Kyra Blackwell: Christine, I am very curious how your new me new year workouts are going.

Christine Sirette: Actually, I'm proud to tell you that because of the interview that we had last year on strength training at home, I have had a little journey of strength training for all of 2025. So now I'm coming into 2026 prepared.

Kyra Blackwell: I have been noticing you're a little bit more muscly, a little bit more ripply. You look strong. Well, I think a lot of people this month, everybody kind of thinks about it in January. What am I doing this year for my fitness?

Christine Sirette: And something that a lot of people don't think about is how they're recovering after their workouts.

Christine Sirette: We're going to start off by talking with Dr. Lita Malik. She is a licensed physical therapist and a spokesperson for the American Physical Therapy Association. and she's going to join us to explain why spending a few minutes after your workout massaging your body, stretching, doing all those things that we kind of know we should do but might rush past, why that's important, what's happening in your body, and she's going to share some simple techniques that you might try after your next workout. She's also the author of a book called The Science of Stretch, which expands on what we're going to talk about today. So, she's got a lot of expertise. Yep, that's right. And then later on the show after the break, we'll bring on Wire Cutter's own fitness gear expert, Seth Burkeman, to get into the tools you can use at home for a quick recovery session. We'll also talk about when it's worth spending more or less on recovery gear. Lita Malik will be with us after the break. See you in a sec.

Dr. Lita Malik: Welcome back. With us now is Dr. Lita Malik. Dr. Malik is a licensed physical therapist who holds a doctorate in physical therapy and is a board-certified sports clinical specialist. She works with a wide range of clients from pro dancers to athletes to people just rehabbing from injuries. Lita, welcome to the show. Thanks for having me. Today we are really focused on talking about recovery. Why it's important to recover after a workout. Lots of people are hitting the gym this month. They're hopefully going to keep doing it all year long, but people might be adopting some new exercises and maybe feeling sore after a workout. So, I just want to throw this first question at you. Why is it important to spend time at the end of a workout doing any kind of recovery work? Recovery work simply just allows you to set aside that time to give your body a chance to slow down after having worked in whatever way you your workout was. Whether it was aerobic or anorobic, so cardio or resistance training, whether it's just a lower intensity movement, static or dynamic stretching, foam rolling, getting into whatever ice bath or sauna or whatever it is, but more so that it just allows that time for muscle recovery. And I think one thing that often gets overlooked is the importance of what happens between workout sessions. I like to tell people that setting aside that recovery time just allows them to structure that accordingly and say, "Okay, so now that my workout's done, I'm going to be doing XYZ for my recovery." Whether that includes something in the gym or maybe you have a routine that night, you're sleeping a little bit earlier, you're drinking whatever hydration beverages, etc. And that's a great point that you make that it's not just about the cool down after your workout. Recovery could encompass your nutrition. It could encompass, you know, your focus on rest and everything.

Christine Sireette: But I do want to go back to that moment or those few moments after a workout. Let's say I went to the gym this morning. I did some weights. I did some jump roping. I just told Kyra because that's what I do several times a week. Obsessed. Um, from a physiological standpoint, what's happening in my body that needs to have some kind of shift before I go on to the next thing?

Dr. Lita Malik: Gosh, your heart is pumping. Your feet have been hitting the ground multiple times in some odd minutes and your nervous system is just you're going right now. There's blood flow going to all your limbs and you're really active in that moment. And so if you don't take time to cool down a little bit and you're going into your full day right afterwards, it's nice to give your body a moment to slow down and find that pace for the rest of the day. Sometimes people can be a little bit rushed and they stack a lot of workouts back to back to back or a busy day and then we run into this overdrive with the whole body. It's not just what's happening in your muscles, but it's your nervous system, too. And I think that plays a role in the whole picture of how well you're going to feel 24 to 48 hours later because half of this recovery game is stress management. So, in those moments after your workout, giving your body a chance to actually take your nervous system and dial it down, heart rate coming down, slower movements, you're doing a little bit of massage with the foam rolling, it just allows everything to relax a little bit more, which I think can be especially helpful, especially if you're in the morning getting a workout and you have to go to a busy workday right afterwards, catch the train, whatever it is. It just allows that to get back to baseline. And when people ask about recovery, it's what can make me feel less fatigued, more energized, less sore, so that my body can recover from that workout I just did and be prepared for the next one I'm about to do.

