on staff who know the most about this to go out and sort of hunt for for the best deals.

Today we're actually going to focus on furnishings with Ivy Lrod.

Ivy is one of Wire Carter's home decor writers and she co-wrote a piece about buying used furniture with another writer on the home decor team, Joshua Lion.

For this article, they both set out with a budget of $1,500. And they had to buy three secondhand items: a couch, a rug, and a lamp.

>> I got to see all the pictures of everything she bought, and I'm Yeah, I want her to come and decorate my my place.

I can't wait to talk to her and I can't wait to figure out how she went about this.

So, when we come back, Ivy on secondhand shopping. We'll be back in a minute.

[Music]

Welcome back. With us now is Ivy Elrod, who is a home decor writer.

And before joining Wire Cutter, she worked as an interior designer.

She also used to own and run her own interior design showroom with furniture and lighting in Nashville.

Fun fact, Ivy was once the youngest Rocket at Radio City.

>> Ivy, we could talk about any of those things throughout this interview. I'm very happy to have you on the show.

>> Oh, I'm really thrilled to be here. Thanks, Ivy.

At the end of the show, will you do some like kicks for us? Some rocket kicks or

>> I am not in costume. We're on the

>> We'll give you We'll give you a pass on that.

Let's Let's actually talk uh a little bit about your history as an interior designer.

I'm curious. We're going to talk about all your best tips for buying used, but I'm very curious about um how you kind of got into this line of work and also what exactly is an interior design showroom?

I think maybe some of us have an inkling, but I'm maybe not quite sure what it is exactly.

Is it for the general public to come in or are were you working more with like specifically with clients?

>> So I'll answer your first question.

I was a performer and my husband also a performer actually he was in blue man group for many years.

>> Yeah.

So we were the only rockhead who married a blue man. Uh

And we moved all the time because you go and do a show and you're back and forth.

And so I had so much hands-on experience changing environments or suiting them to whatever was going on with us, what we needed and what what the space was like.

And when my husband got injured and I was pregnant with our second kid, we had fantasized about doing this business together and we decided to open a design showroom because of our experience with making spaces interesting.

And we decided to open a design showroom because of our experience with making spaces interesting.

Then to answer your next question, a showroom, the real distinguishing thing about a showroom is that you don't walk out with your merchandise.

Uh you go to a showroom to sit in an Aeron chair, look at the table, see the rug samples, and then you order them per your specifications.

So it typically has a higherend clientele because these are items that are being customized.

>> Okay, cool. as you were, you know, helping people decorate their homes, were you integrating used furniture into that or was it mostly new?

>> All the time. Every project I ever worked on, including commercial projects, we would source a vintage or used furniture.

Because I don't like spaces where everything's brand new. It feels like you're in a movie set.

>> So, why buy secondhand in the first place? Why do you think people are motivated to do this? Why were you motivated to do it?

>> The number one reason is saving money.

I do. I think that's the main reason people go for it, myself included.

And what you can get very often is something that's almost brand new and is a fraction of the price.

So there's a practical component, no question.

Aesthetic component. You can find things that aren't anywhere else.

You all of a sudden have a table that no one's seen before and has a bit of that patina.

Finding items that have an interesting provenence or something, you know, that feels exciting.

This is different. I don't see this anywhere.

I don't want my space to feel like anyone else's space.

I want it to feel just like me and interesting and weird and and that's how I do it.

I think that there is circular economy sort of energy.

People really like the idea of something being passed on and not being thrown out and maybe making money in the process.

But lastly, and this is a big thing for me, there's a whole culture around the hunt, around secondhand finds, around the people you engage with.

I meet so many wacky, cool people in the process, whether it's at a thrift store, a vintage store, Facebook Marketplace, even Craigslist in the day, you know,

>> it's much more interesting a process if you have time.

[Music]

I would be intimidated by shopping for furniture secondhand because I don't have a lot of confidence that the pieces the disperate pieces I buy over time even will come together.

So if you don't have that skill set where do you start thinking about it?

>> I like to encourage people to not worry about rules so much and if you love things there's often a way to integrate them.

If you're newer to trying to outfit a space, start with one thing.