Christine Sirette: What does a good post-workout recovery routine look like? What should people try to commit to rather than skip if they only have 10 to 15 minutes after they're done with their workout?

Dr. Lita Malik: You could partake in stretching. Stretching is a nice vital part of recovery. It doesn't necessarily need a ton of time. You could choose static stretching. That's what people tend to lean towards because you're not about to do some higher level activity and you can hold that stretch for a little bit longer.

Christine Sirette: What is a static stretch?

Dr. Lita Malik: A static stretch is when you're going to be holding that stretch position for at least 30 seconds. And you can also use foam rolling. Foam rolling is basically another means of similar to what massage can do for the body. Foam rolling can do. So foam rolling can actually make you feel a lot looser in those muscles that you're rolling. It can improve range of motion as well as the static stretching and it helps to just flush some of that exercise induced swelling throughout the muscles and it can make you feel a little bit better too.

Christine Sirette: So I've heard a couple of conflicting things about stretching. Should you stretch before or after your workout?

Dr. Lita Malik: It depends because it depends on what your goals are. Stretching is often used for increasing your range of motion, reducing muscle stiffness or soreness or that sense of tightness that you might feel and then trying to maybe battle some soreness that comes after the workout. So, there is some debate over whether you should hold a static stretch such as that 30 seconds or more or keep it dynamic. A dynamic stretch is one that you're moving in and out of the range of motion and you're keeping the holds under 20 seconds really. So, if I were to do a hamstring stretch and hold it for 30 seconds, that would be a static stretch. If I want to go in and out of it, I would lean in, get the stretch, hold it for maybe 10 seconds, back off, come back, do it again, hold it for 10 seconds. That would now be a dynamic stretch.

Christine Sirette: So, dynamic is a little bit better for before a workout than than static.

Dr. Lita Malik: Correct. Okay, great. Yep. These are like walking toe touches, walking, we call them butt kicks, or you're reaching behind, pulling your foot towards your glute, that kind of thing. So, you're taking that muscle, stretching it real quick, and then bringing it back in.

Christine Sirette: And then after you just stick to static.

Dr. Lita Malik: You can do either. They are both beneficial in that potential to make you feel less sore in those two and a half three days following the exercise. I want to ask you about this term that I think gets kind of thrown around when we talk about foam rolling or any kind of self-massage, self myofascial release. What does that term mean? So myofascial just means muscles and your self massage means that you're doing it. And so with the foam roller, you're using this over muscles, assuming you feel comfortable on one cuz also if you hate it, you're probably not going to get the most benefit out of it and your muscle might tighten up because you you're you're guarding. But ideally, you're getting a muscle and you're you're rolling it over the roller and that is acting like a massage both to the muscle, the nervous system. you're getting that input from the foam roller and that can help reduce muscle tension in the muscle that you're rolling.

Kyra Blackwell: I have kind of a personal vendetta that I would love to get your take on. Um, cold plunges. Whenever I use one, my heart is racing. My muscles are tensing up. I'm having a horrible time. Is that actually like good for a cool down session?