And that could be like a wallpaper. It could be the rug has, you know, these colors in it. Whatever.

It doesn't have to be anyone thing. That's first off.

Second of I don't know that buying new would necessarily be so different in what you're describing.

Meaning, how does anyone just approach how to outfit a space?

I suppose the one way is you go in to IKEA and then you just you know sort of controll C andtrlV into a blank space right?

I mean so it's interesting you should ask.

I have a couple tips with regard to seeing things together that scale is always going to be tricky it's tricky even for professionals.

But color and palette and just even like vibe use the sticker function now it's so easy or the cutout function.

Throw everything into a keynote you can even do it on your phone.

I'm old and I don't know how, but I'm told that you can uh like there are lots of other programs you

>> you can do this on your iPhone just in the photos app.

>> Create a collage and put things in space.

That is what I used in this challenge. I put together the pieces.

I almost ended up with this super cool, vibrant 70s shag rug.

And the keynote revealed I was going real retro, which was not my goal.

That's totally reasonable choice, right?

But I was like, I want something a little less like we're going '7s.

By looking at things together, you can start to get a sense.

Okay, these colors look weird together. This makes me feel like I'm like a swinging 70s versus how I want to feel in my house and you can start to hone an eye.

Okay, so you can start to hone an eye.

Okay, so you mentioned this assignment for Wire Cutter. That's why we're here.

describe what you were asked to do because all I know is that you had $1,500 and you were sent out into the world.

>> We did have the criteria of selecting a couch, a rug, and a lamp.

So, I couldn't just do a whole room for 1500, which I absolutely could have done for the record.

>> Absolutely.

I mean, 1500 felt like extravagant and another person would be like 1,500? How could you?

So, you know, I just feel like a couch costs 1,500 these days.

I find that so hard.

>> That's like for a new couch, that's not very much money.

>> No, no, no. Of course.

>> And so that's where it gets exciting if you're willing to.

You have to want to work a little bit or work in a very specific way.

My colleague Josh, he and I said, "Hey, is there a way that you want to differentiate how we're going to go about this?"

I was like, "I think I'd like to try to do a room." And he was like, "Cool. I'm going to do disparate pieces. I'm going to try and fit them in."

He like many of the other writers in the this package much prefer the way of going out into the world and see what's there.

What are what what is this discovery going to feel like? This is like a whole lifestyle, right?

And I am a very busy mom and I'm renovating my house and everything's chaotic.

And I am like, "Hey, I got a mission. I'm going to find it."

Now, that's that doesn't mean I don't go for the discovery too.

It just means that I am vigilant in saying, "Okay, these are my criteria. This is the space, the dimensions. This is the color I'm seeking."

And I can throw it out the window if I'm like, "Oh my god, look at what I found."

And so I I was looking at all these pattern sofas cuz I thought, "Why not? This will be fun."

Like, I don't have a pattern sofa in my home or collection, and I've never even sold one.

So, I was looking at all these, and then I stumbled across this totally different non-pattern sofa, and I was like, "Boom, here we are. This is what we're doing."

Yeah. I mean, I made a challenge for myself that I wanted to create a space where you didn't necessarily know everything was secondhand.

Not because I think that things that look secondhand are bad, but it's another layer of a challenge to be like, hm, really, maybe a little ego in there.

But then, you know, I also personally don't like things to all be of one era.

The lamp I sourced ended up being this postmodern design by Line Rose.

I know the line very well and I know the design of the lamp.

And I'm probably getting ahead of myself here, but I had sourced the sofa first

>> for me. I found this unbelievable sofa from the 70s in its original fabric and I

>> It's so gorgeous. It's like a mustard color. It's is it velvet?

>> She was wearing her original upholstery

>> and fair coin is like the real deal.

>> Real deal. Really? Yeah. like an important designer.

And I found this sofa. I freaked out. It was very cool.

I couldn't believe I got it at the price.

I found it listed for 900. And I had found a comp on Cherish for $6,500.

It had already sold. And I realized it was an estate sale.

Um, my instinct was based on how the picture was sort of spare, but it had some really choice, beautiful pieces in it.

It was an architect who had gone on to assisted living and his uh realtor was getting rid of the last items that he had not sold prior.