Dr. Lita Malik: I knew this was going to come up. I I I knew it. You know, it might just be that you just really don't like cold punches, and that's a totally normal thing to not like because it's very cold. But it is when we're going from your body's warm, you're getting into an ice bath, your body is going to have to adjust to accommodate that shock. Right now, the the kicker is, is it worth it? Here's what we know. That cold water immersion can help reduce feelings of muscle soreness in that first 48 hours to 72 hours after exercise. This can be helpful when you have another hard workout or competition or game or whatever you have to do right away, which is why we see a lot of the higher level athletes doing it. It also does blunt that inflammatory response that your body uses to build on it when you just did a heavier strength training day or you have that hypertrophy coming after that inflammatory response. So, by doing that cold water immersion right after your strength day, you might be doing yourself a disservice. There's so many other ways to give yourself that I want to feel less sore after today's workout. Is there anything else I can do? Yes, there absolutely is. We have compression. We have foam rolling, gentle stretching, massage, cold water. So, these are all ways that can help you feel less sore and that don't necessarily have to be in a frizzing cold water.

Kyra Blackwell: Well, I appreciate your approval. I'm never getting another cold plunge again. We have to talk about the opposite. What about heat? is a sauna or a hot tub, if you've got access to that, something that's good to do for recovery.

Dr. Lita Malik: When we're looking at these different modalities and figuring out which is, you know, what's the most effective? So, heat and ice are pretty close. The difference is for those immediate, like the first 48 hours right after activity, ice tends to do a little bit better. If you're sore a little bit longer or you feel like your muscles are tense on day three and four, heat tends to do better for that.

Christine Sirette: So, what else could somebody focus on after a workout for optimal recovery? When you've left the gym and you're now thinking about your next meal, you're thinking about the rest that you've gotten. Like, how does that all play into it?

Dr. Lita Malik: You definitely want to replenish hydration. You want to have been drinking your water before your workout, during your workout, and after. Whether you need the electrolytes or not, if you were really sweaty, if it was humid, you want to keep that all on on key. Hydration is a really big portion of it. And making sure you're replenishing both with protein and carbs in your following meals are a big thing. That's going to bring your energy levels back up. That's going to give your muscles what they need to build on the little micro damage that we just did. That was intentional in the exercises to help them regenerate. And you should think about your meals. You should think about, okay, how can I go give my body what it needs now to make the most out of my workout? I'm totally using this as like a self-help hotline at this point.

Christine Sirette: I love it.

Kyra Blackwell: Sorry. I have a tendency to just crash after my workouts. I have to take at least a 30-minute nap because I just feel so drained. Is that because I'm not resting enough just in my regular life or I'm not eating enough or hydrating enough? What am I doing wrong?

Dr. Lita Malik: Man, it could be all of the above. Dang it. Um, I know it it it is hard to say unless you take a, you know, take a step back and you look at everything. But with regards to what we can do to help reduce that feeling of that crash after the workout is eating enough beforehand, getting good restful nights sleep, making sure you're eating enough is a huge portion of making sure you don't crash after the workout. I'm big on making sure you're choosing exercises and completing them at an intensity that doesn't feel depleting. So, making sure they're challenging enough that you can actually complete it without feeling like that was the hardest thing in the world. You're not necessarily hitting failure, but you're getting close, but successful. And between your sets, you are taking your rest breaks because that's going to make a difference, too.

Kyra Blackwell: Yeah, I think I just learned a lot about what I'm doing wrong.

Christine Sirette: Taking notes. Make a checklist.

Dr. Lita Malik: We've talked about a lot. So, I want to just briefly recap sort of the main points that we've talked about. So, overall, it's just important to take a little bit of time at the end of a workout to recover. And that's because you need to de-stress yourself a bit. You need to bring your your nervous system back down. You want to focus at the end of a workout. You can be doing static or dynamic stretching. At the beginning of a workout, you might want to be doing more dynamic stretching or activation. You might want to think about other types of modalities like using compression, self massage on a foam roller, using heat or cold. And then you should think about your nutrition, your hydration, and your rest in terms of sort of the whole recovery package. I've literally like cheering over here like yes, yes, yes. You know, recovery is your chance to take that controlled amount of stress that you just put it through your body through and give it a moment to regulate that to improve your function and come back even stronger for the next workout. It has to be intentional and I think that's when people get the most out of it. Thank you so much.

Christine Sirette: Thank you.

Dr. Lita Malik: Of course. Thank you for having me.

Christine Sirette: Okay, we're going to take a quick break and then when we come back, we're going to be on with Seth Burkeman. He's a fitness writer at Wire Cutter. And since we've already talked about the why of recovery, we're going to get into the details about the tools you can use to actually do that at home or at the gym, whatever you want. So, when we're back, we'll be here with Seth to talk about building a recovery toolkit without spending a fortune. See you soon.

Christine Sirette: Welcome back. We're here with Seth Burkeman, who is a senior staff writer for our fitness team at Wire Cutter, and he has tested all sorts of gear, fitness trackers, running shoes, you name it. He's going to walk us through some simple gear you can invest in to upgrade your post-workout recovery routine. Seth, welcome.

Seth Burkeman: Thanks for having me. Good to see you again.

Christine Sirette: It's good to see you, too. It's great to have you back. We chatted with you last year around this time about weight training and resistance training and all that good stuff. I'm happy to be talking about recovery today. So, Seth, if somebody wanted to build a basic starter kit for all the essential tools needed for a post-workout recovery, what do you recommend?

Seth Burkeman: I think you would first want to start actually with a yoga mat. I think that provides a lot of grounding and the basis for a lot of the post-workout recovery stretching that you might be doing.

Seth Burkeman: Next, I would think about foam rollers. They're great because they come in different various shapes and sizes and densities. And so, you can find a foam roller in particular for targeted recovery. You want to do certain parts of your body. And then optional upgrade. Something you might consider as well is a massage gun for maybe something a little bit more than what a foam roller can provide.

Christine Sirette: Okay. So, let's start with the yoga mat. When we look at your guide, you have yoga mats that can range from $25 to over $100. So, I think everybody knows what a yoga mat is, but maybe people are not quite sure why anybody would spend that much more money. What are you getting out of that?

Seth Burkeman: So, I think if you were looking for just something for recovery only, and that's mainly what you're going to do after your workout, a surface that you can sit on and do yoga, do stretching, do breathing exercises. Our budget pick, the Yoga Accessories Extra Thick Deluxe Yoga Mat, which you mentioned costly around $25, should more than suffice what you're looking for. It's a great mat. You can also use it for more intense activities, but it does provide that that perfect kind of base layer for a simple kind of recovery routine.

Christine Sirette: Yeah, I have that one at home and I've had it.

Kyra Blackwell: I have it, too. I like it. It's good. It's solid.

Seth Burkeman: I mean, you may look for something more expensive or some of our other picks, which do cost a bit more money if you're going to be using the yoga mat for more than just recovery. One of the reasons why the Lululemon Mat has long been a pick for us is it's double-sided. So, it is two surfaces. For example, my personal usage, I use the Lululemon Mat, the top more slick side when I'm doing like HIT exercises where I'm going to be jumping around a lot. Then it has a more sort of softer feel when you want to do more stretching or that kind of workout recovery where you can lay down, immerse your body in kind of the softness, the foamy more section of the yoga mat. Will a more expensive yoga mat last longer?

Seth Burkeman: I think in general when you do pay a bit more for a yoga mat, a more expensive one does come with the reputation that it will last you a bit longer. The materials are a bit stronger. I think for example, I love using the Yoga Accessories mat or budget pick. I do notice a little bit more shedding maybe on that mat.

Kyra Blackwell: I noticed that's why I wanted to know. Okay. I have kind of like the plastic or the rubber or whatever is kind of like peeling off a little bit in spots.

Christine Sirette: Okay. So, we've talked about yoga mats. Let's turn to foam rollers. Why do you use one and what makes one good?