And so I got this sofa. To be real, it was very dramatic.

My husband came, he and I both share this affliction with finding things secondhand.

And uh he saw these beautiful speakers in the back, just like a sliver of the speaker in the photo.

And he's like, "I'm coming with you."

>> And he bought those speakers

>> for $100.

Uh, and they weren't even listed, which is often like another tip.

You see something, just say, "Hey, are is this for sale or do you happen to have any more of X?"

Because sometimes I've done that where I'm like, "Actually, yeah, I'll sell you this."

And he actually flipped the speakers cuz we couldn't fit them in our living room.

They're just really big. They're gorgeous.

And he was really angry at our living room for not accommodating them,

but he sold them for $800, you know.

>> Now, that's pro. Sounds like that's kind of part of maybe one of your insider tips is like if you can find a great great place that's selling then like get it all.

Buy the whole thing. I mean if you can She was really looking to clear things.

And so in terms of negotiating she was just like throwing out numbers.

She's like here take it all for 100.

You know what I mean? We weren't even having to ask.

I negotiated the $900 sofa down to 700.

I knew that that was already a good price, but I knew that I had to transport it.

And there was a little bit of staining in one corner. The netting underneath needed to be replaced, whatever.

It was all stuff that it could have been listed for 2,000. It could have been listed for more.

But she immediately agreed. And so I actually purchased the sofa for 700.

[Music]

>> Ivy, I am a person who's addicted to Facebook Marketplace. I just love how good their algorithm is.

Um, and I am kind of a sucker for just haggling, not really knowing what the actual item is worth.

I just know the price that I want to pay for it.

How would you go about navigating that if you're just kind of, you know, you pop in, you see some stuff that you like, maybe you want to haggle a little bit, but like you still get caught up in the whole process of buying secondhand.

>> Well, first of all, I don't love the term haggle.

For me, it's a negotiation, right?

It's a it's a business deal and we're all grown-ups.

Like not being too people pleasery is something that I'm working on in my life.

Um is also just saying like, hey, this is what I have.

People can say no. People can also come back to you and say, you know what, I've thought about it.

Of course, it's disappointing when we lose things.

So, you have to be able to say within yourself, this is my budget. I'm really going to stick to my budget.

And also,

>> if you're going to take the risk, walk away.

>> See how it feels in your body. Are you still thinking about it?

If you're still thinking about things like a day, a week later, that's a pretty strong signal.

When you don't even remember what it was or couldn't really describe it.

>> Yeah.

>> It's a pretty good sign, too, that like she can go.

>> Yeah. Okay.

>> And maybe just don't buy it on impulse.

Like, h this is above my budget, but I really want it. So,

>> I would be a total hypocrite to say never do that.

My colleague ended up buying something that was really special because he came across an item from his childhood and that was really meaningful to him that you never see.

And so while he is actually preaching don't work with impulse purchases too much.

It's emotional. You make choices you regret.

He also acknowledges he did that. Right.

And the cool thing about this circular economy is that you can buy something and resell it.

Oh yeah. you know, and especially if you found it on marketplace, it's not that hard if you're comfortable with doing that.

>> Yeah.

>> If you're someone like me who is generally I'm on a task, you know, if I'm looking for, let's say I am looking for desks for my kids, what's your best strategy for that?

>> The first thing is to be willing to be patient.

Now, that's not always possible. We moved into our house in Brooklyn last year and we brought this beautiful long table.

was so represented hosting and all these great things and it was too big for the room.

And we spent a year and I was just like I need a smaller table but I don't want to.

And so I started looking and I started looking and I started to piece together what exactly I was seeking.

it's a little different than the desks we had a table I don't know if the kids had desks.

depends on what timeline you're working with but the algorithm is a very real thing.

Facebook marketplace you can train it you can teach it by what you save and what you search for.

I mean It is learning what you want and that is precisely how my table showed up after I don't know 3, four, five months of types of searches.

It was a table from my dreams but I didn't even know that it was what I wanted.

It just had all the characteristics of what I was seeking.

>> That's both awesome and creepy.

Um so yes, what you're advising here is okay if you can be be patient and maybe keep going back to the sites that you know new things are going to be popping up on.