Seth Burkeman: Yeah. Uh foam rollers, you know, when you're looking for that myofacial release, that self-targeting of muscles. Foam rollers come in all different shapes and sizes and are really good for you to be able to determine one how much pressure you can kind of tolerate, but also what gives you that sort of relaxation and adds to that ability to cool down. Those are very beneficial both before and after a workout, whether it be a small one, one with ridges, one that's more so flat.

Kyra Blackwell: because it's essentially like a self massage, right? You're basically massaging your muscles with a foam roller. But

Christine Sirette: then why does it hurt so much?

Kyra Blackwell: Haven't you ever had a massage that hurts? Yeah, sometimes. But I don't It's more fun that way when it's massage, not a foam roller. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Um there are a lot of different densities of foam rollers. I know I've been to the gym where they're so firm they it almost seems like concrete.

Seth Burkeman: It's like a column.

Kyra Blackwell: Yeah. Exactly. And then I have one at home that is softer it feels a little less abrasive, I guess, when I'm using it. Why would you go for one density over another?

Seth Burkeman: I think when it comes to post-workout recovery, you may want to gravitate towards something that's a bit softer in density. I normally use the Gam Restore Total Body Foam Roller that we currently recommend in our guide all the time when I'm recovering from a workout. It's a more softer kind of spongier material to it and so it lets your body sink in a little bit, but you know, when you're rolling on it, whether it be your hamstrings or your hips or your back, you're still getting that pressure. If you think of it almost as having like a hard center core that's surrounded by a more spongy softer material, that's what the Gam roller is like. Some of the other rollers are just pure styrofoamy material all throughout. And so part of that is personal preference and how much you can take and how much of that pressure you want to put on your body.

Christine Sirette: And how much does the Gam cost?

Seth Burkeman: It ranges in price from about $30 to $40 usually. And then it's not technically a foam roller, but it's in our foam roller guide. But something that we've long recommended is the Tiger Tail, which is essentially a bit of a longer plastic rod. It's about 2 feet in length, but it does have a softer center where it's almost like if you think about a lint roller. It doesn't absorb lint, unfortunately. But if you were to roll it, you would hold in both your hands and then the middle part is what you would roll on your body. So, if you think about a rolling pin and when you're rolling out dough, that's the same exact motion that you're using with it against your body as you're massaging those muscles and it doesn't take up as much space. That's something I use a lot and I think is really good for recovery just because it is a bit more adaptable to your body. It's about $40.

Christine Sirette: And so, that's not a foam roller you lay on. It's one that you're just rolling against your body like you're not on the floor laying on it.

Christine Sireette: Okay, so we've talked about yoga mats, we've talked about foam rollers. I want to get into the sexier of these tools, which is a massage gun. You call this an optional one, so maybe you think that it's not a necessity, and I want to get into that. We want to know if they actually work. If you're splurging on this thing, will it do its job? And follow up, can it replace a foam roller?

Seth Burkeman: It's it's you know the studies have been done trying to look into the effectiveness of massage guns and there really isn't a definitive answer of yes or no. Are they beneficial? The biggest benefit you may get out of it is just how does it feel? Do you find it relaxing? And that sort of psychological thing is what a lot of studies or scientists talk about the benefit that people get from massage gun in terms of actual releasing and soothing muscles. It's up in the air whether or not massage guns can provide that. I mean, part of me thinks a lot of people like them because they look cool. I don't know. Part of it could be they are easier to use than actually rolling out or using a Tiger Tail by yourself.

Christine Sirette: Is it better than a foam roller?

Seth Burkeman: I wouldn't definitively say so. I think it may be a bit more accessible. For example, I often use the Theragun Mini, which is one of the picks in our massage gun guide. And even though that one doesn't have the same amplitude or force that a bigger massage gun has, I like that because it can get into certain crevices of the body that are just like underneath my hamstring. It's easier for me to hold the massage gun that way. As if I was using a bigger massage gun that's two, three times the size. Maneuvering that around just certain angles of your body isn't the easiest. But using a smaller massage gun sporadically, I feel does kind of get that targeting that I can't get with a bigger one.