Would you take that strategy in person as well? Like go back over and over again.

>> 100%. That's the thing.

That's part of what makes it exciting and infuriating.

This is a limited inventory situation.

One of one very often, right?

And sometimes you lose the thing, but you don't know what's going to be there the next time you go in 24 hours or a week.

And you have to be willing to do that whether it's marketplace or in person.

Just this repetition because it's it's part of how you find the great thing.

Sometimes it just appears, but the repeated search is how the greatest things ultimately land.

>> Where do you think the best things are? Do you find the best things online or do you find them in person?

>> You know, it's funny. People think of marketplace as an online shopping platform.

It It's not to me. It's a hybrid completely because you go in person to buy the thing.

>> Oh yeah.

>> Facebook Marketplace is distinct for me because you can vet the people.

You have either a very localized search or you can make it as big as you want.

It has a critical mass of people that are participating. So there's a wide variety.

And then lastly, you go, you're not just blindly hitting by when you're looking at pictures on whether it's on Facebook Marketplace, Craigslist, eBay, whatever.

Are there things that you look for in a photo that will indicate damage to things? Like how are you approaching the photos?

One of the things that is perhaps counterintuitive is that when people are really disciplined about showing documentation on things that are flaws, it actually engenders trust, right?

And so I'm like, "Okay, they're being thorough. They're not hiding stuff."

Asking for additional photos if there don't appear to be enough.

And how they handle that question is a very helpful tell if something is being misrepresented.

Asking plainly, uh, can you chronicle exactly any imperfections? Are there any defects here?

So much of this has to do with the communication that we're relying on.

I'll always ask for maker tags.

>> Maker tags being like the label on a piece of furniture.

>> Yeah. Sometimes it's a label. Sometimes it's a stamp and that will tell you a great deal about then you can go ahead and like research it.

Sometimes the lamp I purchased actually was void of its maker tag. It had come off.

And I was looking at the tiny little details. My instinct was it was real.

I also looked at what else he had sold. I looked at what else he had listed and I realized this guy probably had purchased all these showroom items.

And that was true. A lot of it is sort of more nuanced than this person is trustworthy. This person is not based on just the photographs.

It also has to do with how you're interacting with the person.

And so when I ask questions, if people are cy giving you one-word answers, I tend to go elsewhere.

You know, if people are very upfront and I always ask, hey, how long have you had this?

Like, this is not just for fancy things.

Part of it is just me asking to get a sort of sense of who I'm interacting with.

In terms of in person, when I'm looking for damage that I have no shame, is I pull off the cushions.

I look at the springs on his sofa. I do a gentle like bounce test.

I'm looking for things that are going to poke up into me. I go underneath the sofa. I look at the frame.

I'll flip things over. I'll ask to plug in a lamp.

All of that is what I'm looking for.

So, just be a sleuth, I'd say.

And like don't be afraid. I think there's a little bit of a barrier.

Sometimes you're like, I don't want to make them think I am not trusting or whatever.

I I just like have to let that go.

>> We just learned a lot. So, I'm going to try and do a quick recap.

It's important to take pictures and create mood boards and clip art and kind of just help yourself visualize your space and all the things that you want put together.

Try to avoid emotional buys if you can, but like worst case scenario, you can always just resell it.

And when you're looking at photos online, it helps if the photos are basically upfront about the item that you're potentially going to buy.

And that kind of tells you that they are being upfront and maybe they're a trustworthy person to engage with.

We're going to take a quick break and when we're back, we're going to talk more about shopping strategies and about Iivey's best tips for negotiating.

Let's say we'll be right back.

[Music]

Welcome back. I want to talk a little bit more about negotiation.

You mentioned earlier that you think haggling is not the right term to use and you did talk about how you like to approach negotiation as sort of like a business strategy.

Get into a business mindset. I am really bad at this.

I feel like I am very intimidated when I go into a store or I'm dealing with somebody online and I've always been a little shy to do this.

What's your best advice about doing this in a way that doesn't come off as rude or inconsiderate or undervaluing the person or, you know, whatever?

>> Yeah. I mean, mainly it comes down to the energy between you and this other person.

As a seller on marketplace, sometimes people just I'll have a listing and they'll be like 150 when the price is listed at 800 or something and that's all they write.