Christine Sirette: Because the Theragun, the regular size one, is kind of the size of like a chunky drill, like a power drill. It's pretty big. So, what is the price difference there? Because I know you said it's accessible, but that's not relating to how much it costs. That's just it's a little bit more approachable than maybe using a foam roller.

Seth Burkeman: Yeah. And so, the Mini retail costs about $220. Oh, that's not cheap.

Kyra Blackwell: Sometimes it's on sale for like $50 off. You'll see. Theragun now costs around 340.

Christine Sirette: That's a lot of money for something that doesn't necessarily have,

Seth Burkeman: right? And so we're right now debating whether or not to keep the Theragun a pick because it costs so much money.

Kyra Blackwell: Done.

Seth Burkeman: Um,

Christine Sirette: you heard it here first.

Seth Burkeman: They do make other the guns same size that are cheaper that don't have as many speeds or don't come with as many attachments. the battery life may be a bit shorter. And so you really have to think about one, how much are you going to use it? How much do I need this one attachment that looks like a ball versus one that looks more like a little nub? You know, if you feel that it gives you the kind of recovery that you want, who's to say to rub anyone of that kind of benefit of it?

Christine Sirette: We also have a $100 recommendation in the guide right now, right? It's like the Maybach or something.

Seth Burkeman: is is recommended and that's a lot less expensive. That gun is pretty heavy. We often test massage guns with our paid tester panel. Paid tester panel includes people with certain physical disabilities, certain body types, and they're really able to give us a unique perspective of some of the challenges or things that they look for in products and really helpful the input and feedback that they give. And they found that the so the handle of the Theragun is like a triangle essentially. So you can grip it from different angles and perspectives. the MiBach just has one handle. And so for some people, whether it be because of grip strength or other reasons, they find it a bit harder to maneuver sometimes. And so that might be a consideration when you're thinking about one massage gun over another. One thing that you might want to consider is I don't know if you know about massage balls.

Kyra Blackwell: Oh, yeah. I've seen these before and my mom's a massage therapist so I have. But you tell us tell us first what they are.

Seth Burkeman: Yeah. Massage balls are essentially, if you think about something the size of a tennis ball or maybe even a bit smaller. Um, they're often used on the back of your neck or they can be used on your legs. And so you're just massaging them essentially against your muscles to give you that same kind of tension, that same kind of relief that a massage gun or a roller, same kind of feeling like a deep tissue massage would, but you're able to one just control it, do it yourself with these two, however many balls you want to use. And they're they're pretty inexpensive. Yeah, my mom is a massage therapist and the cheap hack that she has shown me to do is to either take a massage ball or a tennis ball and put it into a long sock. So, like think of it like a knee high sock and then you can you can press the ball against your back and you're like leaning against the wall and then you can control where the ball lands on your back by pulling the sock up or or letting it go back down. I found it really really helpful. But I found that with the massage balls, they're they tend to be a little more firm than the tennis balls.

Kyra Blackwell: Right. Yeah,

Seth Burkeman: you're right. It's like a very very cheap way to get that sort of targeted massage.

Christine Sirette: Seth, are there any other tools that you would recommend for recovery that we haven't talked about?

Seth Burkeman: One thing people might consider are resistance bands. I know that they're often thought of as actual, you know, during workout tools or things that you might use to warm up, but they are good for kind of targeted stretching exercises, which depending on your workout, you might want to include if you're looking to kind of just get a little extra targeted stretching in a certain area that's been bothering you or you feel like needs a bit more loosening up than other parts of your body, using resistance bands, particularly the mini loop bands, those would be possibly of benefit.

Christine Sirette: Great. It sounds like I've got all of the things that I need to recover at home.

Seth Burkeman: Well, you're a workout pro and we discovered that last year. Okay, Christine.