And I'm just like not even going to respond to that. Right?

>> That's that's you as a seller.

>> That's me as a seller. I mean, they can do that and maybe other people it'll work out for, but to me, a lot of this is about interacting with people.

And it's actually one of the things I really enjoy.

So, the language has a lot to do with it. Would you consider this?

I'm working with this budget and this is all I can do. Could we make this work?

Part of it is just being very incredibly polite around it.

Many people only bring cash to these kinds of transactions.

It's sort of a built-in little boundary being like, I have this much. can we do this?

But I do ultimately think it's also remembering that the seller wants to have a deal done too.

And I can say that from authority, even when people have offered me too little, I'm like, "Hey, sorry, that won't work for me. The lowest I can go is this."

But if someone's rude just as a person, they're rude.

If someone's polite and saying, "This is what I've got." I can say, "Sorry, this won't work."

Or I can say, "Well, I can counter because I was working on this very specific budget challenge.

I found these beautiful rugs and this one in particular, it was above budget. I couldn't make it work.

I found a second one I loved. Actually, it turned out even more.

And they said they could do 700. And I said, you know, I I have a very specific budget. I can only do 500.

And he was like, it's worth 3,000. I was like, I know. It's beautiful.

And I'm so sorry. This is all I could do.

Meanwhile, I literally had this budget that was it was a challenge, right?

We walked away. I said, thank you so much. You know, best of luck.

And the next day he came back and was like, "I'd like to do 500."

>> They needed to sell.

>> Do you have any other tips like that to lock in a good deal?

>> I mean, if you're doing something like an estate sale, things may be picked over, but go toward the end, you know?

So, people market at the last hour.

>> Totally. They got to get rid of it.

>> Well, I thought it was the opposite. I thought you go at the beginning like I

>> If you want to find all the stuff that everything's there,

>> but if you want to get the discount,

>> what's your motivation?

>> Yeah, totally. So I mean people don't want to transport stuff back and also estate sales their goal is to clear out.

So if you are knowing that you're toward the end okay this is where it gets men from the boys as they say.

Is that right? I don't think that's right.

>> We say girls from the ladies here.

>> It's like sort of timing. That's the other thing I didn't mention.

A lot of times it's like who's going to get this out of here the fastest.

Oh yeah. So, if I'm saying I can be here in 40 minutes versus the guy that's like, "Can I come on Tuesday?"

Then in 40 minutes, I say, "I can do this amount. Let's do it."

That's how I got the sofa. She had tons of inquiries cuz it was gorgeous, but nobody could get there within the hour.

>> Just beat him to it.

>> Call it a sport and it's really like dramatic, but I get covered in sweat and I'm like, I'm going to move fast and I'm going to like move it.

It really helps. It's like,

>> clear the schedule. Let's

>> We're going to get the sofa.

>> Yeah. I love it.

[Music]

What are some of the more common cons of buying secondhand that maybe people aren't aware of?

The fact that you can't really return anything.

Um, that is stressful.

I'd counter that with just resell it, but you know, some people don't want to get into all that.

Um, I think another con is that there is potential like either disingenuous seller or they just didn't see and you missed that there was damage or something is like much more of a project than you realized.

Um, I think people can be a little afraid if you're working on some of these platforms uh on Craigslist or Facebook to show up, you know, and there's I totally get that the fact that you can vet people.

I tend to always bring someone if someone's coming to me.

I make sure, you know, people are around.

But I research who these people are to the best of, you know, my ability.

But I research who these people are to the best of, you know, my ability.

>> What about um in terms of a con, when you're buying furniture, are you ever concerned about bringing bugs home with you?

>> This is a scary one.

Um yeah, I mean, of course, I mean, there's a couple things you can do for smaller items, textiles and clothing.

People put items in the freezer for 3 days.

So that can kill off moths, for example.

>> You with bed bugs, there are signs typically tiny little specks of residue.

That is another thing you're looking for.

By the way, that doesn't mean it's foolproof.

This is also where it sort of gets into like who am I working with here?

And is it seem like maybe they're hiding something?

Now, people can make mistakes, but it hasn't happened to me yet.