Christine Sirette: Okay, Seth, we made it to our final question. What's the last thing you bought that you really loved?

Seth Burkeman: I just bought a Nintendo Switch 2.

Kyra Blackwell: HOW DID YOU GET IT? Isn't that just a hot commodity right now?

Seth Burkeman: I think they're like pretty. I don't know where I am.

Christine Sirette: Yeah, I feel like I'm too old to play video games. I've talked with Haley, our video game expert, about this.

Seth Burkeman: I still want to play, but I just can't get into it. But I feel like maybe having the portability of a Switch will help me.

Kyra Blackwell: You're making this sound like it's a job that you have to

Seth Burkeman: I know that's Yeah. And

Christine Sirette: forcing you to play video games.

Kyra Blackwell: What's your game of choice?

Seth Burkeman: There are two games that I'm really looking forward to playing. One is Farming Simulator.

Kyra Blackwell: Okay. Yeah.

Seth Burkeman: And then there's this I believe it's playable. It's It's a Japanese game, but it's like a train. You build like railroads and subways. And so you run this business building railroads.

Kyra Blackwell: Cool.

Christine Sirette: I like this. This sounds fun.

Christine Sirette: Well, Seth, thank you so much. This was great.

Seth Burkeman: Thanks for having me.

Christine Sirette: Kyra, do you feel ready and recovered? Do you feel recovered from this interview? Do you feel ready to recover from your workout?

Kyra Blackwell: so relaxed and so ready to recover.

Christine Sirette: So, what did you take away from both conversations we had?

Kyra Blackwell: Oh, I learned so much actually. I learned that I I don't actually eat before my workout and that's probably what's causing me to crash after the fact.

Christine Sirette: Yeah,

Kyra Blackwell: I always try to avoid eating breakfast because I do eat a lot and it makes me feel sluggish, but I'm just going to just try it and see what happens. Yeah. Um, from Seth, I have kind of taken away that massage guns, while they look cool, aren't maybe worth the splurge. I mean, if you want it, do you, boo, but I I just don't think I'll do that. What I do think I am going to invest in, I currently have the budget pick foam roller, and it's very firm, and I've learned that I can I can branch out and do something softer cuz that one is a little abrasive.

Christine Sirette: Yeah, I love my my foam roller. It's a little bit softer. It's really great for after a workout. Yeah, I now think I understand a little bit better from our first conversation with Lita about why cooling down and recovery is so important. If I don't take that time, there might be some repercussions later in the day. It might be why I'm not feeling so great or maybe I still feel like I'm I'm, you know, life is stressful. I might feel a little bit more stressed. You need to take that time to sort of bring your body back into a state of calm. Yeah. And then in terms of our conversation with Seth, I have wanted to get a pair of some of these massage balls because my mom, like I said, has shown me how to use a lot of these these techniques with a tennis ball, but I want to try it with a little bit of a firmer ball with the um

Kyra Blackwell: Look at you upgrading.

Christine Sirette: Yeah, I'm going to upgrade. My mom will be proud.

Kyra Blackwell: That'll be great.

Christine Sirette: As always, you can find links to the products we recommend today in our show notes or on our website. That's it for us. Until next week, thanks so much for listening. Bye.

Christine Sirette: The Wire Cutter Show is executive produced by Rosie Garin and produced by Abigail Keel. Engineering support from Mattie Maziello and Nick Pitman. Today's episode was mixed by Katherine Anderson. Original music by Dan Powell, Marian Lozano, and Diane Wong. Cliff Levy is Wire Cutter's deputy publisher and general manager. Ben Fman is Wire Cutter's editor-in-chief. I'm Christine Sirette. I'm Kyra Blackwell. Thanks for listening.

Seth Burkeman: I bought the one that came with Mario Kart.

Christine Sirette: Mario Kart. Sad. It's Mario Kart.

Seth Burkeman: Mario. I'm from New Jersey, so like I can't help it.