And I have had many experiences. Thank God.

[Music]

I want to know what you should never buy used.

>> So, my colleague wrote a great piece for this package about just stay away from these secondhands.

And I think that they're really smart.

>> All right, lay it on.

>> baby items, not across the board, but the things that have to do with safety, car seats, anything that may be dangerous, such as older bassinets and things where the safety requirements are very stringent, bike helmets, things that you know your survival is contingent on and may have been in an accident.

Then a lot of tech things, power strips, smart home devices, routers, things that are technical and some sporting equipment.

I think that's also the safety thing.

Like she she calls out skis.

You know, some people may just want to stay away from vintage crystal because that all had lead in it, but also it's beautiful.

Of all of your long history of shopping for used furniture, what is the coolest, best thing that you've ever scored?

>> Oh boy, I may have already prefaced this, but the dining table that we recently bought, it was very recent and I had been looking and looking, not really knowing exactly that algorithm served up this table.

It's from an art deco table.

Charles Fister for Baker Furniture.

It has all this gorgeous inlay and I mean it's the heartbeat of our house, right?

Like we do everything at the table and so I get to interact with it all the time.

And I'm like one of the legs isn't great. I have to like mess with the screw. I don't care.

I'm I love this table.

I love this table.

>> That's awesome. I love that.

Well, we're at our final question and the answer might be the same answer that you just gave us, but what's the last thing you bought that you really loved?

>> Oh, what's the last secondhand thing you bought you really loved?

I bought a slew of beautiful mirrors.

Mirrors are a very great thing to source because people need them out.

They're heavy and they're not going to ship them. They're not going to move them.

A lot of times they won't move. And I love a mirror.

I love a mirror for like bringing in light and all.

I actually have a piece coming out about like you don't need a bigger house, you just need more mirrors.

>> people are going to love to hear that.

>> Well, I think it's true.

>> Well, Ivy uh up room Elrod, we are so grateful you stopped by.

Thank you for talking to us about all things secondhand. We appreciate it.

>> Oh, this was such a pleasure. Thank you.

Thanks, Ivy.

>> Thank you.

[Music]

>> Ivy is an absolute delight. I'm obsessed with her.

Yeah, I'm serious. I want her to come and furnish my home for me so I don't have to do it.

>> Yeah.

>> What are you taking away from this episode? I mean, I'm There are a lot of things.

>> I think for me, I had no idea that you could go to estate sales late and maybe snag a good deal cuz people just don't want to transport that stuff back.

Genius. And I just have to remember cuz I am one of those people who will just buy stuff without seeing it.

If I get something that doesn't fit my space or I don't actually like that much, I can always just resell it and it's not a big deal.

That is a great tip. I think that's something that I need to remind myself of.

I am going to do some work on myself and try to cultivate a better negotiation strategy.

I can do it right.

Like I'm going to take her sort of advice of approaching each of these interactions like a business transaction and not feeling sort of so intimidated by it and and just bringing like a good

professional vibe into it.

Yeah. Be nice and it's always worth asking, right?

Yeah. Yeah.

>> My takeaway is so boring and so general, but it's that I feel less intimidated getting into the world of secondhand shopping.

And Ivy just had a lot of great tips of where to go and and how to stay grounded through the process.

So, I was grateful for that.

And if you want to learn more about shopping secondhand, check out our website.

A lot of great pieces up there and Iivey's reporting as well.

And of course, we'll link it in the show notes.

Thank you so much for listening. Talk soon. Bye

>> bye.

The Wire Cutter Show is executive produced by me, Rosie Garin, and produced by Abigail Keel.

Engineering support from Mattie Maziello and Nick Pitman.

Today's episode was mixed by Katherine Anderson.

Original music by Dan Powell, Marian Loausano, Alicia Eup, Rowan Nisto, Katherine Anderson, and Diane Wong.

Cliff Levy is Wire Cutter's deputy publisher and general manager.

Ben Fman is Wire Cutters editor and chief.

>> I'm Kyra Blackwell.

I'm Christine Sir Cleette.

And I'm Rosie Garin. Thank you for listening.

[Music]

You're not supposed to have any lead.

Just a treat. It's got to be under the threshold, right?